CPTSD Traits?

[LeoTheLion]

Bluecat to be honest you did a great job!... very helpful and information

 

[bluecat]

has been (generally) described as PTSD (often) with Borderline Personality issues.

I like how you summed this up James!

 

[bluecat]

Since this is a CPTSD Thread, I am hoping to discuss more about traits that are unique to CPTSD and differitiate it from PTSD. I realize many traits are common.
What traits do you think are unique to CPTSD. Below is another list I came across

Hi Grandpalw,

What you're listing is a mix of both, very specific symptoms that actually fall under the broader categories from E. Vermilyea and some of the same broader categories themselves. For ex. "jumpiness" would fall under hypervigilance, "difficulty starting or completing tasks or projects" would fall under dissociative adaptation, specifically fluctuation in skills etc.

The problem with listing very specific symptoms (for ex.stutter or speach impediment) is that you start listing things that affect a fraction of people with the disorder and may even be unrelated to the trauma. While most people with c-PTSD or PTSD would probably recognize their struggles in the more broader categories, they might not fit the more specific descriptions.

But, if you really want specifics, the Vermilyea book gives more specific examples under the broader categories, I just couldn't rewrite the whole thing. To me it seems like a pretty exhaustive description of stress-related c-PTSD symptoms and yes, they all can overlap with PTSD.

The traits unique to c-PTSD that don't typically overlap with PTSD (and these are still just a speculation, since the disorder hasn't been formally defined), have to do with

-impaired attachment and basic trust
-impaired sense of self

There are some c-PTSD articles on this site that describe what falls under these categories in more detail that I found very insightful, in that they really resonated with my experiences.

In my opinion,

-developmental delays

might also be part of c-PTSD and might account for some of the overlap with various personality disorders, especially if the c-PTSD occurs as a result of childhood trauma.

And finally, c-PTSD can result from chronic trauma endured in adulthood too, such as in political prisoners, sex-slaves, prisoners subjected to prolonged isolation, soldiers exposed to repeated traumatic experiences in combat etc. and I would hypothesize that in those cases

-erosion of previously met developmental milestones

might occur and look similar to the attachment/basic trust issues and developmental delays seen in people who suffered from childhood abuse.

On an aside, how about using 'symptoms of c-PTSD' instead of traits? Somehow 'trait' to me is suggestive of something fundamentally unchangable, a personality trait or a genetic disposition, while I hope this is an illness, not who I am, and I intend to get better one day ; )

Good luck and thanks for caring enough to inquire!

 

[bluecat]

Just thought of one more symptom that I think is pretty typical of c-PTSD:

-learned helplessnes

Bluecat

 

[Dylan]

There's a comprehensive list of articles here on the forum (including symptoms and pathology) under Articles > Complex Post Traumatic Stress Disorder (CPTSD). You might also check out the recommended DSM criteria (per Trauma and Recovery by Judith Herman; Herman is the psychiatrist who came up with the concept/term/definition of CPTSD): http://www.sasian.org/papers/cptsd.htm (I hope I've managed to disable the link...I've gotten dinged in the past).

I have CPTSD and don't display several of the symptoms listed in the original post (I do 'get' humor and am considered by most people as pretty funny, I don't hide under blankets and never have, I am extremely aware of (hypervigilant), and highly reactive to, non-verbal cues).

HTH -
-Dylan

 

[Dylan]

After letting this topic percolate, I'm thinking I want to add a post script:

While Herman's list is, in my purely anecdotal experience and opinion (!!), a fair representation, it's certain that our symptom cluster can be as individual as we are. So, while the general diagnostic criteria is still comprehensive, the expressions of those criteria can and usually are 'refined' into particular behaviors; "isolation and withdrawal" may be the criteria, but the method of expressing that isolation and withdrawal may be more individual (e.g. hiding under a blanket, hiding in a closet or hiding out in the house).

I also think that many of us may be heavy on certain criteria and lighter on others. For instance, I've had a lifelong struggle with the 'alterations in systems of meaning' and my symptoms in that area have remained fairly high and unpredictable, however, the 'alterations in relation to others' (in the self protection area) is light in comparison.

Experience with my symptoms has also shown me that they may change over time: I used to have severe issues/symptoms of 'alterations in perceptions of perpetrator', but these have morphed into, I believe, a more realistic viewpoint for the present day.

That said, I think it's normal, particularly at the beginning of recovery, to want to know that - finally - we're no longer alone; we seek out the comfort, validation and reassurance of others who have the same or similar feelings, thoughts and behaviors. I think it's a good idea, though, to remember that our expression of criteria isn't necessarily the criteria itself; one might be misled into denial by thinking, "Oh, well, I don't hide in the closet, so I don't have it" (when they haven't been able to leave the house for a year!). :wink:

I do wonder why Herman didn't include a category around affect regulation. I don't think I've ever met a CPTSDer for whom this wasn't a struggle. Supposedly DBT (Dialectical Behavioral Therapy) is also good for CPTSD folks; makes sense, I guess, since DBT was created to treat BPD and they both appear so similar at times...

-D

 

[girlwithwings]

I wish I could post an intro, it won't let me?

I am 31. I am just now coming to terms with how I have survived my whole life so messed up. I was always afraid to talk to anyone and how would I even begin to explain what it's meant for me?

