My Hostile Reaction

[StarChild]

You are allowed to ask questions and frankly I didn't find your response hostile to that thread

You bet! I wholeheartedly disagree with you on that one. I read the other thread and must say, in this case, I'm sure it wasn't easy to stay calm for the OP, when someone throws their own personal frustrations and assumptions like sh*t on you. And, I see it as dishonesty, to open this thread instead of simply take responsibility for your actions and apologize at Caity. Instead you create this thread and try to gather people around you, only to justify your actions. Because that's what this thread was created for!

if you'd seen the 5 - 6 responses I typed and deleted you would have seen the hostility!

How right you are @Sighs, the ones you didn't delete were still enough to get your message...
I admit, there are lots of just curious, insensitive wannabe trainees, counsellors or whatever they call themselves. But from what she wrote, and how she wrote it, I didn't feel condescending attitude but quite an effort to understand and learn from us. But tell me, how is one supposed to (re)act when being attacked, like she was? Start to fight? Start to explain, or even justify her questions? Which only would add fuel to the fire, wouldn't it?

I had just enough insight and self control to realise that I was reacting to other experiences in my life and that taking it out on someone who is only seeking to learn and help was not productive.

Oh really? Then what would be the next logical step for you to do?

I disagree with all of you on this whole thread! Now you can give me a sh*t storm if you must, I so don't care. But I won't discuss this any further with any of you. Have a nice day ladies.

 

[desiderata310]

Love you, @TreeHugger !
For the record, I did PM her and offer to answer questions about MY experience... as far as I can comfortably talk about.

I have to say that I get very anxious when I get notices that someone here is "following" me. (especially if they happen to be "new") I actually will stop posting for a while and simply check to see what that person posts before I start posting again. The therapists in training.. yeah... the fact that I PM'd her... it's pretty f*cking scary for me.

Right or wrong, good or bad, I am trying to sort out who is dangerous and who isn't and my way of doing that may not be altogether health but it's where I am at right now.

 

[Justmehere]

@Desiderata - I'm glad someone sent Caity a PM offering to answer her questions privately! I do hope she is able to get her questions answered. It is really hard to sort out who is dangerous and isn't... It's something I struggle to figure out too. Even harder with therapisty-types because of my own past...

@TreeHugger - More perspectives to the discussion help people grow. I'm glad for your courage to express a different opinion.

I disagree with all of you on this whole thread! Now you can give me a sh*t storm if you must, I so don't care. But I won't discuss this any further with any of you. Have a nice day ladies.

Since I am one of the people you disagree with, I would like to say that I don't intend to give you a "sh*t storm." It's kind of hard to figure out how to respond when you come on and make strong accusations that someone was attacking, and the pre-emotively state you will not discuss it any further. Shutting down any possibility of any discussion with you about your remarks prior to anyone responding to you doesn't really further the discussion or debate. I respectfully ask that you re-consider.

This is my statement of my opinion below to your remarks. I hope that I can try to demonstrate that disagreement doesn't = starting a sh*t storm. It simply means expressing that I have a different opinion than you and reasons why my opinion is different. Just as your opinion is welcome, so are those of who you disagree with, even if you choose to never read them.

And, I see it as dishonesty, to open this thread instead of simply take responsibility for your actions and apologize at Caity. Instead you create this thread and try to gather people around you, only to justify your actions. Because that's what this thread was created for!

Sighs didn't start a thread called, "The therapist trainee who is terrible." Or even "The therapist trainee who caused my hostile reaction." She titled it "My Hostile Reaction." Note that she starts off with "my." It was about her reaction, which she appears to be owning. Sighs didn't really ask anyone else if they even had the same reaction to @Caity. It seems clear that her intent in starting this thread was to open up a space to process her own reaction which she owns may be due to her own stuff.

Why is my reaction to this so hostile? I'm furious. This must be some kind of projection because the poor girl hasn't done anything wrong.

