General I Wasn't Tracking Closely Enough What Was Going On

[BigBear]

So, Angel (my wife) was just talking on her trauma-diary about a bad event that we were both involved in. I'm going to copy it here, and then try to diagnose where I went wrong. Hopefully if I do, it will help another supporter... Or at least help me remember what not to do...

Bear

I didn't mention that I kind of picked a fight with my husband over something stupid the night we came back.

There were misunderstandings and we were both tired and stressed, but that's not the point. What I want to say is that during the argument he leaned over the dog gate and said something challenging to me in a tension-filled voice. I came completely unglued.

I feel like every time I try to talk about my father's verbal abuse on here that I sound really stupid. Like I'm whining about nothing. But for a few minutes, Bear pushed me right back into it and I remembered how horrible it was. He would pin me in a chair or a corner, or even hold my face. He would tower over me, intimidating with his bulk, his strength, his authority. He would demand that I look at him. I had to look him in the eye while he verbally eviscerated me.

If I tried to protest, or object, or explain he would roar over my words, "I'm talking right now. It's my turn to talk." or "If you would just shut up and listen to me for a minute..." I can't convey in print. It sounds stupid again.

He would get up in my face, force me into immobility, and explain to me in detail and at length how stupid, how foolish, how useless, how stubborn and mean and viciously uncooperative I was. How I forced him to do stuff to me he didn't want to do because of my idiocy. He accused me of emotionally manipulating my entire family, being entirely self-absorbed, and deliberately, DELIBERATELY ruining their lives/evening/party/vacation.

He would pepper me with loaded questions. Any way I answered them I would look guilty. If I tried to explain in my own words, he would shake his head like I was being uselessly stupid and say, "Just answer the question, Angel." "But..." I would sputter. "No, just answer the question." Chewing away at my brain, at my body.... my whole body flooding with stress hormones.... escape, escape, escape.... but there was no escape until he wound down. Until he was satisfied. I would cry and cry and cry while he chewed on, logically demonstrating that everything I had done was specifically designed to torment and enrage him and my mom.

Sometimes he would play a game where, after he had done this for an hour or so, he would force me to choose a punishment for myself. But I had to guess the right punishment, the one he had chosen for me. He made me ask him to spank me. He would give me words to repeat to confess to my crimes. Then, the entire time he had me helpless and naked over his lap and was whipping me, he would measure out the pain interspersed with more lectures, more words about how worthless I was. Or he would make me count. Make it slow... drawn out... so if my control broke and I struggled against him or cried and made sounds he could increase the punishment.

Finally, when it was all over and I was a quivering, weeping pile of jello, he would lock me in my room. Banished. Alone. Trying to scrape some comfort together. I would pull my clothes back on and hide in piles of stuffed animals, under blankets, in my closet.

Fortunately, back in real life, I think Bear realized what had happened and managed to get my attention and explain what he was trying to say and apologize and make it ok. I apologized, too. And I got hugs. And love. And it was ok. But it was just so awful to feel those feelings again... that utter helplessness and pain.

I am trying to show love to my father as he is dying... but sometimes I wonder why.

So, there's this gate with a hooked bungie for closure. It's been catching our clothes and tearing them. Angel askes me to work on the knot tieing it to make it safer. I'm supposed to be some kind of mechanical super genius and besides I'm an eagle scout. I mess with it and get annoyed with it and do some foolish hings with it and go to her to fuss about the children pulling it to tight and it will just go back to how it was.

So, what has just happened that I don't see:

Angel thinks that I don't want to mess with it and that I haven't really tried. When she looks at it, she sees no difference. The reality is that there was not much difference to see and certainly no reason to think that anything was improved. In reality, nothing was improved.

Also, I came in very aggressive and somewhat upset. Who knows what I really said, but with my posture, all she could hear was an attack. I even suppose that I was making a verbal attack on the kids.

This is all before the quoted event above...

So, we get back from this trip. Sure as shooting, the gate tries to rip the clothes right off of my daughter! Angel sets about to stop the madness... She does a beautiful job of making the knot work as it should. I pass by and calls me on not having done the job and "see how easy it was for her." This is not intended as a jab at her. And it all comes roaring down on me how things have gone badly and built up into a real bad one. Magic, I can now make the situation better...

Well, NO! I'd have to actually stopped to think through it fully!

To understand the next part, you have to also know some complicating material. Angel has a tested IQ in something like the 180's. Don't quote me on that. perhaps its enough to say its high... My tested IQ is in the 120's. Kind of dumpy average. I do however have a nice bit of wisdom, when I bother to use it...

 

[KP the nut]

(((Bear))) I want to say something wise and helpful. At the moment I have lost the ability to find words. I am listening though.
Just wanted to tell you that.
KP

 

[Eleanor]

Hi Bear.
This sounds SOOO familiar. I am not seeing your mistake.

