News Hooray! Osama Bin Laden Is Dead!!!!

[Heather]

We, meaning the United States had to get Bin Laden.... he taunted us for the past 10 yrs. Mocked us. stating that we would never find him.

Maybe we are a country with an Eye for an Eye mentality but when you order an attack that kills over 3,000 people. INNOCENT people. What do you expect our government to do? Sit idly by? Do nothing? I personally know people that have lost loved one's and it breaks my heart to see the anguish that they live with to this day.

I have a friend that worked in NYC. She saw the 2nd plane hit the WTC. She said the boom was deafening and the heat from the jet fuel exploding/ she couldn't get over the heat..... She couldn't get out of the city. All trains/buses/subways/taxi's/cars... No one was allowed in or out. She had to walk over one of the bridges into New Jersey. She was missing for over 10 hours before she could call her family. They were in a panic not knowing if she was dead or alive. After that she couldn't get on the subway to go to work. She was having full blown panic attacks. 2 months later, her and her husband moved out of the city to Connecticut. It still affects her to this day.

So, we can all go back and fourth and around and around. But when you are right there when it's happening it takes on a whole different meaning.

 

[femaleveteran]

After reading all of these posts I am convinced of only a few things....one that George W. bush sent countless US servicemembers off to either die or get maimed for absolutely no reason other than his own need to go down in history as a wartime president...especially when Saddam Hussein had nothing to do with 9-11 at all, Osama Bin Laden was a bad bad man and however he got killed, it was bound to happen, if not from forces of the USA then from someone else looking to collect the bounty on his head....and lastly, I am convinced that he was NOT a Muslim leader at all. He was a mass murderer of Muslims just like Obama said and no matter how anyone wants to spin it, the world is a better place without him. I wish I did not have to go to Iraq in order to get Saddam when Saddam had nothing to do with any of it but at the same time I did my job ( do not take that as me saying I am proud of being there or anything like that....I have serious problems with my service in that country) and I can say that the Navy SeAl's did their job. What is that old saying "Theirs is not to question why....theirs is but to do or die". When you are a soldier you are not taught to think much beyond that scope of reasoning and if you do think much beyond that then you better keep it to yourself, especially in a post 9-11 military where to question anything at all means you are anti-American and that you should be investigated by the patriot act people.

Anyway that is what I have learned from all this debate. I just wish the world could learn to sit down as adults someday and talk to one another with reason and compassion....but since that wil never happen then I guess we are stuck with having to hear about things like this taking place, things like 9-11 happening, etc.....but we can always hope that things will be different someday i guess.

 

[anthony]

I agree... the world is a better place without him... and I would go one step further, they need to knock of many more of these nutjobs left that are still roaming the globe. Kill them all, kill their offspring if needed to stop the family traditions... end the issue as much as possible. Let muslims who are just muslims live without persecution, let all those who have severely skewed the Koran to suit themselves and justify killing innocent people, left to die.

 

[femaleveteran]

Those are the worst casualties of all this crap...the good mulims who love their faith and who have not perverted the Koran and want just what the rest of us want....to worship their God as they see fit without interference from others. those are the living victims of people like Bin Laden and all his crazy followers.

 

[ms spock]

God bless the "sheep dogs" on the airliner that was headed for DC....but didn't get there because common citizens decided to become "sheep dogs"

Those people were absolutely extraordinary. I can only hope that I would be as half as brave in such a situation. Well actually I have defended my family many times when my father tried to off them so yes - it is exhausting bravery.

I think when we give up our constitutions we give up our democracy. I respect your opinion but I don't agree.

ms spock

 

[ms spock]

After reading all of these posts I am convinced of only a few things....one that George W. bush sent countless US servicemembers off to either die or get maimed for absolutely no reason other than his own need to go down in history as a wartime president...especially when Saddam Hussein had nothing to do with 9-11 at all

It was interesting how he was looking like a right idiot with the spy plane in China debacle. It is well known in intelligence community circles that Saddam Hussein and Osama Bin Laden hated each other more than they hated anyone else.

Losing the rule of law or failing to respect international laws, the Geneva convention etc et al means we have become the people we most feared. And I think that is very sad. The implications of that are so huge.