She literally states the "poor girl has not done anything wrong." That's the opposite of an attack. She actually compassionately defends the original poster.

On that other thread, Caity didn't respond to sighs initial questions, and sighs naturally made her questions more clear. Then sighs started this thread to process why her reaction became more strong, and starts off by defending the original poster that she was feeling very strong negative feelings about. Just because some people had similar reactions to sighs doesn't change sighs intent behind starting this thread.

I'm sure it wasn't easy to stay calm for the OP, when someone throws their own personal frustrations and assumptions like sh*t on you.

In this particular case, I am not very concerned about the original poster maintaining her calm. I don't think she got as warm of a welcome as some others do, but at the same time, I'm not too concerned. Then again, maybe this is my own stuff coming into play myself. First of all, disgreement isn't attacking someone. I don't think anyone was trying to attack her or did actually attack her. I think that we all expressed an honest opinions about Caity's posts. I don't see how that is any more attacking than your expression of your opinion about sighs posts.

I'm also not concerned about the original poster's calmness evaporating as quickly as others because they represented themselves as someone in training to be a therapist. This is different from posting for personal support. She was posting because of a school assignment and as part of her training. Part of the territory of being a therapist is handling transference, especially traumatic transference, where people throw all kinds of reactions at the therapist that have nothing to do with the therapist. Of all the posters on the forum, Caity should be among the most equipped to handle people with strong reactions to her questions. I don't say this to condone or excuse actual hostile reactions to therapists or trainees, but it's part of what happens. One of the best things to do about hostile reactions is to recognize it, pause, and begin to figure out what fits the situation and what is more due to the past. This is especially true for people who have PTSD from traumatic relationships in the past or people who have been abused by people in positions of power, authority and trust (like me) and have encounter bad therapists in the past.

To process that reaction and possible transference on Caity's thread would have probably thrown the thread off topic. Caity's thread was about Caity. Our reactions to Caity are about more than just Caity. Maybe it would have been better for all of us to process our reactions on that thread, and not thrown it off.

But from what she wrote, and how she wrote it, I didn't feel condescending attitude but quite an effort to understand and learn from us.

I agree. I don't think Caity had ANY intent to be condescending. I personally believe Caity was trying to engage us, but was missing the mark pretty badly on how to engage us. Which is part of the learning process itself. Also, I don't think anyone else actually "attacked" Caity for intentionally being condecending to us.

For argument's sake, let's say that Caity was attacked...

But tell me, how is one supposed to (re)act when being attacked, like she was? Start to fight? Start to explain, or even justify her questions? Which only would add fuel to the fire, wouldn't it?

No, there are many other ways to respond to being attacked that do not add fuel to the fire.

One way to respond to being attacked is to set a boundary and bow out of the thread. Another to is state reasons why you disagree with the attacking statements, and to do so without name-calling or being accusing in nature. If someone else gets riled up by those reasons and opinions, that is that persons reaction to own.

Part of the healing process for many people with PTSD is learning that it is safe to disagree and that there are healthy ways to disagree that are not the same as being attacking. I am not very good at it myself. I am learning. I understand that it is your opinion that sighs and others, including myself, handled our reactions in the wrong way. What do you think would have been the better way to handle it? Can you explain your perspective on that further?

 

[Rumors]

I didn't see or respond to the thread, however there simply is no way I would share intimate details with a novice so they could learn. I know that is shallow, but it took me a lifetime to earn these scars by professional assholes. I certainly don't want a novice adding more!!! LOL. No really, it does seem a little unnerving. I wish her luck, but I can't help her because I am too busy adding bricks and mortar to my wall!!! Lol. Great thread! Made me think!

 

[Kintsugi]

I didn't think anyone was being hostile. Actually, I suspected no one would reply, or a couple of people would reply being extremely rude. Neither happened. I decided not to respond. I would have probably been sort of mean, and I'm no longer the spring chicken firecracker I was when I first joined this forum years ago. :)

I don't think the responses given could be called unexpected, either. I belong to another forum centered around a medical condition and cultural community to which I do not belong. I'm there to learn. But most of the people, especially students, who join the forum there asking questions get flat-out rejected very rudely and finally by the community there. They get those students all the time, and they're frankly sick of being treated like lab rats themselves.

