Relationship Carers Of Those With Combat Ptsd: Let Them Be!

[LoyalOne]

It's mortally hard. 'How DARE you take that beautiful, broken body that has survived so much, and abuse it so badly?!?!' I want to scream at him.

He has told me that if I 'knew everything he did,' I would no longer like him or think he is a good person. I think he is testing, like you said, to see if I meant it when I said I wasn't going to leave him. So it is an excellent question - where is the line on accepting who they are and how they feel, without tolerating abusive or destructive behavior, without making them feel like we are cutting them off?

That's kind of what I meant when I posted my first post on here, 'How do I maintain distance without pushing him away?' It's not what the thread ended up being about, but I think your question, May, is what I was reaching for in my head when I came on here.

 

[JS786]

He has told me that if I 'knew everything he did,' I would no longer like him or think he is a good person.

I can't even count the number of times my now-ex boyfriend sufferer has said that to me. "You wouldn't want to touch me or be near me... you'd be terrified," etc.

One time I actually called him on it by saying, "Try me." He proceeded to tell me, in grim detail, about ONE situation, during ONE day, during ONE deployment and I immediately understood why he was so "messed up."

And I think you're right, it comes down to testing and pushing boundaries.

where is the line on accepting who they are and how they feel, without tolerating abusive or destructive behavior, without making them feel like we are cutting them off?

I ask myself that all the time. But is there *actually* an answer??

I think it depends on the person. For me, it was just honesty and he could take what I said as he felt appropriate. I would tell my ex which behavior I didn't like or made me uncomfortable, whether it was PTSD related or not. I would try to tell him in the gentlest way possible if I didn't like a way he was talking to me (I recall a "Do you realize you talk to me like I'm a child sometimes?" comment once) or didn't approve of his behavior (like him finding humor in talking about our sex life in a group of people).

My opinion is the "line" you're referring to differs from sufferer to sufferer.

-js

 

[Jacquie]

Its not about you forgiving him. Its about him being able to forgive himself. And looks like right now he just cant do that. Its eating him from the inside. Doing things he didnt want to do, would normally never do, but did. Internal conflict.

We need 2 baskets.

<== War stuff PERSON Civilian stuff ==>

In war. Shit happens. Often. Its NOT normal. It applies to being on active service ONLY.

Can he put things in separate baskets instead of seeing it as traits of himself?

 

[JS786]

I know it wasn't about me forgiving him, I apologize if it came across that way, that wasn't my intent. I just meant that him telling me this story gave me a little more insight into what was happening within his brain on the day to day. I dont think these things that are essentially forced on people are easy to forget.

He needs to figure out a way to separate what happened with who *he* is as a person. I think subconsciously he sees himself as a terrible person, etc. because of the things he did while overseas ("I've seen and done things in the military that you wouldnt even believe, it was that crazy," he told me once), but that's not the truth of it at all: there are so so many great qualities that he possesses, but he's just blinded by the "bad" stuff right now that he can't make peace with himself.

It's going to take him time to get there. He's only been out of the service for about year after roughly 6 years of active duty but I really truly hope that he goes away to the clinic(s) this time.. for real. I think it would be really helpful for him.

 

[May1321]

Can he put things in separate baskets instead of seeing it as traits of himself?

Why is my first reaction to this question one of complete loss but laughter and the feeling "OMG... I just asked this very question!" To explain, my laughter is more so coming from a place where I feel at a complete loss.

I don't know if this is the right area to discuss this but seems to relate.... Couple other points first to quote...

"Do you realize you talk to me like I'm a child sometimes?"

In war. Shit happens. Often. Its NOT normal. It applies to being on active service ONLY.

As we all know... each of our service members is different just because they are, but many things seem to obviously for us all be the same. I read so many posts and I've asked myself the same questions, heard the same things, have approached him with the same 'lines'.

I realized something just this morning, as it seems we try to work with one thing but then something that sparks questions in my mind and is so irrelevent to him uncover other things that just don't seem "normal". I know I may sound confusing but bare with me as I'm still trying to sort things out.

Yes, my boyfriend has seen and done some things that aren't even imagineable. I've been able to over time ask him in depth questions, as well as he's been open to share some of these experiences as for the most part, he realizes it was part of his duty and seperate from anything he would imagine doing if it hadn't been his job. Our biggest issue is how much stress can he handle as he is obviously exhausted from the stress, the recurring nightmares, the jumpiness and paranoia, etc.

What I've come to discover though, and thank you for pointing this out, is though I can seperate his PTSD/war time from the man I know he is trying to be and easily forgive him for his past because it was just a part of his duty, I'm starting to notice that his job in the military has habits that have carried over into his personal life. I don't feel he's a threat to my welfare or anyone else, but I don't think it is something that is going to change. He feels it is his duty and in some wierd way, I feel like he's still in some sort of war that I am not allowed to be a part of but again, I am not sure if I should be. That's the forgiveness, acceptance part that is not war related, yet is?

Puzzled.

 

[LoyalOne]

It's funny, isn't it (in a bad way) that it is easier for us to forgive the terrible things they have done than it is to forgive the troubling behavior that results from it?

 

[May1321]

I wonder why I'm not just appalled by his "numbers" so to speak of what happened over there. But it was his job, and that is something you can not change. For instance, if we were walking down the street and someone threatened my life, he would take theirs. I don't hesitate for a second if that is right or wrong, that is what anyone would do, I truly believe, to protect those they care about as if it was their duty.

