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Black Lives Matter - a converstation

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Interesting topic, didn't expect to find it here.
I'm Caucasian and married to a Chinese woman. When I married her a long time ago (25 years) people had all kinds of weird reactions such as "oh I don't know if I could marry a Chinese woman, they're so different from us", or "I've always liked Asian women" and more. I've always found those reactions strange as I (as was mentioned before by someone else) didn't see her as a Chinese woman but as a woman that I happened to love, the fact that she was Chinese was not a factor for me.

Also, from very young I've lived in foreign countries (Africa, South America, Asia) and probably because of this never considered others to be black or white or yellow, just people.

And I've learned also that not only white people are racists, black and Asian people can be racist and it's not as rare as you would think.

But the US, or in general the West problem is different, it's a problem of who has the power.

And I was also thinking while looking at the picture of a very fat (probably over 300 lbs) man wearing a mini skirt and thongs, all bright red, that until I can have a serious conversation with a person like that I'm also somewhat racist.

I think the problem is not race per se. Let's say all of us were all black or white or whatever color I'm pretty sure we would still find a way to exclude outsiders. Maybe shorter people, maybe different skin tones but I'm convinced that we would still find a way to segregate and concentrate power.

So in conclusion I think the problem is much deeper than race. We have to learn to accept difference and welcome it.
 
Wow, @airdog, you hit the nail on the head. As a fat person, I suffered a lot growing up in the 60s and 70s. It is a matter of accepting differences as different, not good or bad. So as a person with PTSD, how can I accept different as different? It's a great concept to think about, and to find ways to act on it. When I meet a new person, my first thought is, "are they going to hurt me". Once past that I see people as people. Even 300 lb transvestite men as I've met more than one. I guess that means I fear everyone equally.

I also agree it's about who has the power. And the culture of how people in power use it. What others think about how they use it, and how many agree.
 
I think that the first step is to acknowledge your inner thoughts; be they racist or inclusive. The hard work comes when we complicate it all by thinking that we have to behave "differently" to someone who has different way of being or looking than we do. A therapist that I used to see, taught me a beautiful concept. She would do a Namaste whenever she met with her clients, and said that the meaning of Namaste is that "The Divine in myself, acknowledges the Divine in you." Treat people the way that you would like to be treated. When we focus on our differences, we lose our way.

One phrase that always arouses my ire, is the phrase "White Privilege." I think it would be better to call it "Advantage." A tall person in a supermarket does not have "tall privilege" but he or she does have an advantage, at that moment over a shorter person desiring to reach a higher shelf. And yet that same tall person will have to choose carefully in a car purchase because of his height. (My husband is 6'2 and believe me, he had to be careful in buying a car that he could comfortably sit in.) Life challenges us and rewards us based upon many things. Life is dynamic and not a static thing. America is rich in diversity and when that is seen (as others here have pointed out) as an asset and not a problem, we will have taken a giant step in the evolving of the human race.
 
Series of advantages?

Is a privilege.
So is denying / renaming privileges to something else.

It's the same thing as claiming disabled people are not disabled, just differently abled.

Nope. They are disabled. Denying that is not more inclusive or helpful.

Denying some facts of life as a matter of choice, labels, convenience... only supports those who posess all of those 'advantages'.

Well intentioned, but does harm, and is not accurate.
 
I don't know if this has been covered, I haven't found it. I live in a white community, and moving to a whiter one. I lived in Georgia in the 60s - ewww, and the Northeast and Northwest. I have seen racism, white privilege and cried during history in college when I learned some of the true history of the US. I would like to start a conversation with everyone on this issue.

This started with my white neighbor telling me there is no systematic racism and white privilege. I was deeply upset. There are so many times in my life this has affected me. I was engaged to a black narcotics officer, which enraged my friends in the horse world. My best friend for years, who introduced me to Buddhism, was also black, but I never thought of them as black first. When I think of O, I think of her huge smile, her quirky sense of humor, her prettiness. I don't categorize her in a racial slot. Her culture was different from mine, and I loved it. On the other hand, I used to work in a black community and was afraid a few times because I was a white girl. I was also told not to hire too many black people in the store I managed. I quit.

Anyway, I know I am sometimes racist without knowing it, and I hesitated to write about my fiance and friend because I wasn't saying, hey look-I have black friends, I was trying to communicate that I didn't see them as people different from me as a human. I want to know what I can do to help the movement from anyone of color here, or any white person who might have an opinion.

Hi there! I appreciate this question so I don't mind breaking my anonymity. For context I am a black woman born and raised on the south side of Chicago. I recently graduated from law school and I am studying for the Illinois bar. The reason why I started law school was because I wanted to become an attorney and fight against the injustice in my community as well as other minority communities.

So, yes I believe there is systemic racism I have witnessed it as have my family and friends our entire lives. When people such as your neighbor say that it doesn't exist I am curious on whether they are ignorant to its existence or if they simply don't care because it doesn't affect them....But, I don't tend to waste too much time on it because if a person is committed to their belief well there isn't much that a conversation will do.

Now, someone like you who is curious and open to an honest conversation I would spend time with. I believe honest and open conversations move the needle. I find your comment about not seeing some of the black people you know as different a bit curious..I have never in 29 years walked into any space and been mistaken as a white woman?..We are in fact different. My experience in America as a black woman is different. Your experience is different. Seeing that, I think is how we really figure out what should and should not be changed.

As to your experience at the black community store? I understand your uncomfortability. Welcome to the black experience. Imagine the fact that black people are the minority and we often have to go to communities that are all or mostly white for the most basics of things such as adequate elementary and high schools, banking, shopping, restaurants, and employment.(the list can be exhaustive but I won't bore you. My point is we often live daily in that feeling of uncomfortable. And as quiet as its kept educational degrees, money and status does not change that.

