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Intimacy and attachment in the therapeutic relationship

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barefoot

MyPTSD Pro
I've posted before here about my therapist/therapy but not for a while. I've been seeing her for three years. I think I've made quite a bit of progress therapeutically over that time, though it has felt like a very slow journey (I have a tendency to be avoidant and, up until about six months or so ago, I spent lots of time in sessions dissociating) and I think I still have quite a way to go. I like her. We get on. We have had a few misunderstandings and ruptures, which I have pretty much lost my mind about at the time! We always managed to work through them and come out the other side in a better position.

At the moment, I'm finding the therapeutic relationship very stressful. I can't pin it on a reason to do with her - it's not anything she's done/not done or anything she's said/not said. She hasn't done anything wrong. I don't know why I am feeling so anxious.

Well...having said that...I think my anxiety is maybe partly due to the fact that I have shared some difficult stuff in recent sessions - months ago, I know I would have dissociated within seconds of sharing it (if I was even able to voice it at all) and I think I am finding it difficult to manage my feelings in sessions now that dissociation isn't swooping in to "save me". I don't remember ever feeling difficult feelings as intensely or for as long as I am now because, before, I would have just checked out. So, I think I am feeling more vulnerable and...undefended...? And that that is jangling the fact that I find intimacy hard because I am sharing stuff, feeling horrible and vulnerable, she is leaning in...and it is spooking me.

One of the main things I find excruciating and confusing is the push/pull. On the one hand, I want to feel connected and "close" to her. On the other, I am really repelled (frightened?) by that idea and try to keep her at a distance. It is confusing.

Anyway, I finally decided to explicitly bring up this whole topic last session. I'd brainstormed some things around it and took that with me for us to look at together. I felt mortified - it was hard to share with her. She started talking again about intimacy "being an edge for me".

And then I was talking about the push/pull. And how I seem to either feel intensely attached to her, which I find unbearable. Or, at the other end of the line, I feel either completely disconnected or I feel angry. And I hate feeling those things too. There doesn't seem to be anything in-between. And I want whatever is in-between because these current feelings at either end of the spectrum are driving me nuts. They feel so painful and confusing.

And at that point she said that she felt that the whole sheet was really about attachment, which has never come up in our sessions before. Or maybe it has and she just hasn't ever named it?

She said the things I am feeling (intensely attached/completely disconnected/angry) are not about her but that they have historical roots around attachment. She asked what I thought. There was nothing in my head...just a blank. I've thought about it since the session. I still can't work out why attachment would be problematic for me.

She asked what I needed in order to feel at the middle point in the spectrum (i.e. in between feeling intensely attached and completely disconnected or angry) and the only thing I could think to say was for it not to feel precarious. But then I couldn't really put any words around what felt precarious now or why or around what I think I need for it not to feel precarious. And then she said that she felt the mid-point on the spectrum was secure attachment. And then my mind just went completely blank again.

We see each other fortnightly and she asked if I could go back next week so we can pick it up again. I said yes. But now I'm panicking a bit about that and am thinking I should be going less often to try to lessen the intensity.

I think what I am most struggling with is the feelings of intense attachment. They feel so alien to me. It makes me feel needy and clingy and pathetic and desperate. And I just don't see myself as that person. I am not like that in any other relationship - I am the opposite....the commitment-phobe, the retreater, the contained one, the keeper of people "over there", the one who goes silent or walks away in an argument, the flake who doesn't keep in touch very well, the one who likes their own space and doesn't like to feel crowded or smothered and who shuts down and pushes away when someone wants to be too close or share too much emotion... And I don't like having needy people around me either. I just don't recognise this clingy, needy person in me and I don't understand where she has come from or why. I just want her to go away!

At the other end of the spectrum, I don't like feeling angry either. Feeling angry makes me feel panicky and upset/teary. I don't even know why I feel angry with her. Though now I am thinking, perhaps I feel angry because I don't like the feelings of attachment?!

So, ultimately, I feel like I want to feel consistently disconnected. I don't want to feel anything towards/about my therapist. Just neutral. But it feels like disconnection with her now mainly happens when I feel angry with her. I feel angry, which is stressful, then I shut down and disconnect. But it feels more of an effort somehow now to be disconnected. More like I am fighting connection rather than just shutting down.

It feels like a total head f*ck because I just don't recognise this me and I don't understand why I'm doing it. It just feels horrible and I don't want it.

I don't really know why I'm posting. It just feels painful and frustrating and upsetting and confusing.

Any ideas about how I move forwards with this?
Should I cancel next week's session and try to create some space and distance? Or is what's happening at the moment somehow progress/a good thing?!

I feel so "ugh!" about the whole thing. I feel very stressed about it.
 
