Where Does Love Come From?

[Misul]

This will be a more philosophical thread as that's how I think. It's not important that we come up with a definitive answer, but let's see what kind of thoughts we can stir up.

What I'm contemplating is the origins of love. I was horridly abused throughout my youth and am still with an abuser today. I have hardly known even a speck of love in my life. Yet, I still remain with a heart full of just that - love. I am not only a hopeless romantic, but even the smallest thing can stir up a feeling of love within me. An interesting thing is that I have given up on people, but not on love. I still believe in love. I don't know if this love comes from Spirit but it's there and it's very strong. Something in me won't give up until I find it and though I spend my existence lonely and in pain, I am determined to find it. I will never stop believing and I will never stop giving love.

Love is not something that we can pull selfishly to ourselves. Real eternal love comes when we've examined ourselves openly, honestly, and resolved to do better. That's why eternal love is extraordinarily rare in this world. My opinion is that most people never feel it, not even the most happy couples. I don't know if maybe what I'm talking about isn't "love" but something else. But the word "love" is the term I use; it seems to be a kind of love anyway. Plato also wrote about different types of love.

I think either

a.) I never grew up, or
b.) The love I'm talking about is from something much much bigger than this world.

Thoughts on your own feelings or struggles with love? It doesn't have to be like mine. I just wanted to start a conversation.

Misul

 

[mixtapeheartache]

I'd suggest reading The Art of Loving by philosopher and social psychologist Erich Fromm as a starting point.

 

[franciemarnie]

No abuse ever extinguished love in my heart. It might have dimmed it but never destroyed it.

The first few years of my life were good and I always thought that was why I have such big love in me. I wish I'd had had kids so I could give them all that love.

Spirit is a mystery to me so I don't know how to talk about love in relation to it.

I am so glad you feel all that love still. Me too!

 

[ashdawn8287]

Hi, hope you're doing well. My whole life I always believed in love and wanted it more than anything. I always thought I had this perfect image of what love is. After my experiences I have realized for me, love is anything but perfect and that is why its beautiful. I think when a person starts loving themselves flaws and baggage and all it allows you to be recipetant to accepting the love you deserve, instead of just falling back to the wrong love.

It took me a couple bad heartbreaks and taking time to myself in order to open up my eyes to what love really is. Love is not perfect their isn't any fairytales but real love is better than any perfect fairy-tale it is imperfect and it opens a part of you that you never knew was possible. It makes you stronger, it makes you better, it isn't scared. It is safe and it is a feeling of home.

After I stopped dating bad guys and seeing through the BS I was able to spot my fiancée from a mile away. And this is took all my former beliefs in love and threw them out the window. This kind of love changes you, but for the better.

 

[rightkindofme]

Love is a choice, in my opinion. Well, sorta. I "love" people spontaneously without it being a choice but loving them doesn't influence my behavior.

I used to date men who didn't treat me very well. I was shared out sexually and beaten a lot. The reason I left these men wasn't because of their treatment of me (I'm not that bright) but because all of them were smart enough to not want kids.

I wanted my children so bad that I couldn't stand it. Having kids was a massive driving force for me. I think that I use my relationship with my children as a way of healing myself. I hug them and snuggle them and teach them the things I needed to know but no one taught me.

My husband was my best friend when I dated the other guys. Before he knew me he was pretty sure he would never have children. Once he met me he started thinking about it. He started thinking about what it would be like to raise kids with someone who cared about the topic as much as I do.

In order to prepare for parenthood I probably read something like two hundred books. And I'm still reading. I know that I don't understand normal development and I want to be appropriate. The only way I know to determine appropriate behavior is to read and read and read about all of the extremes and try to determine what a middle ground looks like.

My husband (who was just a friend--not someone I was dating) showed up for dinner one night during one of the freak periods when I was single (I always had a boyfriend) and he said, "I know you don't want me. But I will never forgive myself if I don't ask you to marry me. I want to raise children with you. I want to be with you for the rest of my life." It was quite a shock.

Sometimes I don't like my husband very much. He is very much the embodiment of the Great White Male Oppressor. He comes from inherited money. He is an Aspie and not good at detecting emotional signals. That was very hard to adjust to because sometimes it reads as him being self-absorbed and inconsiderate. I have learned after years that if I can break things down into small pieces and explain it to him he is willing to do whatever I want. But I cannot ask him for empathy. He doesn't have it to give. But he tries to fake it.

My husband no longer does all of the things that really bothered me but I thought I had to put up with them just because some man wanted me to. I don't have to be choked during sex. I don't have to be hit. I don't have to be derided. I don't have to be told constantly that I am a worthless whore. That was how most of the sex I ever had went.

He's boring and staid. But he loves me. He is a good provider. He's considerate once he understands what something means to me. He's great with our kids--he does a lot with them. He makes breakfast every morning because, as he says, "I want to make sure that leaving me would be so terrible you never want to do it--you would have to make breakfast every day!" :)

I have learned that love is about learning how to be kind to someone--because we are all so different. The cleaning tasks that "bug" me aren't the things that bug him. If I want to be considerate towards him I have to stop and consciously look around for the things that bug him.

