Views on boycotting - Can you admire the work of someone who did something bad? Can you separate personal from business?

RubyBlue

Policy Enforcement
I would like to know peoples views on cancel culture/boycotting/etc when a company (or person) does not adhere to your beliefs. There have been a lot of examples over the years of course, and right now that’s happening with the BLM movement. If a company does not put out a statement, they face backlash and such. I don’t want to argue about this particular movement.

Instead, I learned that a person in my favorite industry publicly defended a convicted child rapist. I don’t want to go into names or even which industry because I don’t want to influence anyone on anything. This particular bit of information hit hard because of my own history with CSA and it’s given abhorrent nature. Part of me is now colored by the information so when I view this persons work- I’m entrenched in thoughts of what a vile person they must be. But I can’t help but still admire the level of skill and artistry this person possesses and their history of paving a pathway for women in this industry.

I’m torn. And I feel sick about it. Can you admire the work of someone who did something bad? Can you separate personal from business? Can you forgive one because the other is so awesome? Like is there some imaginary checks and balances where well that action cost them 10 points but this other action gained them 20 so they are overall “good”?

Having a bit of a moral/existential crisis and I don’t like this pit of ugly feelings welling up.
 

Movingforward10

MyPTSD Pro
I can't answer this as I struggle on this for so many reasons. I want to be 'good' and support their victims/survivors. But equally I find myself watching their films or listening to their music before I realise it. Then I have internal words with myself. Then that goes all to all sorts of narratives for me (things like: too many sexually violent men, they are everywhere, nothing and no one is safe. And then my thoughts spiral).

So, I can't answer your question as as a CSA survivor too, I can't get my head straight on it.

So thanks for asking and I hope I learn from other people's responses to you!
 

Ronin

MyPTSD Pro
If I subscribed to the cancel culture notions, I couldn't learn from say Mohatma Gandhi.

Who was a wife beater in his personal life.

People simply aren't black and white... It's alright to appreciate some aspects and condemn the rest. That's not agreeing with them.

I find that notion one IS agreeing or supporting heiniousness by any participation seriously manipulative and unnecessarily extremist... as well as missing the point.

I'd rather read and keep tabs on views of a convicted pedo than have an angry mob dictate me what to even think, but maybe that's just me and way longer trauma with thought control than I've had with very early CSA talking ;)
 

Changing4Best

MyPTSD Pro
I don't have a TV, so I don't have these kinds of inner struggles. I have no clue who is making such public statements or what companies are being boycotted. So, I am at peace. This may be bad in many people's opinions, but it is what it takes for me to survive.
 

Strangelongtrip

MyPTSD Pro
There’s certain things I have to quit, because supporting these people is against what I believe in and I can no longer enjoy it. If someone is found doing assault, rape, battery, etc or hate crimes from race or sexuality or any other factor, I feel ill supporting them. But that’s also just me, I feel like my money talks and I’d rather support the people they harmed. There’s an artist I love who was raped and abused by an artist my abuser used to listen to. I support her any way I can because one, her music is incredible and two, it feels like I’m taking back part of myself.

And I’m also a hypocrite bc I still order things from a big subscription service ordering place (you know the one lol) but idk, I make sure I use their donation feature so my order does something good.

But I also don’t believe in cancel culture for mistakes people learned from. We’re all growing and learning. We’ve all done cringe things we have to unlearn. I don’t believe that if a company puts out a BLM statement it means anything, and I’m not gonna cancel a company if it doesn’t do performative gestures. I would rather support companies and people who do good, but sometimes they get it wrong. People aren’t perfect.
 

whiteraven

MyPTSD Pro
People simply aren't black and white

This is the critical thing for me. Sometimes I wish I could see people as all one thing or all another. But even with people whose behavior I loathe, I can't help but ask, "What made them that way?" and more importantly, "How are they suffering?"

I don't often share that because it's grossly unpopular and I would rather just not deal with the controversy.

I think it's one of the reasons I am mostly at peace with the people that harmed me.

A huge example that often gets threatening responses (ironically): the 9/11 hijackers. We did a memorial service at our church in 2003 and I was asked to represent the pagan group. I wrote a poem about bearing witness and in it, I mused over what the hijackers might have been feeling before and during their attacks. In my view, people do bad things as a response to their own suffering. I don't believe in evil as a thing; to me, that is just a way to write-off people we don't want to deal with.
 

grit

MyPTSD Pro
I look at this two ways:
Am I perfect? Nooooooo so do I have the right for expecting perfection of others? Nooooo
And
The other one.... I was really pissed off when House Of Cards was canceled.... But I do understand and emphatize with his victims.

But I also still feel loius c k cause he was just a jerk... In a way I do not feel the same about woody....

I give myself complexity to allow others the same....
But yet I can t separate the man from the madness in trump!!!!

Complicated world!
 

Tornadic Thoughts

MyPTSD Pro
I feel that I can (finally) separate and admire/acknowledge, within cell-ph, someone's work from afar without directly connecting monetary or other energies into the mix. Every time I give something my attention in any form, I'm creating an energetic cord. I can choose to either strengthen or cut that cord at any time.

In many instances, so many things are so deeply intertwined and interconnected that it would become a full-time job, and then some, trying to thoroughly assess how and if things are truly connected. Been there, done that. My sanity and health is more valuable to me than trying to prove how wrong something or someone else is.
 

Teasel

MyPTSD Pro
Having had similar difficulties in the past I'm now at a place, maybe not resolved, but where I can again appreciate some of the beauty of some works of art by people who were abusive.

I'm not completely nor nearly over what those abusive people did. And the beauty of their work is tainted by the ugliness of their actions.

But I can somewhat appreciate that people are complex. Not black or white. Something like that.

As I say I'm not resolved on the issue and may change my mind in the future I don't know.
 

Mach123

MyPTSD Pro
I would like to know peoples views on cancel culture/boycotting/etc when a company (or person) does not adhere to your beliefs. There have been a lot of examples over the years of course, and right now that’s happening with the BLM movement. If a company does not put out a statement, they face backlash and such. I don’t want to argue about this particular movement.

Instead, I learned that a person in my favorite industry publicly defended a convicted child rapist. I don’t want to go into names or even which industry because I don’t want to influence anyone on anything. This particular bit of information hit hard because of my own history with CSA and it’s given abhorrent nature. Part of me is now colored by the information so when I view this persons work- I’m entrenched in thoughts of what a vile person they must be. But I can’t help but still admire the level of skill and artistry this person possesses and their history of paving a pathway for women in this industry.

I’m torn. And I feel sick about it. Can you admire the work of someone who did something bad? Can you separate personal from business? Can you forgive one because the other is so awesome? Like is there some imaginary checks and balances where well that action cost them 10 points but this other action gained them 20 so they are overall “good”?

Having a bit of a moral/existential crisis and I don’t like this pit of ugly feelings welling up.

This brings up multiple issues but I call it being binary. Or that’s what my therapist calls it. I’m like “It’s yes or no, there’s no middle ground or grey area here”. She just shakes her head at me.

One of my first therapists asked me something once and she looked at me struggling and laughed, so much love and compassion, and she said “You’re conflicted about this like you are about everything”.

I look at it now as the parts trying to reconcile. Something from the disassociation. How can I be like this when I’m like that? How can I be like that when I’m like this? It’s like it just won’t add up.

So what do I do? I try to do the right thing. What’s that mean? I’m not always so sure.
 

Mee

MyPTSD Pro
Cancel culture is not ok for me - in itself it causes harm - and yet - my hypocrisy is revealed because I totally abandon and find such situations untenable. The music and books and films - and entire genres I cannot enjoy because of my changed views of people - but more importantly perhaps - my views on whether whole perspectives held by tranches of society AND in my past ME are STILL damaging others.

working through the issue with myself I often find it’s not that the thing is triggering as such or I have ‘cancelled’ it’s that the bad taste left is such that the purpose of that form of entertainment/ purchase is no longer feasible.

I’m super up for good debates and discussion- but if the idea is to kick back and enjoy - that’s not going to happen. So while my morality is against cancel culture - it’s something I have to work through emotionally and frankly - on a non personal basis - it’s not my priority right now.
min my personal life I would like to become more contained . i think my containment would solve issues I have in this regard of personal ‘cancelling’ .

I thoroughly believe in the ability to grow and learn . I don’t believe in forgiving willy nilly. But if people make amends - restorative measures - and learn - they do more than most and should not only not be cancelled but that aspect of them should be something we strive to be like.
 

Sideways

Sponsor
There's people that I've learned stuff about, and as a consequence, I've elected not to listen to their music/watch movies that they're in/etc.

I dislike labelling that as 'cancel culture'. I don't have some kind of hard line where anyone with an imperfect past gets kicked to the kerb. No one has told me which offences are unacceptable to me personally, and which aren't.

It's perfectly okay to make personal decisions about these things. That doesn't mean you've been sucked into some kind of 'cancel culture', it simply means that you think for yourself, you have your own set of personal values, and you're comfortable making decisions for yourself about what you consume, spend your money on, and engage with.

I like the idea that people are encouraged to think about their values, and allow those values to influence (or not) the way they spend their time.

Easy example? No one told me to stop watching The Cosby Show. But, if it came on tv? I'd change channels. Not because my brain has been sucked into a vacuum fad of 'cancel culture', but because that's a choice I made for me based on my values, and I'm fortunate to live in a society where I'm allowed to choose what I do, and don't, watch on tv.

'Cancel culture' makes it all sound incredibly ominous. But, 'think for yourself' is a good idea, right?
 
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