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And then I was talking about the push/pull. And how I seem to either feel intensely attached to her, which I find unbearable. Or, at the other end of the line, I feel either completely disconnected or I feel angry.
This is really common for ambivalent attachment. It is confusing and rather miserable in the middle of it. I can soooo relate with that.

She said the things I am feeling (intensely attached/completely disconnected/angry) are not about her but that they have historical roots around attachment. She asked what I thought. There was nothing in my head...just a blank. I've thought about it since the session. I still can't work out why attachment would be problematic for me.
People even without trauma can develop ambivalent attachment styles. Attachment styles tend to develop in childhood, but can also change for the better (towards earned secure attachment) or worse (preoccupied, avoidant, or a mix of the two - ambivalent attachment.)
And I just don't see myself as that person. I am not like that in any other relationship - I am the opposite....the commitment-phobe, the retreater, the contained one, the keeper of people "over there", the one who goes silent or walks away in an argument,
This is more of an avoidant attachment style. Ambivalent is sometimes an inbetween avoidant and secure attachment, so in a way, it is very much good progress that you are feeling the way you are feeling in therapy with her.
Should I cancel next week's session and try to create some space and distance? Or is what's happening at the moment somehow progress/a good thing?!
No, don't cancel. This is a good thing, even though it feels super awful and confusing. I've been working from avoidant to ambivalent to more secure attachment myself for awhile now. It's confusing but so worth it to work through it. The biggest piece of advice I can offer is to be steady in appointments. Your feelings won't be steady. You may go through a season of wanting to run at times and feel very stressed about closeness other times, and may even feel like you want to be closer other times, but it's just too scary.... this is normal ambivalent attachment stuff. Choose the connection pattern that is steady, paced, and keep letting her know how you are feeling about the therapeutic relationship. There have been times my therapist and I had a few pretty light sessions, in lieu of canceling, because the closeness was too much. I thought that was silly, but it actually helped in a way I can't describe. My therapist said it allowed for "corrective emotional experiences" that helped my brain re-work some things on a very core level. I don't really get it enough to explain it very well, but it did help.

If you do continue to feel a strong desire to space out appointments, back up, or run in any way, go in at least once and talk to your therapist about it and about why. The more she knows, the better she can help over the long haul.
 
I relate to pretty much everything you said. I had times I kept distance but overall just being consistent and feeling like hell was the best decision because it wasn't avoidance. I've come far with that. Recently my t has decided to take a sabbatical and our relationship will be coming to an end soon. With such intense attachment it is incredibly painful but I don't regret any part of the experience. See it through. It may not get better (it never did for me) but talking about it helped. And I feel way better now with developing other relationships. I'm excited to have some that are more give and take and where other people share!
 
Thank you @Justmehere - I feel slightly less like a lunatic having read your post!

This is a good thing, even though it feels super awful and confusing.
A good thing? Really??
It feels horrendous! So intense and confusing and mortifying.

I'm worried that my therapist will think I'm a really clingy, needy client who wants to leap over every boundary she has because I want all these things (what things?!) from her. I would feel so mortified if she thought that. I feel really ashamed :-(

I've been going fortnightly since the start of this year - which was for financial reasons, not anything to do with the work or my progress. If I could have afforded it, I would have stuck to weekly and I was a bit worried that moving to monthly would make me pine (ugh!) more between sessions. But it hasn't. It has actually felt easier and less intense having more space between sessions. But at the moment I feel like, every day I am thinking about therapy/her and looking forward to going to next session because I really want to be there, in her room with her. Not really for anything in particular - just for that, just for sitting there with her. And then I get there and I can't bear it. But I don't even really know what the "it" is that I can't bear. And then I end up feeling annoyed and getting snippy with her or I sit there and disengage and won't be in relationship with her. And then I leave and feel frustrated with myself and then I feel anxious that I've just been a pain in the arse. And then I toggle between aching to go to next session to sit in her room and be with her again and feeling angry with her and fantasising about firing her! It's exhausting. I don't know whether I'm coming or going with it! It feels like being trapped in a vicious cycle.

No, don't cancel.
Part of me is excited about seeing her again next week and not having to wait a fortnight. Another is having a meltdown and drafting a cancellation email to send tomorrow. I don't even know what I'd say next time. I just feel mortified :-(

Thanks @UnicornSightings And I'm sorry to hear that you are going to be without your therapist sooner than you intended. That's tough. I hope you have enough time and opportunity to wrap up the work – and your therapeutic relationship – in a way that works towards positive completion/closure for you.
 
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@barefoot, I think I could have written something so similar to your posts in the past.... I can really really relate. You are not a lunatic.

