News The Pope Said Something Very Powerful About The Sexual Abuse Of Children

[Tinyflame]

Yes thanks @sun seeker . I think one of the worst parts (anywhere, anytime) is when it's not believed, or the public persona is so different & supported (especially if they're violent/ sadistic). For adults too.

 

[scout86]

the biggest factor was, they went where children were.

Exactly! If you're hunting geese, you don't do it in a forest, you do it where you have easy access to geese.

I have been both amazed and horrified by the number of people I've talked to who think you'd know a child molester when you see one because they must look obviously creepy. NO! To be "successful" at that kind of thing a person generally comes off as anything but that, on the surface. Why is this so hard for people to get?

 

[shimmerz]

To be "successful" at that kind of thing a person generally comes off as anything but that, on the surface. Why is this so hard for people to get?

Because, imho, the reality of the situation is that most people don't want to deal. So they are in denial about it. Or pretend they are educated about it so it won't happen to them. The reality of the situation is that it can happen to anyone. Because these people are generally chameleons. And if you don't see the illusion.....? Then what?

 

[scout86]

And if you don't see the illusion.....? Then what?

You're Tiger Bait! :ninja:

 

[Ocean5]

I think you wouldn't find them where they don't have access to children.

Great point!

My experience... that nice veneer covers up an awful lot of ugliness underneath.

So true. Are the people who cover-up not just as guilty?

My mom (abused/raped) also removed me from Cub Scouts after less than a month. I think people who have been sexually abused have some insight, or 6th sense...

 

[sun seeker]

Are the people who cover-up not just as guilty?

Same people, in this case. Two faces. At least, some of them are, there are some authentically good people there too. What I mean to say is I wasn't talking about some people covering up what other people do, but the same people having two very different sides.

 

[Jobriel]

I'm sorry that some people were so upset by my post. I did not realize it was controversial to cite the statistics. To answer Void's questions, I wrote the thesis about 13 years ago for a master's program in Anthropology. (I was investigating common misunderstandings regarding religions in American culture.) The sources were all books, so I would have to dig out my thesis to find the titles. I do know that my adviser openly disdained organized religions, so I am guessing he would have been happy to point out mistakes in my data if he had found any. If I am in error, I would have no problem in admitting my mistakes.

Ms. Spock, you are clearly hurting, and have consequently read negativity into my statements when none was intended. Nowhere in my post did I deny the abuses, nor did I attempt to justify anything. I said that abuse is equally likely to happen in any place where adults have access to children. That's all I said, and as far as I know, it is accurate. I'm sorry if that has angered or upset you.

 

[shimmerz]

but the same people having two very different sides.

Because lots of people have 'parts'. And they can be compartmentalized. So the part they present is not the same as the part that does the evil shit. Trickster stuff. Doesn't matter --- the it is still reprehensible. I think that if we know that we have 'parts' that understanding how these two things can coincide in a person, each being real in their own ways, will lead to our being able to protect ourselves and our loved ones. Just mho. I am using the 'parts' theory to heal myself, not necessarily because I am focusing on it for me, but in understanding human behaviour. I needed that lesson. A monster doesn't always have ugly teeth when it smiles.

 

[Tinyflame]

This is probably going to be the most despised or misunderstood post in the history of the forum, but something I wanted to but was just too tired to add last night, & JMHO.

For myself, I think we (I) do not know what these people who have perpetrated such crimes are dealing with, what has brought them to this point. I am in no way saying it is not reprehensible, nor that they should not be held accountable, & NOR IN ANY WAY SHAPE OR FORM BE ALLOWED AROUND CHILDREN (not shouting btw), only that I fear the 'mob mentality' response.