I think that love is about wanting to help someone be as awesome as they can be. If someone tears you down then they don't actually love you.

My husband gave me the support that allowed me to run a marathon. He encouraged me towards writing books. He provides verbal support and kid-care time because he considers me doing these things important. He believes I have to have things I am doing for me or I won't be happy. He is the only person in my whole life to care about me like this.

I feel so blessed. I am very very lucky. It was a hard road to get here. I still think it is funny that I met my husband and decided he could never meet my needs so I didn't consider him as a partner. Then he decided he wanted me. He changed a lot so he could be what I wanted.

I feel surprised every day that he wants to be with me. I'm grateful. I like our kids. I like our life. I feel so lucky.

 

[DharmaGirl]

Rightkindofme, that was a wonderful post! I never thought something like that would happen to me. I never dated the "boring" ones.

I don't know where love comes from. I thought I was in love, but I was just working out attachment issues. I do know I love my son, and would love him no matter what happens. I think compassion with a lack of judgement is love. Boy, I'll have to come back to this, I've been up all night.

 

[ashdawn8287]

Also, look up the 5 languages of love. This is really helpful to anyone in a relationship. It helped me realize my fiancée and I show love differently and how to speak each others love language. It has helped a lot. We both made lists of how we show love and its hung on our refridgerator. We things get rocky we default to this list and realize we are saying the same thing, just in a different love language.

 

[mamachick]

misul-this is a great thread you have started. It has really made me think. I was not interpreting the topic as just "couples" kind of love but more generally.

rightkindofme-what a great post. I am so happy that you have discovered very real love with all of its imperfections. You have found in this world that which most of us hope for.

monster-I am going to check out that book. I have not read it.

I have a hard time describing what love is. I do think that it is acceptance of that person, or self. What sticks in my mind though is something I just posted on another thread and it comes from a book written by Mary Ann Willamson. I forget the name of the book. But she states that all of our actions either come from love or from fear. The actions are either or and cannot exist together. We cannot love when we are in fear. That has become one of my core beliefs.

While I am a very loving person, I also have come to recognize my acting out of fear (unintentionally). Raising kids in middle class America, how many times have I done something for them to prevent them from being hurt, looking irresponsible, or suffering consequences. My action was from fear-not love. I divorced when they were teens and at times I was motivated by my fear of them liking their father more than me. Ironically, in the end, even though he did very little other than financial support, I think they ended up liking him better anyway. I really do see how love and fear cannot co-exist.

 

[mamachick]

While I know I have lots of love in my heart, I suspect that it does not come through easily because my world is full of fear. This thread has reminded me of this core belief that I seem to have deserted over the years. It makes me realize how desperately I need to create an environment where I feel safe and am not living in fear. Thank you for starting this thread

 

[mamachick]

ashdawn-I think that your understanding is so important and it is wonderful that you and your fiance have the love and motivation that it takes from both people to refer to something that makes sense to both of you and obviously works.

I have been seperated for 10 years (only reason not final is health insurance for me). He constantly professed to love me still and wants back together. He has always refused to read a book, an article, or seek any information to understand our problems. He admits to being absent during our marriage. He is emotionally stingy. He is passive aggressive. I know love is not perfect, but we all have the right to feel emotionally safe and not to feel constantly undermined as I have.

Last month I challenged him. I said if he seriously wants to get back together, he needs to make an appointment with a couples counselor of his choice. He said he would. Two weeks later-said he hasnt had time. Two more weeks later-said that people can work things out on their own, and we need to get back together and then look at couples therapy if we dont resolve issues. I call BS. Love is an action, and when you love someone, you do things that sometimes cause some discomfort. He had it all for 17 years of marraige and living together and has never dated in the past 10 yrs of seperation. He does not have ptsd but is very uncomfortable being emotionally intimate. I will always love him, he is the father of my children, and trustworthy on many levels. I know we speak different languages, but the bottom line is that he feels like he needs me. That is not love. He wants companionship and I dont blame him, but he is lazy when it comes to love. Love requires effort.

 

[saffy]

I believe love comes from within. Others behaviour make us feel bad about ourselves but inside we still have love.

The abusers, the manipulators and the ones that show no love are the ones who are damaged.

The victims have been made to feel that others are more important than them. But the others just believe that they are or have misconceptions about peoples behaviour and attitudes and life in general.

Our inner conflicts and self hatred are based on trying to convince the real damaged ones that love exists. We are the ones that have had our inner and love ignored and abused. But we still have love inside.

Love is non judgemental, non conditional and non abusive. It should be equal in this. Someone who cannot do this is damaged and have issues which reflect their behaviour. Jealousy, greed, selfishness, hurt, bitterness and a host of other non desirable behaviour traits. (I pity their lives)

Best wishes
Saffy :)