I went into so many sessions telling my therapist I feel like a freak and like too much and so on...projecting all my thoughts on to her as if they were hers... and she would tell me this is good, this is progress, and I would sit there in a miserable state so confused. I stuck it out because some part of me was so desperate and some part intellectually understood this process of healing attachment issues.... and because I felt that push/pull just enough to keep one foot in the door.

Try to challenge the distorted thoughts that having these feelings is something to be ashamed about. It's not. Feelings are just feelings. You feel this way because you are brave and becoming strong enough to feel this. It's something to be proud about. (When my own therapist told me this, I thought she was nuts. I get it now...)
I'm worried that my therapist will think I'm a really clingy, needy client who wants to leap over every boundary she has because I want all these things (what things?!) from her. I would feel so mortified if she thought that. I feel really ashamed :-(
For what it's worth, you don't strike me that way at all. Not one bit.

Try to not read her mind. I know, I know this is so easy to say, and hard to do.

She knows intimacy is hard for you. She gets that. Instead of trying to guess what she is thinking, tell her that don't want to break your boundaries and about these worries about what she will think.

I told my own therapist for a long time, over and over, that I was scared she would think I was pushing her boundaries, was being too much, I was a pain in the ass, and I was trying to not be - - - until I was able trust that my therapist knew this about me.

My therapist and I set up an agreement that if I even so much as started to cross a boundary, she would tell me and give me a chance to back up. This helped with the anxiety. (The surprising thing for me is that my therapist recently told me that she wished I pushed towards closeness more and trusted her more to manage her own boundaries. Sigh.)

Fantasizing about firing her and being angry at her are ways to claim space, distance, as a way to cope with the distress of closeness. Before giving in to firing her, try to find other ways first to cope with that distress. Excerise, distraction, grounding, etc.

The best way I can explain it is with an exposure therapy model. When someone is working on a fear of flying, they are going to feel like shit at times, especially as they get strong enough to get closer to an airplane. The key is to find a pace of exposure that is enough that the person feels some stress but not totally overwhelmed.

With attachment, part of the work is kinda like that.

With ambivalent attachment, some of the difficulty is that while we need the therapist to help guide that work, it's the very connection to the therapist that is that work!

Use distress tolerance skills as much as you can. One thing I've done is had a folder, and put things about therapy and my therapist in that folder, and then set times of the week/day to journal/think about it, and then put it away the other times. It was like a brain trick to physically close the folder that helped a little to not meltdown all week long.

I also have a folder on my computer that is just for angry emails to fire my therapist - none of which I sent. I gave myself the rule that I had to talk to her in person once and wait 3 days before sending such an email. I told my therapist about this folder, and she said she's wanted to fire her own therapist too... (ha!)

When I felt like I wanted to be closer to my therapist and that freaked me out, and stirred up a ton of stress and fear I would overwhelm her, I instead found other ways to connect to others. It helped me feel like I was spreading out my overly needy self... (I even invited safe people to tell me if I was too much. I dunno if that was a good or bad idea, it oddly led to feedback that I should ask for more. :/ so my thinking was still distorted, but it did help me tolerate feeling "too needy." )

The idea is that over time, as you work with the relatively safe person that is your therapist, you will experience that closeness isn't dangerous. There may be mishaps, but it won't be like when you were enduring trauma. That's the part of corrective emotional experience that changes the brain and changes ambivalent attachment to earned secure attachment. Where this stuff isn't stressful anymore.

There will be times where you will want more than she can provide. That's ok. Totally ok. Nothing to be ashamed about. It will stink to experience that, but you've been through a few bumps and worked it through with her, quite well. I think you can both work through those spots too. Your fight or flight (fire her or run) stress response to being closer to her will begin to lessen. It can even shift towards secure attachment. I'm just now beginning to have moments of the secure attachment, where intimacy feels good without being terrifying or feeling unwanted or overwhelming, and it's pretty cool. Worth it.
 
I've posted before here about my therapist/therapy but not for a while. I've been seeing her for three...
what you are describing (push and pull) sounds like disorganized attachment. It usually occurs in cases where the primary caregiver was also a source of fear. In these cases the child can't decide between getting close to the attachment figure or distancing and so there literally is no solution for the child and they become disorganized.

I would highly recommend sensorimotor psychotherapy as it deals specifically with this issue. look for a therapist on the sensorimotor psychotherapy institute's website that has training with parts approach to trauma treatment. Unfortunately, not all therapists have the skills to untangle the frustration caused by disorganized attachment.
 
Thanks @Justmehere - what you're sharing is really helpful.

Instead of trying to guess what she is thinking, tell her that don't want to break your boundaries and about these worries about what she will think.

