Other Parental Alienation Syndrome

[shimmerz]

I was just wondering if this is a problem with anyone else on the board. It doesn't always happen between parents, it can also happen between siblings, parent and child (with grandchildren) etc.

Any attempt at alienating the children from the other parent should be seen as a direct and willful violation of one of the prime duties of parenthood.

I feel that one of the reasons my PTSD was rekindled was because I was terrified for my children and it triggered hopeless feelings that my children were in grave danger. I also feel as if a key to my mental health right now, because this type of behaviour is being continued by my children with my grandchildren and I. It is making me really sick. I was out with one of my sons a few nights ago and have been 'down' ever since. I am greatly disturbed by the impact this is, and has, been having on my mental health. And of course, because I am messed up about it, the alienators can point at me and say, 'why would you hang out with her, she is crazy'. Good gig, if you are an alienator. Spin the other parent out, then call them crazy.

Here is a link if one wants to read about it. Idk, it might help someone.

http://www.fact.on.ca/Info/pas/walsh99.htm

Anyone? Have you heard of it? Do you feel it may be happening to you? What do you do about it?

Staff: I put this in Domestic Violence as I feel it is DV and also because it is a tactic used mainly by abusive spouses.

 

[jaccat]

I don't have any advice, but I can say it was attempted by my mother and grandmother on me, to alienate me from my father, who I lived with after the divorce. They did it simply to take something from him. Among other things my Grandmother tried to tell me all my mother's problems were his fault, and (my favourite) the pair of them held me against my will for several days in a remote location until I forced them to send me home (by behaving like a royal brat). Their tactics didn't work though.

 

[Friday]

Yep. It isn't what triggered this tailspin, my son being in danger and being unable to protect him was, but it's definitely a component.

- First year I was 'that f*cking psychobitch c*nt of a mother of yours' & outright attacks
- Second year I was 'Your mother makes bad decisions', and "Your mother is a liar," and all kinds of undermine the trust
- This year I'm being referred to as my son's "birth mother" and all kinds of distancing and unimportantance language

By taking the high road & not talking badly about my ex? Not putting my son in that position? All it did was strengthen my ex's position about me. f*cking wonderful. And all this just tip of the iceberg. "Everyone" says the kids figure it out eventually. Still a f*cking heartbreak.

 

[Nam]

It think we see this a lot like @jaccat 's situation with divorced parents. The kid is caught in the middle and forced to take sides.

@shimmerz I'm pretty sure this isn't the same thing, but I understand how PTSD can influence how we parent. I am so afraid of making a mistake. I'm afraid of harming them in some grave way...forever. I'm afraid they don't know I love them. I hope this gets easier as my children outgrow the age that I was abused and hopefully, I can ease up. But in the meantime, I'm a combination of a doormat, a mama bear, and a nanny.

 

[Ronin]

Derail:

@FridayJones, you're the best Mommy in the world. Just by being you.

 

[Hope4Now]

I am so so so very sorry that your ex is doing this and your children are taken in by it and passing it on to your grandchildren. I wish I had an answer for what to do. I think it is a terrible tragedy. Just love them anyway and be yourself, I suppose. Because this is YOUR life, not anybody else's. Perhaps one day they will come to realize how they were taken in by false beliefs.:cry:

I've never heard of the syndrome, but it is what happened to me. Both my parents were abusive so it is not the same situation as yours, but I'll share it anyway for what it's worth. It went both ways--mother tried to alienate me from father and vice versa. Mostly by each belittling and objectifying the other and then making ME feel like I was the crazy one to spend time with or listen to the other. (This alternated with me being their keeper of secrets and communication vehicle). It was a totally sick cycle. My mother eventually won when I was around 13 or 14 and managed (sometimes directly, sometimes quite slyly) to convince me that my father was the root of all the problems in "our" life. She scapegoated him, I think it is called. It was vaguely feasible given his alcoholism and rages and depressions. When he died suddenly (a passive suicide) almost exactly 7 years ago, I was sort of relieved. I thought, Oh, good! I can stop worrying so much about him and Mom will finally have a chance to be happy. I think my husband and uncle felt the same (she had us all snowed and enmeshed). It took less than six months to realize that as ill and difficult and abusive as my father was to my mother and me, my mother was/is worse/more dangerous. It was a devastating realization. One of those realizations that just keeps giving. Domino effect, etc.

 

[Pencil]

This is exactly what my psycho sister would love to do, and has done. And this is why she is fighting for custody of my daughter. When my daughter was about 20 months, she came running from where she was doing something with my sister, and said 'Stupid Mommy, stupid Mommy!'. Good Lord, at 20 months a child has zero understanding of what 'stupid' means. She was clearly put up to it.

 

[garden]

I've seen this happen in some families, but I had no idea it had a name. I have experienced something similar, but different... My stepfather has gotten my 3 sisters to view my brother and I as untrustworthy, unreliable, losers. He began this at an early age, and to this day I can see how far reaching this has been. My relationship with my sisters is painful for me because they are unaware of how they have judged and sentenced me due to his influence. My brother and I are the family scapegoats. My stepfather abused us, and he justified his abuse by getting people to believe that we were just really bad, out of control kids who needed discipline. My step father is soft spoken, and shy (in front of most people), so it seems like he's just a sweet, gentle person (to most people). Nobody knows his true colors like we do. When I was in 4th grade, I tried to tell my play mate from the neighborhood that I was being physically beaten regularly by my stepfather. I told her because she had come to our front door to ask if I could come out to play and overheard him yelling at me and slapping me. She rang the bell and it became quiet, and my stepfather answered the door and told her I could not play. Later she told me what she thought she heard and I told her it was true. She told her teenage sister, and her teenage sister told me that she didn't believe me because he was a softspoken wimp, and he was not the kind of person who was capable of something like that. She told me that I was a liar, and that I just wanted attention. I was devestated because I thought that maybe they would help me escape, but instead, I was once again a liar.

My ex who committed suicide 9 years ago was subject to this by his mother. His mother brainwashed him and all his siblings into hating their father. His father never spoke badly of his mother. This family dynamic wounded his soul and it was a wound that he coud not heal.

My step father has succeeded in his attempt to defame our character. My brother has no relationship with anyone in our family, because it's easier to do that than trying to be around all that they have projected upon us. The effects of this are far reaching, and continue to hurt us both today.

 

[rainy_daze]

the kids figure it out eventually

They do. I say that from personal experience. I never believed half of the things said about my mother [looking back, I don't think I believed any of it, some of it would just confuse me because I was so young and didn't have the same cognitive skills as an adult]. I might not have been the smartest child, but I seemed to know the things that were often said to me repeatedly were untrue.

It must hurt a great deal along the way for you as the parent though.

Spin the other parent out, then call them crazy.

I sometimes wonder if my father [abusive] did this not only so I would dislike or mistrust my mother, but also in case I could remember the times he would beat her [it only served to make me hate him, in the end. It backfired for him. But had I believed him, I'm not sure I would have survived]. Sorry if that is too much sharing, I'm thinking.

It's very sad how common these things are in domestic violence situations - either during or after.

 

[shimmerz]

By taking the high road & not talking badly about my ex? Not putting my son in that position? All it did was strengthen my ex's position about me.

I did the same thing. I realize that was wrong now.

They do. I say that from personal experience.

I think that there is a large portion of myself who is so disappointed in my kids (they are 30+) for not having figured it out. It seems to just get worse and worse. Money speaks and I feel like they sold out, but on another level I know my ex to be a scary man who rules with an iron fist but makes it look like he is all good by throwing houses and cars and credit cards with no limit in. It makes it easier to swallow the jagged pill.

This family dynamic wounded his soul and it was a wound that he coud not heal.

I feel like this is where I have been and I need to reclaim my soul or I will simply be an empty shell, putting in time. In order to get my soul back, I must let this go, along with my children and grandchildren. I am worried that that will steal an even larger part of my soul. Stymied.

I've never heard of the syndrome

That's why I brought it up. I wondered if people were up against it without knowing that it is happening with more and more frequency these days and that the courts are letting it slide.

 

[Pencil]

I can't imagine anything worse. I'm lucky - my psychotic and idiotic sister has no parental rights, no rights, basically. If my daughter's biological father did what my sister tries to do I would have lost my mind completely. I don't know how you actually deal with it and stay sane.

 

[shimmerz]

actually deal with it and stay sane

Sane is a relative word. :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: I have been deemed sane, I feel sane, but this crazy making thing, oyyyyy! Given the way it is now, it feels like I was insane to fight this all these years. Such a waste of time. :facepalm: