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Passing Judgment on Severity of Symptoms

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Hee hee I posted prematurely. You have to take in consideration I was posting this while being serenaded by a little one... At the top of her lungs. Thanks for pulling my head out of my ass bec :) What are friends for right LOL?
 
Take the work issue. You have a bunch of people with the severe end. They can't work. The stress overloads on them immediately. They end up with severe health issues. They have no choice but to stop working or face death. They have to struggle on welfare, their husbands wages whatever. Then comes along someone with milder PTSD who says .. well I work because I have no choice. The implication and insult is very clear.

This one was very hard for me too. I hate not being able to work. Choice?? Yeah I had a choice. I could live under a ****ing bridge. In fact before I was with my family I was homeless for a time. That's how much choice I had with regards to working. This is a good example too of how people could word things differently... like think before you post (and believe me I need to think before I post too!!). But it would have been so much better to say, "I am grateful I was able to work". That way there's no implying others are deficient because they "choose" not to.

I was talking to a friend just now who said I should give an example of what I have been told in PMs as well. Here is the typical "encouraging" PM I have received: "Oh Evie, you are such a trooper, I know if you keep plugging away you will get to where I am soon enough". Thankfully I don't get those much anymore, but I have told everyone off. ;)
 
As I feel that the remark of "well I work because I have no choice" was directly aimed at me, I will defend myself. Normally I refuse to get into a pissing contest with people, but this one time I will.

My daughter moved out of my home at 17. At the time I was on public assistance fro Aid to Dependant Children. I was divorced, flaring PTSD. I was a basket case. Anxiety, panic attacks, flashbacks, agoraphobia, anorexic, and bulimic. I was thrown OFF Aid, because I no longer had any dependant children living with me. I was FORCED to go to work or live on the streets.

I have worked for most of my life to overcome PTSD. I have worked my as off to get where I am today. So I apologize if my being BETTER offends anyone here on this forum

I am god damn proud of the work that I have done to better myself and my symptoms...


Wouldn't it be a sad world if NO ONE EVER GOT BETTER?????
 
That's good for you Wendy, but your missing the point. You were ABLE to do it. We are saying not everyone can.
 
One more thing about the work issue. I would LOVE to work right now. If I had a choice, I would totally be working right now. But I don't have a choice, that's the point. I can force myself to work for about 2 days, then I totally crash. I completely shut down. I have lost every job I've tried because I simply cannot take the stress. There's a good reason I'm living with my family right now. I absolutely could not make it on my own without financial assistance. I've been homeless before and I'm certain I could be again. Does everyone here know that more than 60% of all homeless people are mentally ill? Do we say those people have a choice to work or not? Some very insensitive people might. But most realize those people are very ill and don't have a choice. I don't believe not being able to work at the moment is a reflection of my character or lack thereof, I'm simply not capable of it for now and I accept my limitations. It's a goal I hope to achieve in the future though.
 
Evie you feel the way that you do. I feel the way that I do. You feel that you can't work. I felt I had NO CHOICE...It was either work sick, or live on the street. I chose to work because living on the street wasn't what I felt I could do at the time.

I worked sick, would come home and puke. Either on my own or foced myself too.

I'm sorry that you can't work, but I HAD too. I'm glad now that I had no choice. I feel it safed MY sanity.

I'm sorry if anyone on this board feels that being better means that I am looking down at anyone. That's just plain bullshit as far as I am concerned. I was as sick as the rest of you 20 yrs ago.
 
Your still not getting the point Wendy. It's not how I feel, it's the truth, I cannot work. It has been verified by doctors, by myself, by my family. I am very happy for you that you are able to work, but please don't pass judgement on others less capable than yourself.
 
Some of us (myself included) are able to "work sick" because our symptoms are milder than what others experience. It's easier to 'muscle through' it if it's not as bad to begin with.

You don't know how "sick" anyone else is here, not truly, and passing judgement on anyone but oneself is simply disrespectful.

What's to be lost, She Cat, by simply accepting that other people are not able to do what you are because they have a different experience of PTSD?
 
Ok, as this came up again I will add my two cents once again. I spoke with Evie on the phone the other night and she asked me this exact thing, and my answer went something like this:

When I started this forum I used to shutdown any person who went down this road of thought, being its a negative thought pattern. The thinking style of comparison is never a good one in most aspects of life; PTSD being one of them. We have threads here in the new member forum and elsewhere outlining these exact aspects, yet many don't read them or skip through them.

You cannot gauge your PTSD, your healing capacity or trauma to another person, ever. The simply reason is as I have stated previously, and commonsense, is that every person and situation is different and will be interpreted uniquely. This comes back to why you can stand two people side by side, shoot them both in a non-lethal body part, one may get PTSD and one will not. Why? Because one's brain processes the act of being shot uniquely. This is why some people get PTSD and some do not, regardless the trauma, situation or lifestyle.

Kathy summated perfectly the exact variations between people, and those who do not see this need to read it over and over in order to grasp the concept. Because a person works for example, does not mean that person is better off than someone who doesn't work with PTSD. The person who works may have little choice, so they counter act their PTSD with work, they drink or smoke heavily to cope with it, they medicate themselves heavily to cope, and the big one is.... some who have PTSD are actually workaholics as workaholism is a form of medication to help them cope with their PTSD. Again, every person is different and no two people can ever be compared the same, regardless of certain similarities with symptoms, their severity of symptoms will be different.

Kathy refers to those with severe PTSD. Well, I am a veteran who was diagnosed with severe PTSD. When Kathy refers to combat PTSD, etc, these are references that are discussed as coming in 2012 with the production of the DSM V. They are discussed only as possible categorizations to PTSD diagnoses and yet to be confirmed. Even those do not outline, nor could two people with the same diagnosis be compared.

My brother-in-law has PTSD from being a medical officer aboard a Navy ship. He dealt with the wounded only, never seen action on land, yet he has PTSD from fixing soldiers who had been wounded and civilians also. He works, yet I cannot. Why? Because his trauma is far different from mine, his brain processes his trauma differently, yet we both have the same illness. He chooses to drink and smoke, which are known aids in combating the symptoms of PTSD. I used to cope doing the same thing, though I was drinking and smoking myself to death. Now, I do neither and must find other ways to keep my stress levels low, one being not to work and create myself undue stress that would force me to be medicated. Actually, even if medicated I would likely kill someone if provoked enough. Big difference in trauma, big difference in brain processing, big difference in symptom severity and duration.

You cannot compare trauma, ever.... you cannot compared symptom severity. What works for one may not work for another. What every person with PTSD can do though, is achieve a more healthy lifestyle in their own time finding what works best for them.

The facts are though, people lie. Am I calling everyone here a liar? NO. What I am saying though is that even most people I have worked with here had lied to me, they kept secrets from me that hindered the healing process. You do it to your therapist, you do it here, you do it with your families.... the facts are, people lie. Some are very honest and open, the majority don't tell the full story to make themselves look better than they are, which means they lie. If you lie to yourself, your still lying at the end of the day, regardless how honest you are with anyone else. If your honest with yourself though not totally with others, then still your lying. Sorry, but the facts are; people lie.

So knowing this very important fact, no person should ever be comparing themselves or another against another with PTSD, symptoms or trauma, as the gauge is not even comparable on a realistic measure of accuracy. All you do is lie to yourself, lie to others and piss people off.

The best thing any person can do is forget all that nonsense to begin with, and just work on what works best for them, though knowing it may help another, yet may make someone else worse. Learning to manage PTSD is an experimental process. This forum just helps narrow the experimentation down for each person, or helps a person find what can work for them through others experience. It is not a pissing contest for comparison though.

People here try and gauge themselves against me, yet I still never figured that one out either. I manage myself quite well the majority of the time, function extremely well and can interact with society quite well also. All that though, I still cannot work because the stress would be so overwhelming to me that all these other aspects would be no more. I would end up in a hospital.

Evie and I spoke about avoidance, and how avoidance of some things are good, and some avoidance is bad. Typically, any aspect surrounding your trauma will hurt you, although some can be beaten with exposure therapy, some will never be beaten and instead must be avoided. The difference though is that a person must push themselves beyond their capable limits to expose themselves to the problem and use commonsense and logical solutions to learn how to move through it. If a problem cannot be moved past with the help of professionals and techniques known to work, then sometimes avoidance is the best solution. The overall aim though in management is to have very minimal aspects that you will ever avoid, compared to what you used to avoid though now interact within your life.

Anything that is essential for life is not logical to avoid, ie. driving, shopping, entertainment for relaxation. So even if your PTSD is from an MVA, you must achieve a level of interaction surrounding motor vehicles, because its not logical to avoid them as that would limit you entirely to your home. Meaning even if you never drive one again, you can be a passenger without fear, you can walk the streets with cars driving by, etc etc.... though even then it is like falling off a horse, you must get back on.

I got hurt some years ago pretty bad in a motorbike accident, though even whilst I still had broken bones I was back on a motorbike and riding it slowly down the street to ensure I didn't grasp a fear of riding them, especially considering I enjoy them so much. The longer you leave something the worse it becomes to interact once again with it. Avoidance is a logical strategy for some things if you have tried to first engage them many times with no sight of improvement. If you find improvement, then you continue exposure in order to learn how to engage it once again.

