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General Time To Let Go

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technigirl

Learning
Thanks so much for all the great responses to my previous post. They really got me thinking about my friend, what I can/cannot do for him and for myself, how much I am willing to put up with (or not), etc. I've been doing a lot of thinking about it and it's now been about 3 weeks since he shut me out of his life so suddenly and without explanation. I figure at this point after so long, he's probably not going to come back. I still can't think of anything that happened that should have triggered such an extreme reaction, and it doesn't appear he's going to tell me. So with that there really is nothing I can do.

He is not as terrible as I made him out to be, he definitely has good qualities and this is why I was his friend for so long. I think my frustration was speaking loudly in that post.

That said, I've realized I just need to move on. I did send him the short email a couple of days ago, just basically saying "thinking about you, hope you are well, I'm around if you ever want to talk." That's it. As expected, I got no response. I've now officially done all I can and finally realized that nothing I do or say is going to change this. I feel it's definitely his loss, as I am a good and caring friend (maybe too much, ha). He wanted me to leave him alone, and I am. It does hurt as I think about how close we were and how often we used to talk and the info we shared with each other. Not to mention the vacation, just a few weeks ago, when I stayed with him for a week and had a good time; and then immediately after that, he shuts me out. It's probably one of the strangest and most surreal experiences I've ever had with anyone.

Those are just my thoughts at the moment, I welcome anyone else's thoughts or experiences that you care to share, even if just to commiserate.
 
Hi Technigirl,

I'm glad you reached out for support and advice here on the forums. I think you have made a really wise choice. It's a hard one, and a big loss to be sure - for both of you. You are both losing what sounds like was a good friendship at one point. Or at least it had it's good qualities. It's tough when any relationship ends, especially so abruptly.

I read your previous post. I hope the end of this relationships is also an opportunity for you to not just look at his role in the relationship breakdown, and the role of his PTSD, or just general state of being a real jerk sometimes, but to also look at your role in the relationship too.

It takes two to make a relationship work. Just because someone has PTSD, that doesn't mean that a relationship falling apart is all due to the PTSD or due to the person with PTSD being a jerk.

He asked you not to contact him. And you contacted him anyhow. I get the sense from his other actions (like telling his friend he just needs space) that this may not be the first time that he was trying to get some space, and you didn't respect or understand the boundary.

This time, he said no to any further contact very directly, and based on what you wrote here, instead of not contacting him again, you did contact him. You meant well, but you ignored his very clear and bright boundary. Ignoring boundaries is a really good way to overwhelm and trigger someone with PTSD, and a really good way to be disrespectful to anyone in general. In order for someone to really be able to say yes in a relationship, they have to be able to say no and have it respected. It seems like you have struggled to respect his boundaries, and he has felt overwhelmed and lashed out. Your actions are no excuse for being a jerk, and his being a jerk doesn't make it ok for you to ignore his boundaries. I think your intentions may have been good - but yet your ignoring those boundaries may very well have been a part of what triggered him to completely cut him off.

You didn't just ignore his boundaries, you did it to send a very vague and indirect message that didn't even communicate what you really did need and want. You were not only ignoring what he said he needed - you ignored what you really needed and wanted in your message.

I know that for me as a PTSD sufferer, trauma obliterated all my sense of safety, and boundaries help me regain a level of safety and ability to trust and be vulnerable. If someone really cares about me, it is really hard (impossible?) for me to take that care and compassion in if they also don't respect that my no really does mean no. I also need them to be honest about what they need and want, and not make the relationship all about my needs.

I don't bring this up to make you feel ashamed, but because you seem like a really kind and compassionate person. I don't think it was your intent to trigger or overwhelm him at at all. I hope that maybe by stepping back ad looking at this differently, it will help you show the kindness and compassion you have for people in more effective ways, more in the ways that you want to.

I'm glad you are here reaching out for support. I am glad you are letting him go, as he has been a bit of a jerk to you lately, and I hope you look at your role in the relationship breakdown too.
 
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@Justmehere, your point is well taken and I do agree that I haven't behaved perfectly here. Believe me, I have definitely considered my role in the whole thing. However, I do feel the need to add some context for why I did what I did.

