News 7 Billion Population Today - So... When's The Next World War?

[Loloma]

Zipperhead, I appreciate where you're coming from and I hope you know this isn't meant as any criticism of the people in the military. They are brave men and women who lay their lives on the line and I have absolutely no doubt that their motives are to protect us and I respect that tremendously. However, I don't think it's fair to invoke the fallen soldiers in an effort to prevent honest debate and intimidate people (I don't think this is what you were trying to do, but, it ends up having that effect) and prevent them from stating their opposition to what the powers that be (and these are civilian authorities, and, sadly, in many cases, heavily tied in with business entities) are doing with these wars (ie Iraq and Afghanistan).

(((reallydown)))
Totally agree with what your saying. When writing my post I was very apprehensive, maybe my wording could have been a little different I don't know. Most of my personal life has been "be seen and not heard". Criticism and verbal abuse unhinge me. That said, you have reiterated what I was trying to say but in more detail and depth. Thank you :cautious:

 

[Loloma]

Sorry wrong format again :eek:

 

[who am i kim]

I am not sure that it is going to be over water. You have got to factor in the scientist and making and enhancing the resources that we have. Why are we going to fight over oil when can have electricity power by the sun,water, wind power not coal energy. Scientist will make synthetics to replace fossil fuels etc. I think terrorism, greed, religion and power have a lot to answer for. Can't we learn from the past ,and we still have people alive that know about the last world wars, alive today and would not wish it on anyone. I think until that generation has completely gone hopefully we can avoid one. Yes i might have my head buried in the sand but we can live in hope and try to resolve the problems first before taking the course of bloodshed. Nobody wins in war everyone is affected.

 

[anni]

Wow. There are a ton of tangents going on in this discussion. For instance, how did the thread torque from population overload to a kind of bizarre interpretation of Jesus pointing out that we really, really need to keep an eye on poor people? Pretty sure he had zero hidden agenda there and was not sitting on his hands politely so as not to slide in a glancing reference to all those stupid people out there. And where did poor old Africa enter the lists with being the irresponsible party by popping out children right and left? I'm not sure these discussions get anywhere as far as being productive when judgements take the place of facts and objectivity goes out of the window. Opinions are personal, of course, and as free as air. When they're lacking base, or come from something which just sounds unreasonable or judgemental it kind of makes one not be able to take them seriously.

Of course the war in Iraq was because of oil, of course Afghanistan is another political kettle of smelly fish but geesh-both are littered with the bodies of our service men and women. I do not see where it's a cheap shot to bring this up, or ask respect for their sake while discussing any single aspect of who/what/when/where and how we're in there. It's intimidating all by itself to be asked not to, to feel one has to somehow tiptoe around the flag-draped coffins sent home. Why? They went there in the knowledge they were serving their country. This was/is thier perspective, wildly deserved and to imply perhaps they have zero input or place in a discussion of the politics pertaining to the entire area is kind of dismissive. I don't think Zipperhead was invoking fallen soldiers in an effort to discourage honest debate as much as point out they were there, that's all. No one that I can see is squishing anyone by way of who says what, or their opinion. It's not flag waving patriotism, or political extremism which makes one wish to consistantly and sincerely remember that our military people have actually DIED over there, as in Korea and Vietnam. Dicey, arguable political situations also, disremember one of these discussions in the last decades where fallen soldiers were disallowed to be part of the equation. And I'm a screaming Liberal.Just one with a vast conviction that I would not be here to even be one if my military did not provide me with the safe base to say whatever the heck I wish to.

Reactivity is normal, especially here in this forum, with our PTSD issues so it's important to step back sometimes to maybe ascertain if one really is being attacked or if possibly someone is merely adding some aspect of a subject under discussion which is important to them.

 

[Zipperhead]

I guess I am not ready for political discussions yet. I should realise that people are passionate about some views, and those views trigger me. There's nothing better than spending 29 days at a hospital and then coming home only to have people ask you if you murdered anyone. You go over to defend a way of life, just to return home to people asking why you went. I'm out of this discussion. I can't be subjective, and I can't seem to tolerate opposition here. And yet it is that discussion that I was supposedly defending. I hope after therapy maybe I can be a bit more rational. For now, I'm just going to avoid the conflict. I'm not required to read these posts, and so, I'm really punishing myself by doing so. Discuse away, sorry I interfered.

 

[Loloma]

Zipperhead,

I'm sorry if I hurt your feelings, it wasn't my intention. And I do have the deepest respect for the men and who go out there and fight. After what you have been through it's easy to understand how you feel regarding this subject. Take care, all the best.

 

[reallydown]

Zipperhead, I, too, am sorry if I have hurt your feelings as that was not my intention.

Anni, if your post was directed at me, and I suspect it was, please let me respond and then I promise I won't go there again. First of all, the thread is both about the possibility of another World War, as well as the overpopulation of the planet, which might be one of the causes of said war. Therefore, both the talk about war and population booms etc. is in fact relevant. My point re Africa and colonialism etc. was exactly to point out how that continent is now being blamed for the problem (ie blaming the victim, htough of course, other issues come into it as well).

In terms of discussion veering off on tangents, especially with regard to Afghanistan and Iraq etc., I think it is relevant to mention those conflicts as they are tied into the mess we're in and the mess we may potentially find ourselves in in the not too distant future. Second, Zipperhead has brought up some points that I felt merit response. I am not trying to avoid the issue of dead soldiers, I was merely responding to the implication that critiques of the war are tantamount to "sullying the names" of the dead and while Zipperhead may not have meant to do that in order to shut down discussion on the issue (as I indeed acknowledged in my post), I have too often seen the exact same techniques be used in other discussions on similar matters in order to do just that. I am sorry, however, if my post was misinterpreted. Further (and I am sorry if I am misinterpreting your post here, but this too, seems to be directed at me), you imply that the info/opinions in my post are basless and judgemental. You, of course, are free to think of them as such. However, I respectfully disagree with that assessment. I've read extensively on these matters and if there was any judgement, it was for the civilian authorities who've led us into this mess, not the military.

Once again, Zipperhead, I am sorry to have triggered you. I was hoping to contribute to the discussion, not to attack you, even if I did respond to some of the points on which I disagree with you. I hope you are taking good care of yourself and hope you will feel better soon.

 

[ronin47]

You are forever cynical Anthony

 

[Shattered]

I would like to state for the record that we (hubby and I) have not contributed to increasing the population. As we have two children (1 girl and 1 boy), we have only replaced ourselves. :D However, we have not contributed to decreasing the population either.

 

[anthony]

The war on terror has nothing to do with the population control. The numbers killed, whilst tragic, are nothing in comparison to the numbers being born, in all countries involved. That war is not population control... its greed and other motivated issues...

A war or virus, is going to be for population control.

Here is my theory on this. The most susceptible to death from viral attack are young kids and the elderly. Medicine has over-extended itself with extending life over the decades. Keeping people alive is a problem within itself, because it leads to the population problem we have today.

Medicine is currently marvelling at its own magnificence right now, with the foresight to increase the average age of life to 150 in the near future.

Medicines magnificence brings its own problem, being the people must be fed, have water, and then let alone can the human body still work and create income, or does each person still become a liability from an economic viewpoint on society by staying alive that long?

So... one global virus that takes out all the kids and the elderly, as a majority, is my theory on the next equivalent of world war 3, if an actual war itself doesn't occur. Obviously there will be those inbetween who are ill at that time which will obviously die due to lowered immune system or inability for their immune system to fight the virus.

You are forever cynical Anthony

Far fron cynical... more a realism type of person. The first thing out of the media on this was exactly these points... because they're valid points based on current economic and agricultural issues within the world. There are countries starving for lack of food, there are countries throwing the stuff in the bin. Homelessness grows in many countries, for many reasons, but its growing. This isn't cynical, this is realism.

IMHO, being cynical about these real and current issues, would be the equivalent of being in denial about the state of the world... or just ignorance. One or the other.

Its like Greece. The leader there has now decided to put the changes needed to a referendum, instead of making the hard decisions for the country that need to be made. This has pushed the very countries who were willing to help it, but had clauses to helping Greece based on their mismanagement of the country, to now step away from helping it and to let it slide into oblivion and poverty, to crash the European Union and affect lots of innocent people in countries surrounding Greece, all because Greeks want to retire early and only pay taxes and work if they feel like it.

Cynical? No... this is reality and major issues that will affect anyone being ignorant or in denial, that their way of life won't be affected by these changes in other parts of the world.

 

[Loloma]

Go Anthony...

You have more courage than me by writing your post. I moved from Perth to Holland recently and see what is happening here with the Euro Crisis. There is a lot of resentment here regarding the handling of Greece's debt. Other nations in the Union now have to economize in areas such as health and so forth to compensate. Billions of euro's have been wiped off Greece's debt, as they could pay it back.

The European Union didn't look to carefully at some Nation before they accepted them into the Union. I believe they were more interested in the numbers. I think there is now 27 countries at last count. Unfortunately the policies differ radically in areas such as retirement age. In Greece it's 55, France 62. Most other countries it will be 67, Holland is the same. With the number of baby boomers now retired or approaching retirement, the expense of supporting them and their needs will be astronomical. And as you mentioned; " Medicine has over-extended itself with extending life over the decades. Keeping people alive is a problem within itself, because it leads to the population problem we have today."

Early retirement equals less productivity and more expense. Countries such as Greece and France protested, some violent to the proposed raising of the retirement age. It's the others where retirement will be 67 that accepted it. We will just have to sit back and watch it all unfold over the next few months.

 

[Loloma]

Billions of euro's have been wiped off Greece's debt, as they could not pay it back.