Osama Bin Laden had pretty much lost his position amongst the crazies because he had not delivered on his promises to get rid of certain Arab leaders. So all this resurrects what was dying off.

In the two weeks after 9/11 I read in our local Sydney Morning Herald that the Christians had massacred 8,000 Muslims - it wasn't a headline, it wasn't on the front page, it was in a small paragraph on the side of the page to the back of the newspaper.

Everyone has lost out, on so many levels.

And it is annoying that if you question you are shut down with its not patriotic, it might upset the veterans, it doesn't fit my nationalistic zeal, you must be evil to think differently from me.

We cannot take the moral high ground when we inflict the same acts of terror that have been inflicted on us. Democracy and the rule of law are not just available to the white, squeaky clean, popular, celebrity people. Either we follow our principles or we don't. And we haven't - so we look like barbaric hypocrites. But wait until I will get lynched for not toeing the party line.

If the shoe was on the other foot, and someone killed George W Bush or Barrack Obama, unarmed in the White house and then we saw crowds vibrating with jubilation and happiness, then we would see those people as barbaric.

4 million Iraqi children died because of the left overs from the 1st Iraqi war to then next one if my doctor friends are right. It is not just American or Australian or Canadian or British deaths that should matter it is all people dying that matters.

And there was one who once said what you do to the least of my brothers, you do until me... so I don't see how what we have done fits with that either.

It is a scary time to be a political activist in Australia.

ms spock

 

[ronin47]

“I mourn the loss of thousands of precious lives, but I will not rejoice in the death of one, not even an enemy. Returning hate for hate multiplies hate, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness: only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate: only love can do that.”
— Martin Luther King, Jr.

Killing someone is no badge of honor, even if it is an "evil" person that you've killed.

 

[mysihba]

"Killing someone is no badge of honor, even if it is an "evil" person that you've killed"

Perhaps "badge of honor" is not the best choice of words, but as a "sheep dog", I would feel honored and relieved if I was in the right place/right time to stop the imminent use of deadly force against another AND to eliminate other truly evil people in this world.

It would be nice if we could just love all the hate out of people/countries. MLK was a world changer and hero. To love everybody that persecutes us, hates us and kills us may change things in the end, but not if we all sit quietly by and do nothing to defend ourselves or others.

It would be nice...to be able to shake hands with a rattlesnake or stroke it's head. No matter how much love is in ones heart...that will never happen, without getting bitten. Rattlesnakes will bite you after you have killed them. They will bite you after you cut off their heads after killing them. One must treat them with respect either way. Love them and suffer and maybe die, kill them and get bitten if one does not know the nature of the snake and it's reflex actions and how to deal with them. And if one does not bury the rattlesnakes head, but leaves it lying on the ground, the next innocent passerby may pick up the dead snake and be bitten...because they didn't "know", the nature of the snake. Those that kill the snakes around here always...cut off and bury the head to prevent innocent people, animals etc from getting bitten.

Why ? It takes time and effort to cut the head off and bury it. Could it be, that they care about the rest of humanity and even the animal kingdom, and have not been so brain washed as to believe that Love fixes all(yes it can in time)...the only answer to violence is being passive. That is a strange thought in a "place" that is full of "victims" of different kinds...victims, none the less.

For those that believe there is NO time or reason to kill, I say, "you have to be kidding...do you really think most people like war and killing...wake up....what kind of "denial" are you in....what "world" do you live in?

This forum needs to be a place of honesty. It's ok and good that opionions differ. In a forum full of "victims" there is always much denial concerning trauma, PTSD etc. So, I think this is all connected and if one can see the bigger picture, there may be things to learn.

Life is hard. There is evil in the world. There are evil people in the word. This all can create PTSD and victims.
We must choose to either kill the snake and bury the head, or to side step the snake and not care who is walking behind us. Not all are feeling capable of killing the snake. That's OK as long as they get help from those that can. Far too many people are capable of side steping the snake and not telling the ones coming behind and next in line.

To live in ones own world full of...Love fixes everything, while living in denial of reality does nobody any good...victims, ptsd sufferors, as well as the rest of humanity.

