So What Does A Bit Of Trauma Matter?

[Sandstone]

I'm still doubtful that I can be classified as having PTSD, but my T - a psychologist - is adamant that this is my diagnosis.

Last week I sat in her office, looking at at two pieces of paper. One, that she refers to as the formulation, boils down to my beliefs about myself " I have no right to exist" " Don't make a fuss" " It's all my fault", and those come mainly from my complicated childhood.
The other, that I call the six and a half are the list of my Traumas - sexual abuse from 3-11 ,two assaults at 13, a bit of grooming and assault at 14, rape at 15, my husbands illness and pressing desire to kill himself, and possibly the still birth of my first chid.

The six and a half just seem so trivial and unimportant against the formulation. I think those beliefs would have been there without any of the official Traumas, and they are the things that cripple me. Yet they seem to be the things that can't be defeated or managed. There is processing treatment for the six and a half, but what do I do with the rest?

 

[Deleted member 1860]

I have those sorts of thoughts, too .But you know what? It was never so much about directly attacking the thoughts. When the underlying trauma is processed, SO many other symptoms get better . And I think that many fall prey to this line of thinking.....that you attack all of the symptoms separately. Well, it doesn't really work like that . Dealing with the core issue is what solves the problem. Merely attacking the symptoms only puts a very temporary band aid on things (at best) .

But, I understand why you're in denial. It's safe there. You've probably read many posts about how things get worse before they get better (it's pretty much inevitable) . So maybe you're not ready to heal. You may have to hit rock bottom before your mind switches into healing mode. (Rock bottom as in losing everyone or everything.) I don't say this to scare you, but it's a theme I've seen repeated, and it was true for me.

 

[Sandstone]

What twaddle!

I'm saying that the issues listed in the "formulation" are much bigger than, and are the CAUSE of the abuse. It was the holding of those beliefs that allowed the abuses to happen - without them I would have been able to speak. With them, I was a passive and compliant victim. It's those beliefs that need to change

 

[StellaBlue]

I think those beliefs would have been there without any of the official Traumas

Hmmmm...so you think you developed the belief that you have "no right to exist" or "It's all my fault" out of the air? Or that you were born with those beliefs?

While I do believe that there is a biological component to the development of PTSD (I think folks who are on the more "highly sensitive" part of the scale may be more likely to develop PTSD), I don't think solid beliefs such as the right to exist or the ability to control all things (it's all my fault) is genetically programmed.

 

[digger]

Do you believe that you had a fully formulated sense of these things...

" I have no right to exist" " Don't make a fuss" " It's all my fault"

before the age of three...

sexual abuse from 3-11

?
I don't know enough of your history to know if the 'complicated childhood' (before the age of three?) directly contributed to any of the traumas used for your PTSD diagnosis, but I think this is why complex trauma is described as complex - because it's not 'just' the individual trauma incidents themselves that cause the damage, it's a tangling up of those with a whole load of shitty messages and beliefs we have about ourselves as a result of them and/or other experiences.

 

[Sandstone]

Hmmmm...so you think you developed the belief that you have "no right to exist" or "It's all my fault" out of the air? Or that you were born with those beliefs?

No, I think I developed them, as I said, as a result of my complicated childhood. From being the unexpected, extra child, born to a mother who didn't expect me to survive, who didn't like being married or a parent, from being the ignored only child in a household of adults, from total social isolation, from being "responsible" every time either parent had an unpleasant emotion, from a family that had no grasp of reality and amended any truth they didn't like. I could go on, but the point is that all of this seems to me much more harmful, causes me much more distress, and impacts more on my day to day life than some very non-violent "Traumas".

I don't in any way think genetics contributed to it, I think I learned very quickly that inconveniencing anyone else by having needs would have dire consequences, and being a compliant child I ddi my utmost not to have any. If I was distressed, my mother would feel bad, and it would be my fault. Or my father would be angry, and it would be all my fault Simple solution - try not to exist, and if I absolutely must, then don't make a fuss about anything. There was no need for the abuse in order for me learn those lessons.

The problem is, how can I unlearn them, when they seem so very true? I'm just not sure they fit into a model of PTSD, except as contributors to why the abuses all happened.

 

[Meadowsweet]

I have a similar thing - there is no maternal bond between me and my mother, she dislikes emotions and will push them away. Then a father who was very critical and controlling and didn't show affection, but they weren't abusive. However, I grew up thinking that everything I did was wrong, that I was useless and that I brought things on myself by being that way. I also grew up with the knowledge that I should hide how I feel from other people, because it seems to upset people.