First, there have been many occasions when he's told me he didn't feel like talking or to leave him alone, and 99% of the time I have done so, no questions asked. The couple times that I haven't, this being one of those times, it was because I was so angry that my emotions took over and I just couldn't. This particular argument came on the heels of my trip out there. During that trip, I actually got angry with him at one point and told him that *I* needed some space. Did he give me this? No. He kept talking to me and insisted we should talk it out. Eventually I relented and we did talk, and it was fine. But this gave me the impression that if we had a disagreement, he would be OK with talking it out. Apparently, that is only the case if I am the one who needs space, not the other way around. Double standard if you ask me.

A couple of days before our last conversation, I had asked him something like "How are you" and then he told me "I'm not in the mood for your f***ing shit" and that he wanted to be left alone. I respected that despite the rudeness and stopped talking to him at the time, but I was angry. Then, a couple of days later, I was trying so hard to respect his boundaries; I asked him if he felt like talking, and he responded yes. We talked for a bit and then I mentioned that I noticed he'd been kind of withdrawn and asked if everything was alright. It was at this point the conversation took a turn for the worse. He said a couple of nasty things and THEN told me he wanted me to shut up and stop talking to him. But I was so mad from the nasty things, and from the previous nasty conversation, that I was like no, we need to work this out because I am PISSED. You can't just act like a jerk, then tell the other person to shut up and expect them to just walk away. I totally do respect it if someone nicely asks me for space. He could have said "I'm sorry you're pissed, but I just can't talk right now. I'll contact you back when I'm ready." or something like that. But no, that is not what he did, he indicated he didn't care that I was pissed off, didn't care about my feelings at all in fact. And then he cut me off - he blocked me right in the middle of the conversation, as I was speaking.

Could I have handled things a little better? Probably, but I have feelings too, he is not the only one. I have a right to be angry and respond to the things that were said that weren't nice. I feel that if he were a real friend that truly cared about me, he would have taken his "break" then come back at some point and tried to be decent, at least in some way.

I sent the email for myself, not for him. It was a way for me to get some closure on the whole thing. He broke things off in a cruel manner and apparently is not going to come back, so why I should care anymore about his feelings, I can't imagine. I didn't want to spell out my feelings in that email as that would give him more power. I don't want him to think that he has broken me.
 
First, there have been many occasions when he's told me he didn't feel like talking or to leave him alone, and 99% of the time I have done so, no questions asked. The couple times that I haven't, this being one of those times, it was because I was so angry that my emotions took over and I just couldn't.
We all have times that we screw up with boundaries. That doesn't actually make it ok that we screw up. It's still an act that busted his boundaries. It is part of what probably contributed to him repeatedly asking you for space and feeling overwhelmed by the relationship.

This particular argument came on the heels of my trip out there. During that trip, I actually got angry with him at one point and told him that *I* needed some space. Did he give me this? No.
That's not good for him to do either, I certainly don't condone boundary busting by anyone.

He kept talking to me and insisted we should talk it out. Eventually I relented and we did talk, and it was fine. But this gave me the impression that if we had a disagreement, he would be OK with talking it out. Apparently, that is only the case if I am the one who needs space, not the other way around. Double standard if you ask me.
So he violated your boundaries for space, so therefore, you didn't keep your boundary of having space from him, and you relented. It's hard to keep boundaries with pushy people. He certainly crashed your boundaries.

Then, you decide it's ok for you to bust his boundaries too?

That's not the way to build a healthy relationship. In no way do I condone what he did. However, you can't change him. you can only change you.

I think you need to do some work on how to have and keep your own boundaries, and not give them up, sending the message that your own no doesn't mean anything.

Additionally, I think you need to so some work on realizing that if someone has crashed your boundaries, that doesn't give you grounds to ignore theirs. No means no. Your no needs to really mean no, and his no needs to be something you respect as a real no.

Two wrongs don't make it right what either of you did.

I sent the email for myself, not for him.
Odd, because the way you describe your email, it is all about expressing that you are there for him to talk if he needs to, and you do not communicate any of your needs. It seems like you have made taking care of his needs to be about you - which is a boundary problem. His needs to talk are not yours. That's his. Your needs are yours. His needs and your needs are not the same.