I've often thought while on that forum that a similar thing happening here might be met with similar hostility. Fortunately, our condition tends to involve lots of therapy and conscious communication patterns, while the other forum's condition does not, so I guess this forum was a lot more civil about responding!

Nevertheless, my gut reaction as well as the nicest thing I thought to say was "Your professor gave your class a very poorly thought-out assignment, and now you are bearing it out in an equally poorly coodinated fashion."

 

[scout86]

But I won't discuss this any further with any of you.

I have to confess, as one of the people being disagreed with (I guess) that I'm kind of disappointed to hear this. I think I usually learn something when I listen to and discuss things with people who have opposing views.

JMO, I didn't see anything really wrong with @Sighs replies to the other thread. Yes, it was obvious she had reservations, but she's entitled to that, I think. The OP asked for engagement, questions would be part of that, sometimes. (BTW, I kind of hope the OP comes back into the discussion at some point.) Posting THIS thread, I thought was great. I actually had the same question of myself. There was something about the other thread that made me uncomfortable and I wasn't sure what. I thought that discomfort was interesting and maybe worth thinking about. I was kind of glad to hear that I wasn't the only one, and was interested in hearing what others thought. Starting a new thread seemed more appropriate that hijacking the other one, since it's a different topic. It's even a topic that the OP of the other thread might find interesting, if she reads it.

@TreeHugger , I'm sorry you don't think the rest of us would be willing to discuss this with you in a fair and reasonable way!

 

[Deleted member 1860]

I honestly don't think anyone's reaction was *wrong* as nobody attacked her. Maybe we weren't all cuddly, but at the same time, for MOST of us, this is a community where we can come and feel safe(er) being that this is a community of our peers. Most of us don't get that out there. Most communities don't have groups for just PTSD survivors. Some of us may know one or two people with PTSD, but I doubt that anyone knows a community as large as this one. I think we have a right to feel defensive. We come here to get away from the rest of the world who doesn't understand, we come here to get away from the psycho-babble of therapy. We come here to seek others who are in an *equal* place as either a sufferer or a supporter. I can't get another one of *YOU* (ie any other supporter or sufferer) out there in the real world, but I can find myself hundreds of therapists within a 20 mile radius. So yes, THIS is why I get a little up in arms when an outsider comes in to examine us like lab rats. This is a community that we cannot find anywhere else. This is a unique place. Now don't get me wrong, if a therapist or student comes in to simply observe, I have no problem with that (as anyone can do that). I will say that I wouldn't go so far as to befriend them and make them a part of the community. No, I wouldn't be rude or anything like that. But, as I've said before, these communities form for a reason. Like it or not we have a common bond and nobody else can EVER understand what it is like to have this kind of support. If you're on the outside looking in, you'll never get it. It wasn't until I found another person with my same trauma that I finally lost my feeling of being "the only person in the world" who felt that way, I was an island unto myself. If this community helps other sufferers and supporters feel less alone, then I guess I don't really see the point to opening ourselves up to others. If people have questions related to PTSD, they are always free to use the research forum. Of course, I can't personally stop therapists and such from coming on here, nor will I be rude to them, but at the same time this is about my healing, and beyond throwing out a tidbit or two, I won't delve into things. Its sort of like well yes, it would be great if we could all help the up and coming therapists of the world understand PTSD a little bit better, but the risk to my own healing is too great as I'd inevitably hit on something bad. So in that sense, I'll leave it up to others to "train" the new therapists!

 

[Melissa D]

I am betwixt by the request and understand the hostility that is provoked also. I agree with Solara that we all come this forum as a "refuge" of sorts. We know that we are able to safely and openly discuss our experiences and concerns- especially about counselors, here. It definitely feels a little invasive when someone openly admits that they are on here for a very different purpose. The admission effectively changes the undertones. We are not here to showcase our lives or to be used as educational examples for some college course or to teach someone how to be psychologists.