Overall though.... with all this in mind, you cannot compare any aspect of trauma or healing with another, as they are unique and cannot be compared nor gauged as every single aspect is unique. The only thing we have in common is PTSD, the symptoms, though not the severity nor the trauma nor the healing. Two veterans who have PTSD will have unique trauma. You can attempt to go around the problem all day discussing each trauma, though you will never find a similarity and only that you both have the same thing, PTSD; and even that will be different for each.
 
What everyone is missing is the fact that I worked SICK!!!!!!! I was a basket case, and yet I forced myself every frigging day because I had too.

What I did was because I HAD too. YOU all do what you have to. I am NOT saying anyone has to work, or do anything that they can't do. I do for me what I need to, and have to. What you do for you is what you have to.

Yes I use work to help ease my symptoms. If I was home all day long I would go NUTS thinking..... No Thanks!!!!!!!! I would rather work.

If you can't work...Fine, no one said you had to.......

End of my rant.
 
There is a thread I responded to earlier: "Sensitivity to light, noise, and touch", and a sentence in it that I would love to have time to clarify, yet despite my efforts late this afternoon, this time simply does not exist and so I'll have to get back to it.

However, I like to say in response to the title of this thread, I really don't think IMHO, that there so much a matter of PTSD sufferers passing judgements upon other sufferers, as there is a problem with some individuals comparing rather than identifying.

It's been a number of months now, since I wanted to start a thread on the principle of "Identify don't compare, it's far more effective", and start the thread with personal insight through experience.

Statements of fact, are none more than statements revealing fact.

What I see apparently differs what from what others are seeing. I don't so much see people passing judgement upon severity of other PTSD sufferers symptoms, but I've seen and written statements of fact and or experience, and I've seen people who are responding at times in over sensitivity to 'chooses of words' and/or are perhaps doing the judging or comparing themselves.

Anyhow, today has become one hell of a day for me filled with anxiety from my triggers. I own these triggers and I am responsible for them. Just as others own their unfactual comparisons.

Not a perfect post, but with little to no time and countless interruptions here, hell I'm posting it anyways, or I'll never ever be able to ever post anything.

Hope
 
A slippery slope

My experience working while sick..........
Having been a single parent with 6 kidz at home, youbetcha it wasnt easy...i worked graveyard managing a big local chainstore, had my then 16 yr old at home taking care of/watching the kidz while i was gone. Dang, i was so proud of myself being able to work and support my family. So many outside influences just knew i couldnt do it by myself. Boy...was i proving them wrong! there i was....wow! SO NOT WORTH IT!!
Lemme tell ya...I worked sick for years, draining myself further and further until i was almost totally empty..refusing to stop and take time for my inner healing. compounding and multiplying alot of my issues even further. all the while convincing myself that it was "the best thing for me to do in order to support my family...so what if it was at my expense?? thats what Moms do, right?" WRONG!!!
it ultimately only made trying to stay on my road to recovery WORSE, LONGER AND MUCH MUCH HARDER than it already was!!! all the while durning my working phase, i was participating in multiple therapies, individual, group, and of course, being the spastic parent that i am always needing to know im doing things the right way with my children.....individual for them and family therapy also. I wanted to make sure they had outside professional people to help "lead the way" and provide support for them also. Heck, we were up to having someone having a session every single day of the week it seemed! And my hours were graveyard, lets not forget. My family and I plugged along, doing what society says the responsible parent does and provide without assistance for their own family. Not being a burden or debt to anyone.
I guess what im trying here to express here is, altho i thought it was the best thing for me to do financially at the time, it finally pushed me over the edge and i crashed BIGTIME!! reality forced me into having to take an "open leave of absence." To this day i have to wonder how much farther in my recovery *if any* would i be had i not pushed myself into working like i was doing. Sure, i "handled" it for a period of time...but it was a slippery slope downhill from there. So, here i sit, knowing that work is not an option for me at this point even yet still....all the therapy, meds, support, tricks, keys, i have to accept that its just not my time to be out there. There are days when im feeling good enough and actually entertain the thought "hey, i could do it" then BAM! i get hit with all kinds of things that prove to me, no way. Im just not far enough along. Working while sick....It works for some people, and i am one of the ones who knows that didnt work for me. Will it ever? who knows? i try not to beat myself up about it. Right now my job is to hold myself together enough for my children and myself. Sure, the monetary pay SUCKS, and im getting more overtime then i ever did in the real world workforce...but i guess working outside the home will come *hopefully* when im emotionally healthy and ready. Only time will tell. Until then, i have to remember, some folks just deal with it better than i was able to. Wish them all the best and hope they stay off that slippery slope that leads to the black hole.
 
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