If I got an email like the one you sent, only to find out later on that someone set it for themselves, not my sake, I would feel really awful. I would feel like their offer to talk if I needed to was just a passive aggressive attempt to express their needs, rather than respecting me enough to just tell me what they need and own what they need. That's me.

If you learn to own your own needs, own your own boundaries, and respect the boundaries of others, not try to justify boundary crashing, I think you will have more of the kinds of relationships you want and deserve to have in life.

You both played significant roles in tanking this relationship and I hope you both learn from it. Or you can keep doing what you are doing, justifying pushing another's boundaries and keep being surprised when they feels overwhelmed and cuts off all ties with you.
 
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I hear what you are saying, but honestly, I've never had this problem with anyone else. I've never had anyone cut ties with me because I just wanted to ask how they were doing and was concerned about them. In fact, I can't recall anyone ever cutting ties with me that abruptly before, ever. I've lost friends to the "slow fade", which is more normal and usually means we've just grown apart. That's fine. But I think what he did was cruel and unjustified. Overwhelmed or not, I deserved a little more respect even in the cutting of ties.

What this says to me is that next time I meet someone who says they have PTSD, I should run far away and don't bother to become their friend.
 
Wow.

Thanks for lumping all people with PTSD into one category and saying that you will run from friendship with us.

I don't know what about this relationship ending has to do with PTSD to begin with. PTSD doesn't include being an asshole as part of it's symptom set.

Maybe you should run. We are so very awful - all people with PTSD are just awful jerks. (Sarcasm intended.)
 
I hear what you are saying, but honestly, I've never had this problem with anyone else.
Uh.... I've had "normal" people suddenly block me without reason and never speak to me again. The worst one was my best friend of 6 years. Everything was fine, then everything was not. Should I never be friends with someone who has psychologists for parents again? Who lives in her state? Who is depressed? Female? A writer? See where I'm going?

In my personal experience even if it's difficult at times it has been the other people with more severe mental illness that have been most reliable over time because they get it in their own way, and we make accommodations for each other because we understand.

If you can't discern what was him and what was his diagnosis, and if you're unwilling to look in a future friendship at how the relationship can be managed and better grow/evolve.... That seems like something that is your problem, not something that is a PTSD problem. Most everyone has things you have to work around. PTSD is one of those things. Just like people have house rules that are irritating or horribly misbehaved pets/children or annoying habits that remind you of someone you don't want to be reminded of or just drive you up a wall. With PTSD, if the person isn't far enough along to know what they need and they aren't managing healthily that's going to be a lot harder to work with in any sort of relationship, friendship or otherwise. That's about them and their willingness to do the work, not about the disorder.

Same train of thought- I've known people with chronic physical issues who feed it and let it consume them, I've also known people with horrible conditions who handle it gracefully, ask for and accept help when needed, and try to do everything they can to their fullest capacity. It's not about the lemons. It's about what you do with them.
 
Kefira and Anonymous,

Thanks, you are right. I was feeling a bit defensive and that's why I wrote that. I'm sure it does depend a lot on where the person is in their own healing process, and I should not lump all sufferers together. As it were, my friend is only 3 years out from his deployment, doesn't take his meds or go to counseling, and so I would say is not very far along in the recovery process. I myself have had several bouts of depression, so I tend to try and be more understanding of people with mental illness. In this case it did not work out. I agree that we all have things we need to work around, in fact I was willing to work around my friend's PTSD but he does not want me in his life right now it seems. The whole thing has been quite painful for me.

I will try not to let this affect any future potential relationships and I will try to see each person as they are, PTSD or not.
 
I'm sorry if my comments put you on the defensive.

I'm glad you won't write off friendship with PTSD sufferers as a whole, just like you wouldn't want someone to write off friendship with everyone who has depression.

I hope things get better for you in the future.
 
I think it takes a great deal of maturity, honesty, wisdom, strength, self-sacrificing, kindness, & forgiveness to understand. @amethist calls it 'the patience of a saint & the skin of a rhino". It's got to be worth it, to even try.

Edited to add, you may be surprised around you who already has ptsd, & you don't even know it. For all the reasons others have mentioned above, we don't all appear the same, & are in different places.

Similarly, I say respectfully, anyone can get it at any time- even yourself one day (though God-forbid that ever is the case). As you said with depression, everyone is fighting some battle.

Take care of yourself. :hug:
 
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