I believe, in general, many of us perceive counselors choose their profession because they have shared experiences or understand psychological trauma because of some emotional/ spiritual/ ethereal connection. They genuinely know what it is like to be in this dark place! When a counselor has very little to no personal psychological experiences to refer to, it feels like they are patronizing all of us who do! It feels fraudulent, fake, whatever!

Now that I have had my PTSD reaction, I will give my logical one!
All that being said, if a counselor is new to their field, and wants information to help them focus on a specific area of expertise, why would they not go to a user group that is specifically for that topic? At least she want's to learn more, know more about PTSD and how the mind of someone with PTSD works. Because we all know, our brains definitely work differently than someone without PTSD.

 

[Kintsugi]

I really don't think the fact that she is a student in psychology or the fact that she registered here and openly announced herself is what provoked mixed hospitality. In my experience here, there are many times researchers or grad students will come here asking members to take part in a poll or soliciting volunteers for a specific questionare or study, and these users don't seem to get any backlash at all. I think the issue here is that the student was specifically sent on assignment by a professional to go to an online forum and somehow interact with those who have PTSD, and that's it.

It's the difference to me between putting up a sign at an AA meeting asking members for participation in a university study and attending an AA meeting to observe subjects, like a naturalist looking at animals in their natural habitat. Imagine the difference between a guest coming at the end of an AA meeting to say a relevant study is being conducted which needs volunteers or asking members to fill out a survey for research versus someone randomly showing up at the meeting itself and saying, "Hi, I'm a grad student, and I am not an alcoholic. My professor sent me here to chat about nothing specific. Go!"

It's not the student's fault the assignment is stupid. The assignment is stupid, though.

My advice, if the grad student is looking on at this thread (she should be; this is quality stuff): come up with some specific questions, short and sweet, maybe five or a half dozen, and ask members if they are willing to share their responses through private messaging. If you worry your professor meant you needed to talk on a public thread, then perhaps you should include a question about how appropriate it is for psychology students to approach a close-knit mental health community as an outsider for the sake of homework. Maybe your professor will learn something, too.

I'm going to just throw it out there that I doubt this professor is seasoned in the field of trauma. And, dear student, if s/he claims that s/he is, I would take heed moving forward in following his or her advice on the subject of clients with PTSD. My T would laugh her butt off if I told her about this assignment, in kind of a sad way. :(

 

[scout86]

I know the dangers of mind reading, but I can't help but wonder about the silence from the student who started this conversation. I just looked. She was last on the forum yesterday afternoon. (Not sure how the time zone thing works, that's what it says on her profile page.) I find it interesting/curious that she hasn't replied to any of the comments or questions on her thread. So, was the point to start something then sit back and see what happened? I THOUGHT the point was "engagement". But, in that case, I would have expected some "back" to follow the "forth" she got from all of us. Now I'm REALLY starting to feel like a lab rat! :wideeyed:

 

[digger]

I find it interesting/curious that she hasn't replied to any of the comments or questions on her thread. So, was the point to start something then sit back and see what happened?

Equally possible is that she has seen this thread as well as the one she started, realised that she has touched a nerve with some people, which looking at her original post doesn't appear to have been her intention, and is perhaps unsure of what the best thing for her to do would be now?

Perhaps she is trying to understand the responses before responding any further so as not to upset people more?

Perhaps she is upset herself? Trauma sufferers don't hold the monopoly on that one ;)

Or perhaps she's doing what some people suggested she should do and is reading more of the site content?

Just some alternative possibilities

 

[Ed Norton]

I personally appreciated her humility. I think that a therapist learning directly from trauma survivors is one of the best ways to learn trauma based therapy. I think that her intentions were admirable and I feel that she is trying to be a better therapist.