How can you help? It depends on who you are. I think that when it comes to this there is no one size fit all solution because this issue hits so many different categories. Typically I have told all of my white friends and colleagues to read White Fragility. The reason behind this is because I think black people are not a monolith. Our experiences with systemic racism comes in different shapes and sizes. Therefore, I believe it helps individuals to figure out where their own white privledge or racism lies. Then, they will know exactly how they can stand up or assist with dismantling racism. For example, protesting isn't for everyone but it may be for some. For others, the answer may be diversifying their job boards, speaking up at school board meetings, calling co-workers and friends out when they make "that joke", talking to their parents about the ideals they hold, donating to organizations that help black youth, gaining black friends and becoming more aware, etc.
 
Series of advantages?

Is a privilege.
So is denying / renaming privileges to something else.

It's the same thing as claiming disabled people are not disabled, just differently abled.

Nope. They are disabled. Denying that is not more inclusive or helpful.

Denying some facts of life as a matter of choice, labels, convenience... only supports those who posess all of those 'advantages'.

Well intentioned, but does harm, and is not accurate.


I think this is spot on because claiming something doesn't exist will not delete it. Its still there and in the current context of the world it still matters. In a way claiming that its not visible weaponizes the word. Basically, it sets the stage for anyone who wants to talk about it as an antagonizer or victim. Its a brilliant strategy really.....
 
Hi there! I appreciate this question so I don't mind breaking my anonymity. For context I am a black woman born and raised on the south side of Chicago. I recently graduated from law school and I am studying for the Illinois bar. The reason why I started law school was because I wanted to become an attorney and fight against the injustice in my community as well as other minority communities.

So, yes I believe there is systemic racism I have witnessed it as have my family and friends our entire lives. When people such as your neighbor say that it doesn't exist I am curious on whether they are ignorant to its existence or if they simply don't care because it doesn't affect them....But, I don't tend to waste too much time on it because if a person is committed to their belief well there isn't much that a conversation will do.

Now, someone like you who is curious and open to an honest conversation I would spend time with. I believe honest and open conversations move the needle. I find your comment about not seeing some of the black people you know as different a bit curious..I have never in 29 years walked into any space and been mistaken as a white woman?..We are in fact different. My experience in America as a black woman is different. Your experience is different. Seeing that, I think is how we really figure out what should and should not be changed.

As to your experience at the black community store? I understand your uncomfortability. Welcome to the black experience. Imagine the fact that black people are the minority and we often have to go to communities that are all or mostly white for the most basics of things such as adequate elementary and high schools, banking, shopping, restaurants, and employment.(the list can be exhaustive but I won't bore you. My point is we often live daily in that feeling of uncomfortable. And as quiet as its kept educational degrees, money and status does not change that.

How can you help? It depends on who you are. I think that when it comes to this there is no one size fit all solution because this issue hits so many different categories. Typically I have told all of my white friends and colleagues to read White Fragility. The reason behind this is because I think black people are not a monolith. Our experiences with systemic racism comes in different shapes and sizes. Therefore, I believe it helps individuals to figure out where their own white privledge or racism lies. Then, they will know exactly how they can stand up or assist with dismantling racism. For example, protesting isn't for everyone but it may be for some. For others, the answer may be diversifying their job boards, speaking up at school board meetings, calling co-workers and friends out when they make "that joke", talking to their parents about the ideals they hold, donating to organizations that help black youth, gaining black friends and becoming more aware, etc.

I’m glad you broke your anonymity here.
 
First off, welcome to the forum, @EmpoweredGirl, I'm glad you're here!

.But, I don't tend to waste too much time on it because if a person is committed to their belief well there isn't much that a conversation will do.

You're right, it's just that I was horrified to find out someone I had been friendly with was a racist without even knowing they were racist. As I said before, I move to Georgia in the early 60s and I was really disgusted at how people treated others. Everyone had a place and stuck to their place. I won't go back even though cousins live there because I hated it. White men were the top, and everyone including women were on the bottom, and through my 8 year old eyes, everyone was ok with it.


I believe honest and open conversations move the needle. I find your comment about not seeing some of the black people you know as different a bit curious

Your post is excellent, and drives home a lot of things I think, but am not able to verbalise well due to well, lifelong PTSD. When I see people, I know they are different, what I guess I'm trying to say is that I love the differences and it isn't an issue of race for me so much, not that I don't notice. And I see people as people, not colors. I do notice their colors, but that doesn't immediately cause me to form an opinion about who they are as a person. Is that clearer?

As to your experience at the black community store?

It was actually a white store, with a sign on the bathroom door saying, "Out of Order". The white owner said that's to keep black people (not a direct quote) from using it so I refused. I just couldn't get over the fact that my friend from up north wouldn't be able to use it.
 
As to your experience at the black community store?

Oh, I see what you were referring to. I am moving in 3 days, and I'm on steroids to get my back through the move, so my cognition is troubled, lol. Yes, you are right. I wasn't always afraid, only when I felt threatened, which wasn't often. So, was it because they were black, or because they were stealing openly and threatening me if I did anything, or both? I didn't do anything anyway, since I wasn't going to be hurt for a store.
 
I am sorry my post was misunderstood. I was merely trying reframe this thing called privilege, not say it doesn't exist. In my healing journey from PTSD, I have often found that re-framing a traumatic incident and looking at the bigger picture surrounding those incidents helped me in my healing. But I will bow out, as I am not looking to debate, I was just offering my own input. I am often misunderstood when i only meant well.
 
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