I have a startle reflex that my ex used to laugh at, it hurt me so bad because I can't help it. I have always used physical sensations to overwhelm my fractured mind. Starvation, pills, cigarettes. Pain in my body was a joke compared to my mind. I spent a lot of my time sobbing from age 13-20. I was deemed slow in school. I was pulled out of class in 4th grade by the school therapist. I told her hardly anything because I could not remember...looking back I see that other adults could see there was more to my strange behavior, even when I could not see it. I knew I lived in a small world inside my head that was lonely. And I just knew nobody would ever understand it. I still have a very hard time around people I do not know and feel that as soon as people see me they don't like me.

I have been nauseous just about every day of my life and have severe migraines which started at age 9. I cannot ever seem to relax. I thought from the time I was so small that I was always going to die tomorrow. That is some of what CPTSD has done to my life and my soul.

 

[James B.]

...coming to terms with how I have survived my whole life so messed up. I was always afraid to talk to anyone. I have always used physical sensations to overwhelm my fractured mind. Starvation, pills, cigarettes. Pain in my body was a joke compared to my mind. I spent a lot of my time sobbing from age [13-20] (5 to 13 for me) . I was deemed slow in school. I knew I lived in a small world inside my head that was lonely. And I just knew nobody would ever understand it. I still have a very hard time around people I do not know and feel that as soon as people see me they don't like me. I cannot ever seem to relax. I thought from the time I was so small that I was always going to die tomorrow. That is some of what CPTSD has done to my life and my soul.

Thanks for posting girlwithwings, I quoted parts of your post that are applicable to me. Especially this: " I knew I lived in a small world inside my head that was lonely." I believe many use the qualifier for the CPTSD Dx of "no pre-trauma memories". Makes sense to me, my experience as a CPTSD sufferer. Thanks again for the awesome post. James B.
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[Iam]

Awesome Bluecat! Very helpful!

Grandpalw,
Thanks for posting this thread. It is helpful.

I have been diagnosed "informally" with PTSD, however it is as a result of domestic violence, emotional and physical abuse by my family growing up and by my mother as an adult. So I have to wonder if it is C-PTSD. Add to that I was raped at knifepoint when I was 7 by a neighbor of my grandparents and was molested by several other strangers as a young child. So maybe I am a little different than the C-PTSD sufferer?

I have or at times have every one of the things on your above list except:

Sudden or frequent nausea/dizziness/faintness
Feeling that there is no future, you have no future, your life/future will be prematurely cut off
Argumentativeness/aggression/irritability
Selective mutism
Nervousness when left alone
Stutter or other speech impediment (Though I did have a severe eye twitch as a child and it still happens at times when stressed)

I also have:

emotional flashbacks
visual flashbacks
physical feeling flashbacks

 

[LostInOz]

Ok so here is my list:

Loner behavior
Lack of trust
Feeling of uniqueness, that I am uniquely in more pain, bad, so on than anyone else
Self Injury/Starvation
INTENSE fear of abandonment, real or imagined
Clinging to perceived rescuers
Sleep Disturbance
Lack of emotional control
Constant emotional pain
LYING. All the time, to save myself from harm, perceived or imagined, or to ward off possible abandonment
Inability to define myself
Constant internal battles
Anger. A lot of it.
Lashing out, sometimes violently
Feeling trapped
Depression, debilitating depression
Difficulty holding down jobs
Attention seeking behavior
Extreme discomfort in crowds
Overdramatic behavior
Extreme empathy for the pain of others (I take in their pain)
Running...I move if I feel that the place I am in is not fixing me, or I am in danger, real or imagined
Feeling of inability to care for or support myself
Obssession with past experiences that I perceive as my fault, failures or frightening
Self Sabotage
Extreme difficulty in interpersonal relationships
Avoidance
Agoraphobia
Alcoholism/Drug Addiction/Self Medication
Preference for Cats over people
Extreme impulse control issues

I dunno, I am sure there are many more.

 

[Iam]

Hi LostinOz,

I think your list emphasizes the individuality of c-PTSD symptoms. I can relate to almost every single on you have listed here and the others listed previously. Sometimes certain symptoms are non evident for awhile, but they seem to rear their heads when espeically triggered.

Certain of my symptoms are the exact opposite of yours:
Clingy - I remain detached from most people. I cannot stand it if anyone becomes clingy and wants to be around
me all the time. It is a huge trigger for me as my mother put me in the position of being her rescuer.
Anger- I do feel it occassionally, but usually it is turned inward and manifests as depression
Lashing out - The same as above, I tend to beat myself up, not others. However, when provoked to anger it is intense and I lash out at the person far more than would be appropriate for the situation.
Lack of emotional control - I am overly controlling of my emotions. I was completely numb except for sadness until
I started therapy. Intense negative emotions terrify me so I tend to stuff them. On the
occassions they do come out I dissociate.
Substance abuse - Was a problem in highschool and I am fighting the desire to abuse again. Until recently all of my adult life I have hated the feeling o flose of control that getting high or drunk brings on.

I think that even though some of mine are the exact opposites of your symptoms, it is still reflective and somewhat the same in the fact that both are at extreme ends of the scale. If that makes any sense.

 

[LostInOz]

Iam -

My clinginess is weird. It's that I hate you don't leave me type. I need them NEED them but can't let them get too close. I can't have real intimacy, a sense of real trust with anyone, but I NEEEEED someone to anchor me.

My anger is usually turned inward, then outward in the form of self injurious behavior

Lashing out...Again, we are similar here, but I have been known to be a hitter and a spitter when angry meets fear

Lack of emotional control - I simply can't control my emotions...at all. when I feel something it oozes out of me, like you wouldn't believe.

Substance abuse - I conquered that with 12step reprogramming. But I still ache to get high or drunk at times to kill the pain.