Where the struggle is is enabling behaviour that may be brought on by their experience or PTSD which, at least in our case, he's been diagnosed with. He's been told the symptoms. Symptoms can be corrected. YES. We will always struggle with this and that to some extent, but what is hard to be patient with is for me much similar to how he manages his health.... i.e. Doctor told you you have to lose weight and change your diet to lower your cholesterol and get your blood pressure into control, which also means you are to quit smoking. I know this is a difficult thing to do and may require even "I" need to make some changes in order to help you accomplish your goals, but if you give up every time a bad influence comes along, then don't come whining to me when it's not all better. You knew what you had to do, and you are responsible for those actions.

So, not to be a complete hard ass, but I know what I need to do as his partner to help him along the way as he takes the steps to heal his PTSD. But if you are aware of what you are doing and still doing it and just using PTSD as the excuse, then you really aren't helping me help you, or helping yourself and that is the part that is unforgiveable, I think. Knowing what may be a result of your time in combat yet ignoring the knowledge of it because it may seem like too much energy to fix it.

There are people who are going to say - Well, you knew he had PTSD and if he doesn't want to fix it then that is his problem, you have the choice to walk away or not be in that relationship. - well, that is easier said than done. As with any relationship, in various ways we've all invested. How much he knows along with how much he shares with me which includes promises, goals, timelines, etc. is what I base my "boundaries" by. This along with a doctor's diagnoses of the extent of their trauma is what varies between sufferers, and therefore each of us as supporters. If he was completely clueless, just knew he had bad dreams but didn't realize how much it really was affecting everything else in his life... then I could forgive more things. But I'd say in my case, we're a third of the way there to breaking it down... next is the steps to change... I have to say *knock on wood* he hasn't had a cigarette in almost a month!!!! :tup:

 

[LoyalOne]

This is a hard thought to phrase, but - sometimes I think Sgt doesn't want to not tell me things because they were so awful, but because he is afraid they are not awful enough.

Kind of like it ties into his feelings of survivor guilt and shame over perceived 'failure.' I think he is afraid that the things that sent him over the edge are not bad enough to 'excuse' how wrecked he is. Like other Marines had it worse, or he should have sucked up and dealt with it better. I feel like he lives in terror that he will bare the darkest secrets of his broken soul to me, and I'll be like, 'Oh, is that all?'

 

[LoyalOne]

I know this is a difficult thing to do and may require even "I" need to make some changes in order to help you accomplish your goals, but if you give up every time a bad influence comes along, then don't come whining to me when it's not all better. You knew what you had to do, and you are responsible for those actions.

I hate this part.

I have told him; 'You realize that if you drink a bottle of whiskey, eat at Taco Bell, smoke a pack of trash cigarettes, and get an hour of sleep, of course you are going to be shaky, helpless and wacked-out the next day?' I mean, DUH - so would Keith Richards, for God's sake! Of course you feel like you are going to die !

If he followed his doctor's instructions, got some sleep, ate good food, and stopped drinking like a pirate, gosh - maybe he wouldn't be such a hollow-eyed wreck, and we could work on helpping his non-self-sfflicted problems.

Congratulations on the smokeless month, by the way! That is AWESOME!!! :) Quitting is so awfully hard.

 

[May1321]

This is a hard thought to phrase

Loyal, I'd copy the whole thought but just thought I'd start with that. I can definitely see that... my brother is one of those. I agree with the idea you have behind it, too. We could go on and on, couldn't we? But that back to the part that forgiveness really isn't ours to give or find within...

<== War stuff PERSON Civilian stuff ==>

As much as we want to help them get through this, all we can do really is wait. Wait while they work through it in their way and encourage in what ways we can 'in the present' that they continue to take care of the man/woman that is left... encourage the good health by pointing out that if they didn't do that, they may feel better; encouraging the exercise or talking to a psychologist.

Whether they did a lot over there, or a little, the beast within is the same and the more they try to contain it the harder the fight... much like us constantly texting them or calling them trying to get a response when they are trying to isolate. Getting healthy in ways that are easily controllable like health and exercise and finding ways to get restful sleep are the more tactful ways to approach taking down the beast. That's the best we can do as friends, lovers, family members, spouses, supporters. Leave the psychologist stuff up to the professional psychologist which is going to be the person who helps him/her find it within them to forgive and accept who they were and realize who they are meeting you eventually - we hope and pray - here in the present :)

 

[LoyalOne]

Oh, I don't press him for anything mental like that. I try to only get on his case about normal, vanilla stuff I would get on any friend's case about, like call your brother if you get too tipsy to drive home, don't sleep in the car you goofball, etc.

Sorry, to clarify - I made it clear I'll listen to war talk if he wants to talk, but I let him drive the whole conversation. If he is in a good mood, the LAST thing I want to do is take it away from him.

Yeah, trying to get him to sleep better and eat better gets way more play than stomping in and demanding he get therapy. Agreed. He actually calls me now to report when he gets a good night's sleep. :rolleyes: It is kind of adorable.

 

[May1321]

If he is in a good mood, the LAST thing I want to do is take it away from him.

He actually calls me now to report when he gets a good night's sleep.

Agreed! ;)