My analogy would be this: when I hear someone with ptsd has gone 'cookoo'/ ballistic & committed a horrendous crime, I think where was the help? Where were the people that could have said something that would have stopped this? And I think of course of the victims, the gross loss & grief. I think too of ptsd & the stigma however that others think this is a given for all with ptsd. Of course I think of it somewhat differently too, probably, than someone without ptsd. But in short, I realize Idk. Idk nor understand even what applies to myself, let alone others. I consider they are sick, or something, who knows what. And the differences there are even between people & people presenting with disorders. I also believe there is the capacity for great good & great evil in the human heart.

Are the people who cover-up not just as guilty?

I think so, the first may be mentally ill or 'not in their right mind', the second not necessarily whatsoever.

“God weeps for sexual abuse of children,” Francis said during the speech. “These cannot be maintained in secret. I commit to a careful oversight to ensure that youth are protected and that all responsible will be held accountable... Those who have survived this abuse have become true heralds of mercy -- humbly, we owe each of them our gratitude for their great value as they have had to suffer this terrible abuse sexual abuse of minors,"

I think we all know we can't change even our own pasts. But we are not used to (well I'm not) thinking of surviving stuff as indicative of culminating in, or being referred to as (I) have 'great value'. (Quite the opposite. Wow.) Very different from what @BlackbirdSinging 's experiences (& my own, including self-reflection/ self-rejection) have been below:

All I do know is I felt validated seeing what he said about the value of those who have been sexually abused. It's a far cry from the blame some people put on me when I finally found the courage to talk about what happened to me.

I (humbly) say I think that's possibly what she meant as the focus in this thread originally.

 

[void]

@Junebug

You are so sweet and lovely:hug:that I could squish you:playful::playful:....BUT...I will still vociferously disagree with the opinion of anyone who positively regards Frances's OBVIOUS lies.

"God weeps for sexual abuse of children,” Francis said during the speech. “These cannot be maintained in secret. I commit to a careful oversight to ensure that youth are protected and that all responsible will be held accountable..."

If this is true, then he will immediately turn over ALL of the meticulous records kept by Pope Benedict XVI (in his role as Prefect of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, which Ratzinger became in 1981) to Law Enforcement agencies all over the world resulting in the immediate arrest and prosecution of these criminals.

WILL HE IMMEDIATELY EXPOSE 100% OF THE DOCUMENTATION OF THESE PEDOPHILE PRIESTS TO LAW ENFORCEMENT?????????

You know he will not. There is absolutely no chance in Hell. Therefore, his above statements are obvious lies.

Terry Kohut one of at least 200 deaf boys molested by Father Murphy want us all to hear his silent scream and wake up.

Will we?

 

[scout86]

If this is true, then he will immediately turn over ALL of the meticulous records kept by Pope Benedict XVI

I will grant that he won't do that because "immediately" is already past. I'm going to be interested to see what he WILL do. Because I really think there's a chance he'll do something. And, there might be a lot of options. I'm not Catholic, but I consider myself to be Christian. I'm thinking that, in the Pope's world, there are worse penalties than anything human laws can deal out. I'd expect him to act within his own frame of reference. I just hope he acts.

There isn't any way to change the past. I can come up with all kinds of creative ways to make ALL "these people", inside and outside of churches, pay for their crimes. (Most of them are well outside anything the law would sanction.) The mess that lays in the past, with this church, is there. People "should" for their crimes, but that won't undo the damage and it won't deter other offenders, I don't think. I'd like it to be dealt with, but I care far more about what they do from this day forward. I hope they take this as serious and I hope they remove offenders from circulation and quit protecting them.

@Junebug, you're right, we don't know. And I have to admit, it's beyond my comprehension how someone who was abused themselves could ever do the same to another. But it happens. It also DOESN'T happen. And some people who commit that kind of offense, don't have "being abused themselves" as an excuse. But, we don't know in these cases and won't unless things are made public. Making them public is one of the things I deeply believe should happen.

 

[Tinyflame]

Yes @scout86 .

You are so sweet and lovely:hug:that I could squish you:playful::playful:....

Hee, thanks @void. That's kinder than I would have expected. :) :hug: