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Questioning T's experience

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beaneeboo

MyPTSD Pro
I'm very aware this may well be me trying to find flaws in an attempt to sabotage the (new) relationship i have with my T so that i don't have to move forward.

On the otherhand I wonder whether I have a gut feeling which needs listening to. Can be hard when I doubt my compass.

T says he's a trauma T... and has personal experience of dissociation...and certainly he uses language to support this in sessions.. He's been welcoming.. understanding... compassionate in the way he addresses me so far... gives me space and openly says this is my space and I can drive therapy... so this post certainly isn't a criticism about him... more a questioning?

But I'm questioning his experience and wondering whether he's going to be able to handle sessions with me because so far I feel my dissociation makes him feel awkward... and that he doesn't know quite what to do when it happens..

I have dissociated in all my therapy sessions with him (only had a few).. and was open about this at the time... he did his own thing to try to get me grounded and back in the room... which I appreciated but which I felt wasn't massively intuitive for him...(more theoretical than lived experience?) I thought that he felt a bit awkward/ panicked and tried to get me back by bringing my focus back to visual things in the room and talking about random stuff to distract me from what was going on... but actually, trying to get me to talk (which I could physically do but wasn't ready to) just increased the divide I felt of complete panic inside and then putting a mask on to show that I was feeling better... making me feel more distanced from him and like he didn't actually understand dissociation (or my dissociation anyway. I'm aware I shouldn't expect him to understandeverything about my experience. Just that if he has experience of dissociation himself to go more deeply into a plan with me about how to handle it)

I was surprised when in our last session he hadn't brought water into the room when we'd discussed previously how parched I was and how drinking water is a good way to feel grounded (I'm aware i can bring this next time and hopefully will remember to)... and I've let him know that trying to look up is really difficult for me because I need to focus on something up close up - looking around the room is too overwhelming because the room warps ... so asking me to look up as a way to bring me out felt counter intuitive...

I also felt that there wasn't a clear end to the session (I had to ask whether it had finished) and I wasn't yet fully out of dissociation... which he didn't seem to recognise.. so I left feeling triggered/ disconnected and uncontained...

Tell him you'll probably say! But I don't know how. I'm not good at saying what my needs are. And don't want to come across as telling him how to do his job. How would I begin to bring this up without being a nightmare client?
 
so far I feel my dissociation makes him feel awkward... and that he doesn't know quite what to do when it happens..
People who have an issue with pathological dissociation respond to all sorts of different things. Esp. if you and he are new at this, he might NOT know. It sometimes takes some time to figure out what works, what doesn't, and what makes it worse.
trying to get me to talk (which I could physically do but wasn't ready to) just increased the divide I felt of complete panic inside and then putting a mask on to show that I was feeling better... making me feel more distanced from him and like he didn't actually understand dissociation (or my dissociation anyway.
I know you said below you haven't told him, but you really NEED to. It really makes things worse when we start making assumptions about how others feel and think.
I also felt that there wasn't a clear end to the session (I had to ask whether it had finished) and I wasn't yet fully out of dissociation... which he didn't seem to recognise.. so I left feeling triggered/ disconnected and uncontained...

Tell him you'll probably say! But I don't know how.
Why not print this out and give it to him or read it to him?
 
You are aware of your dissociation, are you aware of how to come out of it, or how a trauma t is trained to do it-until you can? If you’re in the drivers seat then back it up and have this discussion. Having you look up, around, name things is grounding techniques he uses to coach you through. At the same time he is aware of your dissociation to a point as a few sessions doesn’t tell him much about what it looks like to you. A few sessions and ask yourself is this typical of you to dissociate so much in a session? If not consider asking it be slowed down and start with safety, building trust. In my early sessions I was also aware that it was too close to leave time when grounding was happening, so I asked for 20 minutes before times up he start the process as he was the timekeeper so to speak. If dissociated I didn’t know how much time we had left. Time’s up is time’s up and here is where the backing up needs to take place if you do not have skills in place to further ground yourself at home then it needs the time in session to be taught, helped with and explored. I liked your description of him at the start. The rest from my experience is pacing, resourcing, trust building. Because of how difficult our work is in session, we need resources for the home base. I have a fairly large toolkit-but it didn’t happen over night and did not all come from my therapist. Sure he gave me things to try but not all of it was useful in the beginning. Telling him what you need is you being on the team with him so that in the end you can shift and give yourself what you need, until then he assists you in bringing the resource into focus so you are less dissociated more present. This happens more and more as you build trust, get to know each other and do it at home as needed. Takes forever. Also some aspects of therapy are take it or leave, without leaving the whole therapist and process.
 
People who have an issue with pathological dissociation respond to all sorts of different things. Esp. if you and he are new at this, he might NOT know. It sometimes takes some time to figure out what works, what doesn't, and what makes it worse.

I know you said below you haven't told him, but you really NEED to. It really makes things worse when we start making assumptions about how others feel and think.

Why not print this out and give it to him or read it to him?
Don't think I could read it to him.. I'm considering emailing him ...

I think I'm probably guilty of assuming what he thinks (or doesn't think)... and maybe this is a bit of work i need to do - to grow up a bit and say 'This is what I think and feel and these are my needs'....

Not sure i should say address that I feel me dissociatimg makes him uncomfortable 🤔... is that blurring lines by making it personal? Should I stick to just stating my needs?

This is new territory for me. Can't do it face to face.
 
I agree with others.

You are both getting to know each other. So he won't know exactly how to respond in a way that helps you. I can understand him wanting you to talk and to make eye contact. My T asks me if I can look at her and if I can speak. Itt a way of staying connected, and being present. Which is counter intuitive for me when I am disassociated and sometimes a battle to do.

Being in therapy is a place to try and express yourself. I know how hard it is to bring these things up. Your worry about how he may react: T's are very used to this. You aren't criticising him, you are expressing yourself. You are letting him get to know you. You are asking questions to get to know him.

It's natural to have doubts and to try and work out if he is safe, and if he can handle you and your trauma. Trust is an earned thing.

I would also add that every time I have thought I have mind read what T's feelings were, I have been wrong. So your thought that he is pancikingband unsure how to respond to you because he can't cope with what you are bringing, could well be very off base. It may be that he is thinking hard how to manage this best, and trying different things whilst he gets to know you.
 
You are aware of your dissociation, are you aware of how to come out of it, or how a trauma t is trained to do it-until you can? If you’re in the drivers seat then back it up and have this discussion. Having you look up, around, name things is grounding techniques he uses to coach you through. At the same time he is aware of your dissociation to a point as a few sessions doesn’t tell him much about what it looks like to you. A few sessions and ask yourself is this typical of you to dissociate so much in a session? If not consider asking it be slowed down and start with safety, building trust. In my early sessions I was also aware that it was too close to leave time when grounding was happening, so I asked for 20 minutes before times up he start the process as he was the timekeeper so to speak. If dissociated I didn’t know how much time we had left. Time’s up is time’s up and here is where the backing up needs to take place if you do not have skills in place to further ground yourself at home then it needs the time in session to be taught, helped with and explored. I liked your description of him at the start. The rest from my experience is pacing, resourcing, trust building. Because of how difficult our work is in session, we need resources for the home base. I have a fairly large toolkit-but it didn’t happen over night and did not all come from my therapist. Sure he gave me things to try but not all of it was useful in the beginning. Telling him what you need is you being on the team with him so that in the end you can shift and give yourself what you need, until then he assists you in bringing the resource into focus so you are less dissociated more present. This happens more and more as you build trust, get to know each other and do it at home as needed. Takes forever. Also some aspects of therapy are take it or leave, without leaving the whole therapist and process.
Thanks Teamwork... I am aware of my dissociation... I feel like what I need to do is not possible in the room (and too difficult. Slowly focus on where my body is in relation to things around me, rub my legs and actually get up and walk around. But I'm too frozen to do any of that).

That's a really good idea about asking to focus on grounding 20 mins before session ends... my sesh is only 50 mins so there's an element of me feeling that I don't get enough time to address things through talking... but I think never the less i should say to him no more questions after this time...

I think I'm so used to dissociation that I have a parallel experience of 'this is really hard versus 'here we go again... I'm actually frustrated it happens and it's me who wants to push through things in session to make session time...I actively want to tell him about things which I'm not ready to tell him... to get it out in the room and not go through the process of finding it so difficult to tell him (which annoys me)... but then going fast makes me dissociate and start questioning the process - questioning him.

Guess I need to take more responsibility

Thank you for sharing what you have.. it's been really useful
 
I agree with others.

You are both getting to know each other. So he won't know exactly how to respond in a way that helps you. I can understand him wanting you to talk and to make eye contact. My T asks me if I can look at her and if I can speak. Itt a way of staying connected, and being present. Which is counter intuitive for me when I am disassociated and sometimes a battle to do.