 

[atl22]

“I mourn the loss of thousands of precious lives, but I will not rejoice in the death of one, not even an enemy. Returning hate for hate multiplies hate, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness: only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate: only love can do that.”
— Martin Luther King, Jr.

Martin Luther King Jr. actually did not say that entire quote. He only said the last part. The first sentence has been traced to a Facebook page and was a woman's commentary, which she followed with the MLK quote. He did not say the first sentence, which I highlighted in bold. If you Google the quote, you will find numerous articles which have discussed this. Even if MLK had said that quote, I would deny its relevance. It would have been said decades before 9/11 in a completely different time.

Bin Laden had over 2 terabytes of intelligence and plans to kill more of us, including a ridiculous plan to divide the US along racial lines and try to recruit African-Americans to become terrorists against their own country. That unlikely scenario, in my opinion, proves how little he really understood the United States.

As much as I want peace, we are dealing with religious extremists that intend to kill us all. I know that the US is not innocent. We, like all countries, have made mistakes. If we are not willing to kill a mass murderer of thousands of innocents that is actively leading and planning to kill thousands more, shouldn't we just give up now and submit to the terrorists?

 

[Nicolette]

If we are not willing to kill a mass murderer of thousands of innocents that is actively leading and planning to kill thousands more, shouldn't we just give up now and submit to the terrorists?

I hate political discussions and normally avoid them.

The only thing I have to say about this is the problem is Bin Laden was supported by a terrorist group which he was actively leading and planning to kill thousands. At the end of his day it was his supporters/group who killed the Americans and he only lead them to believe they were doing the right thing.

While I am not taking sides, nor do I wish to, I will say that Bin Laden dying will not stop the plans or attempted killings as another of his group will step up and lead the group of terrorists.

Soldiers are trained to kill "the enemy" and not question authority. What if the shoe was on the other foot and the American President (whoever they were at the time) convinced Americans that in order to be safe they had to wipe out a country because "they were the enemy"?

I do not support Bin Laden or what he lead his group to do killing innocent people. I do however believe that there are two sides to every story and perspectives in war/politics often lead to the unnecessary deaths of soldiers and innocent people.

 

[anni]

It's a red herring of an argument to say political activism is deliberately muted because others do not hold the viewpoint that what? Obama was responsible for the deaths of those Christians? ( although I do find Dubyas actions subsequents to 9/11 indefensible- he didn't ' do it ' either ) . Osama was responsible for all those lovely people ending lives they did not wish to end that awful day- it's just an odd comparison to imagine dancing in the streets should their deaths occur in answer to the Christian's deaths as seems to be the point there. I'm sure this wasn't the point, but to include it in the same argument seems to make the men and thier leadership, deeds and positions comparable when they're just not.

It just did not occur where one offends veterans and thier families if one questions the war these days. Oh, there was a shot at it,where one was made to look actually traitorous at the beginning to be sure, but not from the military families-that came from political factions who used it to serve their own purposes. As it stands, it's clear one can not be at all happy about how Dubya launched us into this debacle but be solidly behind our people who served there and continue to serve plus acknowledge that 9/11 had to be answered for. It was an act not just of terrorism but of war, as was Pearl Harbour but nobody raised any hell about holding anyone responsible for that. That was just much more clear, the boundaries and issues of course much more defined, the leadership of course head and shoulders above what we had at the time of 9/11. It was war declared on our country all the same, call it any other name one likes.

I'm what is known as a stinking Liberal, and a political activist, somewhat retired, and white ( although not sure why that should bolster or negate anything I have to say ), and also American. Not one of these trumps the other as a citizen of the world, with an interest in being happy there's more of a balance in it today than there was the day before this man was removed from it.

 

[amethist]

I don't usually reply to threads such as this, but today I will make an exception.

You may think this is not connected, but could anything like this be allowed to happen in any way ever again.

Is any one here old enough to remember being told, shown or have any of you seen the pictures of the German Concentration camps of World war II. I went to a museum in Holland many years ago, with many pictures and information about just what the Germans of that time did to the Jewish people.

Now say it is wrong to stop these terrorists having the upper hand. We should stop them, to stop anything, any where near like the above happening again.

This is supposed to be a free world, lets keep it that way, and keep these terrorists at bay.

Amethist