But the pattern of my abuse history seems to demonstrate how much the way I think or act in the world has attracted abusers, and then these ideas at the very core of me have been reinforced and affirmed by abuse.

For me, what has helped has been:
a) recognising that because of abuse, these automatic thoughts have become related in my mind to traumatic fears - ie, I don't just feel not good enough, I feel that not being good enough will lead to more abuse. Or, I don't just worry that people won't like me, I worry that people will hate me enough to want to kill me.
b) recognising that the origins of these thoughts doesn't come from the abuse, but comes from the parenting I received. Recognising that those thoughts are the things that were said and shown to me as a child has helped me to identify less with them.
c) having a therapist acknowledge that the way that I think and respond to certain situations is a factor in the pattern of abuse that I've experienced. Somehow having someone else acknowledge that my thinking and perception does put me in danger, gave me a better understanding of why abuse occurs to me - so rather than the childish voice that said "People want to hurt you because you're irritating and never do anything right and drive them to it," I found a more mature voice that said, "abusers are attracted to you because you appear quite child-like and naïve and you show a willingness to take on the blame for what they do."
d) learning about the different parts of myself and how different parts react differently. Then also, taking the maternal side of myself, that loves to nurture and look after and teach my own children, and use it to be the mother to my child-like self - this part has helped me to change how I speak to myself. My therapist said to me once when I was getting annoyed at my emotional child self, "would you talk to your own children like that?" And that really shocked me, because I never would talk to an actual child like that - but she showed me that that emotional part of myself IS a child, and that has helped me to offer her more nurturing, kind words.

It's still a work in progress, it's a matter of correcting myself and keeping trying to make that kind, nurturing voice the dominant one in my internal dialogues.

 

[StellaBlue]

Ah...I think I understand where you're coming from now...you are saying that your concern is more with your core beliefs (which you think predate any of your traumas) than with the traumas themselves. I suspect, and I suspect you suspect, that these are, in fact, so intertwined it's hard to tease them apart. And, I think, a lot of times, unlearning these core beliefs is a more difficult task than dealing with the traumas. It's a rabbit hole sometimes.

For me, my childhood of neglect and invalidation is so interwoven with my "trauma(s)" that my core beliefs about myself and the world seem set in stone. So, it's kind of a two prong approach for me - examine the beliefs, then work with the trauma, find the connections, examine the beliefs - lather, rinse, repeat. Add in some self-care (examine the belief that I don't deserve it, look for connections, work with the trauma). It's not easy...

@Meadowsweet posted while I was typing this and I think this is really important as well:

But the pattern of my abuse history seems to demonstrate how much the way I think or act in the world has attracted abusers, and then these ideas at the very core of me have been reinforced and affirmed by abuse.

This is a hard one to untangle - but from what you've written, I think you're actually untangling it.

 

[Sandstone]

@Meadowsweet Yes! You get it! I could quote most of what you said back to you, but you said it so I don't need to.

these ideas at the very core of me have been reinforced and affirmed by abuse.

That word "core" has been key to my thinking about this overnight. The abuse only happened to my body, the parenting affected who I was, who I could be.

a lot of times, unlearning these core beliefs is a more difficult task than dealing with the traumas. It's a rabbit hole sometimes.

It sounds like a long hard haul, which is precisely what I don't have on offer. My NHS therapy comes in 16 week batches, and getting the first 16 weeks took a three year battle. It was allocated to treat the PTSD that I now doubt I have ( I still don't think I meet Criteria A or B). And if I don't have it, then I also shouldn't be here, working it out between therapy sessions.

abusers are attracted to you because you appear quite child-like and naïve and you show a willingness to take on the blame for what they do.

I've long been aware that I have an invisible label that attracts abusers, and I certainly feel childlike. It feels as though I walk through the world as a three year old, bewildered by the adults. Yet I'm also aware that to others I appear cool, calm, and so competent that I don't get training or support in the work world.

Recognising that those thoughts are the things that were said and shown to me as a child has helped me to identify less with them.

I haven't managed that at all. I'm still applying the blame wholly to myself. I keep thinking that I got being a child wrong, that I should have been better at it and then I would have been parented better.

when I was getting annoyed at my emotional child self,

The more all these ideas come to the fore, the more angry I become with myself, and there are some very strong models of rage in my childhood. I think I need to explain to my T that when I say I had a tantrum, I mean that I was jumping up and down shouting the most virulent, foul and destructive abuse at myself, calling myself names I would never use to anyone else and at least one I didn't know I knew (looked it up, it's WW2 military, so I know where that came from).

that emotional part of myself IS a child, and that has helped me to offer her more nurturing, kind words.

Yes. This is the first time I have ever managed to feel any compassion to that usually annoying Emotional Part. My lovely neighbours are fostering two young children, from a badly neglected family. I need to be able to offer myself the same surprising care those children have been discovering.

 

[joeylittle]

A brief thought on core beliefs: I think they require a multi-pronged approach, but part of it is processing through the traumas in your life - because the traumas reinforce the core beliefs.

I deeply, deeply hate myself. It's very hard to live with. It's the thing I need to figure out how to change. There were some things that happened in my early childhood that set me up with that belief, and then that gave me reason to believe it more - but when the big trauma happened to me when I was 13, that's when that core belief - I am disgusting, vile, deserving of death, I hate myself - was just reinforced into fact (in my mind). Some traumas after that one only made it more permanent.

Part of dismantling that one belief is through processing and essentially dis-empowering my trauma. And part of dismantling it is straight up cognitive work, regardless of trauma. And some of it is talking about my parents and my shitty childhood, and getting educated on how it wasn't all my fault all the time. And some of it is learning to forgive myself for my own culpability - not excuse myself, but forgive myself for judging myself so harshly.

I can't list my core beliefs as neatly as you have - it's a pretty tight list, actually. And I'm sure you can trace how the traumatic events served first to instill and then to reinforce those beliefs. Kind of like scrubbing at an oil spot- the harder you scrub, the more the oil bonds to the surface it is on- which just makes it all the more harder to get out.

I don't think you can dismiss your traumas altogether as not having contributed significantly to creating the person you are now. Nor are they the one and only answer - just about 1/5th of it.

 

[Mit]

I think I can relate to this, but have to draw on my own life experiences in order to do so. Like you I question my PTSD diagnoses. Depression, absolutely and anxiety in spades, but PTSD, I'm still unconvinced. I don't consider my childhood experiences to be anywhere near as harmful as most people have suffered who use this forum. But I do try to accept that If I experienced 'it' as traumatising, then it probably was.....

My childhood trauma arose from repeated surgery on my genitals throughout my childhood, and my core beliefs were shaped by adoptive parents who were emotionally distant and cold and could not relate to the psychological impact the repeated surgery was having. Their perspective was that I should be grateful for all the efforts being made to make my genitals 'normal', regardless of how painful, unpleasant, frightening, intrusive and psychologically disturbing etc. the treatments were. I evolved a perspective that I was alone in a battle against the doctors, nurses and my parents.

So my core beliefs evolved and are completely entwined with long drawn out and repeated traumatic experiences, they were experienced and evolved in tandem over many, many years. Hence I have struggled to separate the two, or even recognise that I have negative core beliefs.

I think both trauma and negative core beliefs have to be resolved to gain true healing and happiness. The very fact that you are thinking about these things perhaps suggests you are at least on the right path.

 

[scout86]

The abuse only happened to my body, the parenting affected who I was, who I could be.

The kind of "abuse" that causes PTSD, pretty much by definition, does NOT just happen to the body. There is a psychological component to all of it. For a prisoner of war, there may be physical torture. But there are also the hours spent wonder if or when the next round of torture will take place, and what will it be, and how will you handle it, and you should have done better the last time, and how long will this go on? Will you eventually be rescued? Will you die here? Do you even deserve to be rescued? I think all of THAT reinforces the pathways that lead to PTSD, at least what is referred to as the complex version of it. Sometimes the physical part might be the easiest to deal with.

I think you're underestimating the significance of a "complicated" childhood. Human beings come with a certain amount of pre-programed behavior that is "supposed" to produce the results that give you a "normal" childhood, which, in turn, let you learn things you need to know to be a "normal" adult. You smile, the smile gets returned. You go on to the next developmental step. But what if you smile and sometimes you get screamed at? What if you never know what kind of reaction you're going to get because your caregiver is that unstable? They may not even realize that their behavior is out of line or potentially damaging, but it has the same effect on a child, regardless of the intent. But there's a certain kind of uncertainty, unpredictability, and instability that I think produces the same way of looking at the world in a child as being in a prison camp can in a soldier. And, as far as I know, there is no way any of us get dropped off here prepared to counteract that just by being good enough at growing up in the wrong environment.

I guess what I'm trying to say is your "complicated" childhood probably WAS a trauma, as far as your developing brain was concerned. And it was NOT YOUR responsibility, as an infant and a toddler, to be the kind of child that would "make" the adults in your life do the job they were supposed to do the way it needed to be done. Step outside yourself once and consider a "generic child". Is it really the child's responsibility to be "good" enough at being what the parent wants that it gets it's needs met? How is THAT supposed to work? It doesn't, It just doesn't.