Being in therapy is a place to try and express yourself. I know how hard it is to bring these things up. Your worry about how he may react: T's are very used to this. You aren't criticising him, you are expressing yourself. You are letting him get to know you. You are asking questions to get to know him.

It's natural to have doubts and to try and work out if he is safe, and if he can handle you and your trauma. Trust is an earned thing.

I would also add that every time I have thought I have mind read what T's feelings were, I have been wrong. So your thought that he is pancikingband unsure how to respond to you because he can't cope with what you are bringing, could well be very off base. It may be that he is thinking hard how to manage this best, and trying different things whilst he gets to know you.
Thanks Movingforward10... yes I think you're right it's the counterintuitive thing of needing to look up when it really doesn't feel OK to in that moment... but you're al right i need to share with him what my experience is and then let him decide what to do with that info... I can see now that my mistrust comes up very quickly before I've openly communicated about my needs/ side of things... which is something I do in the outside world..I need to get better at that...

'you aren't criticising him you're expressing yourself...' ... this is interesting...a new concept... not sure i know the difference between the two so this is useful for me to think about

I do accept i may be completely off base with my assumptions about him. ..

would you (anyone reading) actually ask or highlight these thoughts e.g i have the impression that its too much / I'm too much for you when I dissociate...does it make you feel panicked when I dissociate?'

Or 🤔
 
would you (anyone reading) actually ask or highlight these thoughts e.g i have v the impression that its too much / I'm too much when for you when I dissociate...does it make you feel panicked when I dissociate?'
I think that is a great thing to say and ask.
A T will explore this all with you. And really welcome this conversation. It leads to healing!
I have said to my T I feel I am too much for her. She reassures me, I'm not. I don't believe her, as I then decide she misunderstands the depths of what I am saying. Cycle repeats.
What helps is exploring what is underneath the feelings of being too much for her. What is driving this insecurity.
So your T may offer reassurance and probe the meaning behind your question.
 
I think that is a great thing to say and ask.
A T will explore this all with you. And really welcome this conversation. It leads to healing!
I have said to my T I feel I am too much for her. She reassures me, I'm not. I don't believe her, as I then decide she misunderstands the depths of what I am saying. Cycle repeats.
What helps is exploring what is underneath the feelings of being too much for her. What is driving this insecurity.
So your T may offer reassurance and probe the meaning behind your question.
Oh wow... so that's actually a question which could be asked 😳... OK... now I just need to build up the courage to ask it... can't do that face to face so will ask him if it's ok to email...

This cycle you've pointed out in your own therapy is one i can relate to from past therapies ... so I guess building the space to be curious about what comes up is where its at... the part of me driving alot of this mistrust is not going to like me trying to work with T to create this space at all!

So helpful what you've pointed out thank you 😊
 
So I emailed. He said if I email anything he'll have to delete it because of data protection...

He was clear about his boundaries.. said i can bring stuff in writing in session time.

I feel embarrassed and just really tearful. I'm working and trying to hold it together. I really wanted somewhere to park the difficult stuff. Not just park but have someone hold it. It's such a lonely experience dealing with parts on my own. I didn't expect him to support me between sessions just hoped to add to the strategies of communicating safely.

I don't know if I can go back now
 
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You didn't do anything wrong. You tested a boundary - one I'm not sure you were even aware existed. I guaranteed that therapist has much greater boundaries tested all the time. It's natural to feel embarrassed, but to me it's not something worth ending therapy over.

I'm sure when you apologize at your next session, your T will tell you it's not a big deal. But it IS a good example of holding boundaries, which so many of us with PTSD struggle with.
 
Oh the email between sessions thing! Many a page in my diary about this emotional saga!

Many T's don't allow email between sessions, or have strict rules about when they do and how they will respond.

You didn't do anything wrong.
.but, it's really good to know what his boundaires are with it.

I take positives from your email and his response though:
You were brave and did something outside your comfort zone.
He read your email.
He responded.
He provided a reason (your data safety) for why he would delete it (so whilst it doesn't feel like it, it is care about you).
And he provided a way for you to share things in writing if you can't use words.


So , nothing about that tells me that what you did wrong. So no need to feel shame. And that your response is linked to all the past?

This is all ok.
.so easy for me to say, as JHC I have had the feelings you are currently having so so so so many times. Horrible! But it is actually all ok.
 
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