I mean except for being an eagle scout and yet not good with knots:devilish:.

Seriously tho, aside from being human (do any of those not become annoyed and snippy from time to time?) what did you do? You triggered her, for sure (and a nasty piece of work her father was to her in those instances, if I may say so) but I don't think you can be Responsible for that.

Sounds to me like she thought you did just right.
Am I missing something?

 

[sea]

The 2 of them were frustrated (him at the gate & at being told it was "easy"/doing things wrong I assume & her at him bc he did it wrong/didn't fix anything) and he reacted with anger and she got triggered.

It sucks. But people get triggered. People get pissed. Y'all are still okay. You may not be responsible for the trigger but I think it is good practice to talk it out. Figure out where the anger is coming from and how to manage it so it is less aggressive. Not only so there aren't triggers but so that communication is smoother as well.

Hope y'all are doing better now.

 

[intothelight]

Bear,

There isn't really anything you did wrong. You leaned over and said something when you were tired and frustrated. Angel, identified the trigger and is working through the issues. You are not the issue, and just be patient as she works through it and do not beat yourself up. Beating yourself up will not only make you feel worse, but it will make Angel feel bad for something she doesn't need to feel bad about.

Bear it is OK to be human. It is also OK for couples to sometimes disagree. What happened beyond that is just PTSD and nothing either of you did to each other. I hope this babbling makes sense.

(((Hugs))) to you.
Deb

 

[angel2write]

I think it's harder, and he feels more responsible, when it's something HE does that triggers me. Intellectually he knows that triggers are unreasonable. When it's something outside the family, he accepts that it happens. But when it's something he's said or done, I think he still feels really guilty. Like he did something wrong he should have known to avoid somehow.

Personally, I think he does a blindingly good job of dealing with me when I am not always rational or responsible. This particular one was half my fault because I pushed one of HIS hot buttons by challenging his competency (as Sea pointed out). Have to remember that our loved ones can have trigger points, too....

Love you, Bear.
A

 

[angel2write]

I thought of one more thing to say here that might be a help to other couples:

Up until the point that I was triggered, we were just having a garden-variety marital spat. People argue. It happens. And we would eventually have settled it out just fine.

But when one particular thing he said triggered me, the entire texture of what was happening changed. And Bear did three very good things:
1) he recognized that I had been triggered and stopped the fight immediately. He put what we were arguing about aside to deal with a bigger issue. That's not easy.

2) He kept trying to reach me through the haze. Eventually he found some things to say that helped me calm down and realize I was at home with my husband and not back in the house with my dad.

3) After I calmed down some, he demonstrated his love and acceptance of me. He didn't make me feel bad for losing it. He let me know that I was still safe and secure with him, even though I had behaved badly. After that, we were able to rationally settle the original argument.

I don't know about anybody else, but I'd give that three thumbs up! :tup::tup::tup:

A

 

[KP the nut]

(((Angel))) (((Bear)))

You two are amazing together. Couples like you are an ideal partnership. It isn't always easy but it is worth it, for the love, friendship, comfort and support. You are blessed to have one another.

 

[BloomInWinter]

It helps if we don't label these reactions as 'a mistake' but 'a response'....then drill it down to what part of it was the beginning where it stops being communication, and enters the PTSD twilight zone.

Sounds like you both processed that magnificently, now. ...and then, we take the helpful responses, and try...try...to do more of those...and try to not choose the ones likely to increase the triggering.

You both deserve to be commended. I don't know many married couple who handle such things in such a healthy manner! Way to go!

 

[BigBear]

I love this... I haven't even gotten to the point (yeah, I know that I am slow! Also I know that you guys are fine to comment any time that you feel like it! Always welcome.) and already the media circus has started. I really don't have the time to finish at the moment, but I will get back to this and make my point!

Love You Guys! ALL of you!

Bear

 

[Eleanor]

@ angel - is there a pattern to the things that 'get through the haze' or is it all ideosyncratic and situational?

Your list/this exchange is very helpful! Thank you. (Insert an emoticon that indicates "respect to the teacher(s)"!)

A thought: We have a "nuisance list" of things that are low level annoying that need "fixing" that build up tensions for us both and provide fertile ground for individual/mutual triggering. Attacking the nuisance list has been very helpful in reducing household stress - and even identifying possible triggers - (e.g., physical crowding.) Sounds like your gate would be high on our nuisance list!

 

[Tinyflame]

Dear Bear, sometimes I get so triggered and I really have no idea 'why' or that it's even happening (that's 'why' I 'feel' as I do or am 'reacting' as I am, at a given moment).
I bet you Angel has had the same experience.

(((((Bear))))), (((((Angel)))))