We've had some rocky times on a few occasions where she hasn't followed through on some things she has offered/suggested and I have found her inconsistency around those things really difficult and I felt let down. A few times when we've had a conversation around that kind of stuff she has said that maybe I need things from her that she isn't able to give. And each time, I have got super-stressed and frustrated and then very pissed off and I have insisted to her - and really believed this - that I don't want or need whatever she thinks I need and she can't give...I just want her to do what she says she's going to do and, if she can't then do it, to just say so, not to then just ignore it so that it's like she never offered. I don't ever expect anything above and beyond from her - until she offers it! So, my big worry is that if I now start looking all clingy and super-attached, I will be proving her right about those other things. And it will confirm that I was being unreasonable and that I do actually have unrealistic expectations of her. And I still don't think I do. But I think that might now be how it looks.

And I know that I am mind-reading...! It just really bothers me to think that this is somehow going to "prove" that I had no real reason to feel annoyed with her on those other occasions.

Use distress tolerance skills as much as you can.

Ok...I'll have a think about this. Thanks for sharing some of your ideas/tools.

When I felt like I wanted to be closer to my therapist and that freaked me out, and stirred up a ton of stress and fear I would overwhelm her, I instead found other ways to connect to others. It helped me feel like I was spreading out my overly needy self...

The thing is, I just don't feel like this with anyone else. This isn't how I do relationships. I am not needy with anyone. I've been with my partner for almost 20 years and our relationship is very good and very strong. My partner is the needy one! We joke about how opposite we are and about how on earth we ever got together - that she is clingy and always wants to be close and talk about emotional stuff whereas I retreat and am more emotional distant and have always got one foot out the door (metaphorically!) I just don't understand why this is happening at all.

@moozie - thanks for your reply. I don't actually know very much about the different attachment styles (didn't ever think I needed to because I didn't ever think I had an attachment issue!) and my therapist has requested that I don't go on a mad frenzy of reading up on everything I can find before next session. Not sure about disorganised though if it means being afraid of my care-givers. I don't remember ever being afraid of my parents and there wasn't any trauma within my family?
 
So, my big worry is that if I now start looking all clingy and super-attached, I will be proving her right about those other things.
You're doing such good work with her and the feelings your having aren't unusual. I think this bit is where the work might be though because your really talking about trust. Can I trust that if I'm open and honest about how I feel, she'll still accept me, won't think less of me and will still want to work with me. Or will I prove to her that I'm too much.

If you can trust that she will really be there for you, that your needs are ok even if she can't meet those needs you'll be doing so well. I know the hardest work I ever do in therapy is on my feelings about and relationship with my therapist - so bloody hard - but that's where I've seen so much growth.

Go back and keep chipping away, you're doing great.
 
You're doing such good work with her

It's so interesting to me - and rather perplexing! - that you and @Justmehere seem to think I am doing good work. It feels to me that I am making a big mess of things therapy-wise at the moment because of this stuff and that this stuff is really getting in the way of doing good work.

And the thought of flipping things round to think that maybe this relational stuff with her *is* the work?! That feels very stressful.

talking about trust

Yes, maybe. When I get stressed in sessions, I feel very wary of her. Suspicious, even. Even (especially?!) if she is saying kind, supportive, encouraging things. Overall, I would say that I do trust her. But then there is this deep underlying sense of suspicion/wariness/caution. Which I'm guessing must be common for a lot of us here.

And I worry that, if we're going to get into working on the relational stuff, I could say something and she will get defensive about it (as has happened a few times - you may remember the fees debacle months ago?!) When that has happened, I feel that she is angry with me, which I find very stressful and upsetting and which makes me feel like I made a mistake by saying whatever I said to cause that. I don't want to end up having a load of bumpy conversations where we are both getting defensive and when I invariably end up feeling upset and like I made a mistake speaking up.
 
@barefoot have you been sitting in on my therapy sessions? LOL

I can really relate but I think I'm at an earlier stage. Still fighting dissociation - which is such a new and alien concept for me - and we are focussing on stabilisation again as I started having flashbacks in session (no idea what about by the way as my brain coped by forgetting everything).

Definitely the push/pull sounds like disorganised attachment from everything I've read. I understand that feeling. I am fiercely independent. And still resisting my therapist. I think I am quite phobic about attachment. Except towards my dogs and cats. But I do all the care taking for everyone else. Self-care is something I really struggle with. I avoid all that by driving myself into the ground at work and in my hobbies. Working on it.
 
Sorry that you're struggling with this too @MyWillow

Understand what you mean about cats and dogs - I have no problem bonding with animals!

I don't know much about all the different attachment styles and I'm still restraining myself from reading every article and book every written on the subject! Not sure if I will cave on that before my next session!
 
I wouldn't if I were you - attachment theory as it relates to adults is pretty contested and you could find yourself in a pickle trying to work out your attachment style etc etc. The reality is most adults have an insecure attachment style, that in and of itself isn't a huge issue - keep working on the bits you find hardest and you'll not go wrong.
 
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