General Desperate For Help Here...

[DontWannaGiveUp]

I was dating a girl for awhile, and we decided mutually that we were moving too fast, and because of her past we would just be friends and see where it went.

The transition into that was a period where I was ignored and she needed "space." It lasted about a week, and then she came back telling me she was lonely, she hated arguing with me, and then started opening her heart to me.

Things have been rocky. I just realized that she might have PTSD. She was abused relentlessly for 4 months by her ex...and she just got out in December. Because of this, I definitely realize she is not ready for a relationship, and neither am I.

However, our connection was strong. She is important to me. She has opened up to me and I have been trying to learn how to be a support to her.

Before thinking this might be PTSD, I was treating us as equals---telling her that her withdrawal was hurtful, in which she would get mad at me for being mad at her. Then she wouldn't talk for a few days.

Now, this past Monday we had a great day together, until I decided I needed to tell her flat out that I have issues with people walking out on me. It hurts, a lot. I had an ex walk out on me and I lost everything when she did that, so I have some trauma that I deal with as far as people walking out. Unfortunately, I didn't think and said something that triggered a PTSD response from her.

She got extremely angry and took off. I was insistent to be heard and I called continuously. I even followed her around for about 10 minutes, until I came to my senses there. After several phone calls she did finally talk to me. She was projecting her anger---telling me she wasn't what I was looking for. Telling me that I was needy (I had told her earlier that evening that although I wanted her, and I wanted her in my life---I didn't need her.) Telling me she would never get married, she screwed up every relationship, etc etc. Telling me that the thing I said really hurt her and now she doesn't even know if she has me as a friend.
She had calmed down a bit and was crying instead of yelling. She said things like "I don't want to mean anything to anyone. I just want to be invisible. I don't want anyone to care, nobody does. I'm a failure. You have no idea how any of what I went through feels, and what you went through is nothing like it. I let her talk and talk, and said very little, I really just wanted to listen and hoped she would talk herself down and reconsider going into seclusion, but she finally hung up the phone.

It meant a lot to me that she did decide to talk with me, because it allowed me to function enough to start my car and go home. I have NEVER EVER done anything like following someone, or calling them over and over. I lost my mind temporarily. I feel horrible and ashamed by it. The silent treatment is extremely hurtful to me, and I think she might use it for control.

The next day I decided to talk to a friend who had been through this stuff, and she got me through last time I was treated like this. I went through my phone to see exactly how many times I had called the night before. I needed to be honest with everyone about what was done to me, and what I had done so I could get an honest evaluation of the situation. While I was doing this, my touch screen phone accidently dialed her. I tried to hang up before it rang through but it didn't happen. I got a crass message a few minutes later-- "What do you want, xaxxe"
I didn't respond.

The next day, I did send her a message later, because I knew she was going to a concert that she was looking forward to---we were supposed to go together. Although I was extremely disappointed I wasn't going, I did send her a message saying: I hope you have a great time tonight, you deserve it. I look forward to hearing about it sometime.

She responded 6 hours later with--- "What part of I don't want to talk don't you get"
Once again I didn't respond.

I haven't sent a message since that day. My friend suggested that if I hear nothing by Sunday, I just send another nice message of support. She told me what got her to finally realize that her guy was there for her---was when he gave her her space, but continued to once and awhile let her know he was there and cared.

However, I was thinking instead of a message, I might just right a short letter that I have mailed to her.

I realize that I screwed up. I didn't realize she might have PTSD, and if I had and I'd had a chance to research it I probably wouldn't have said something that could possibly trigger an attack. I feel like a complete piece of garbage--- because there is nothing I want more than to just have this person in my life and support her the way she deserves. And, with the crap I've been through in my life, I believe it's time that I got something I deserve as well.

I'm looking for suggestions. I know I did something horrible, but it wasn't intentional. I would never do anything to hurt her purposely, EVER. She hasn't deleted me off Facebook, which tells me she doesn't really want me out of her life. She has answered those text messages, even though it was angrily. My friend told me that as long as there is anger, there is still caring. And most of all, even though she was running away that night-- she still talked to me eventually. Which meant more to me than anything.

What can I do for her? We're an hour and a half away, so it's not like I can just show up at any time to begin with. I have a much better understanding now of how I can support her and be there for her, but first I need to find a way to just get her to talk to me again. I understand that it will probably be hard for her to open up again for awhile. I can understand and deal with that....because, in my opinion, she truly is worth it.

I know there has to be a way to support one another without conflict, but first I have to find a way to break through and make her realize that I am not her enemy--- I'm the guy who cares about her very much.

I apologize for the long length. It's a lot to say. She says a lot during these episodes that she doesn't mean. She says a lot that she does mean. It's hard to know which is which. I don't honestly believe she wants me out of her life, despite the fact that we've had a lot of drama lately. (which she also mentioned while on the phone).

I think I know what to do now---at least when we're okay again. What do I do to reach her? Is there anything a partner said or did that reached you?

Thank you , all.

 

[j doe]

DWGU, first of all, thanks for posting all this. You had a lot on your mind, and it's good to get it out, even if you haven't figured it all out yet. Before everything else, you should feel absolutely zero guilt or responsibility for anything you have done/said that has been misinterpreted.

People with PTSD do not react to "normal" interaction like everyone else, and you can't be expected to know or be responsible for her reactions at this point. You didn't cause the trauma at the core of the PTSD, and you should not feel emotionally responsible for her behavior because of the trauma (not you). If she engages in unhealthy behaviors as a response to something you did or said, it's her; it's not you. You have every right to be honest and take care of your own feelings. Anything less will not help her or you one bit.

It's been 8 yrs with my PTSD girlfriend, and I will tell you that it does not get better no matter how much you care, don't care, try, or don't try. You are on the outside and will always be on the outside. If she isn't ready to let you in, then you can do little or nothing. If/when she feels she needs help, she'll get it, with or without you. I know I don't speak for everyone, but maybe you should read up more and decide if you really really want a lifetime of this kind of relationship before pursuing it.

 

[DontWannaGiveUp]

I understand. If she was anyone else--- I would have run away already. I've walked away from people much crazier, or much less. I cared for her BEFORE I knew she had a condition. THAT person is who I care for, and that is the person I'm fighting for.

What scares me is that I acted ridiculous before I knew what was going on. I'm praying that I'm allowed one more chance to do this right. I don't know why this person is so important to me, but she is. Sometimes I guess we just can't explain things.

I'm hoping that my feelings aren't one-sided. My friend told me that if someone feels as strongly as I do, there has to be more there than just one-sided feelings. However, it's hard--because she shows how she feels through actions, not words. It's very hard to get things out of her verbally. So when she disappears, it's absolute horror because she's so far away, I can't be there for her, and I feel completely hopeless to provide the support she deserves. All I can do is hope everyday when I wake up (if I've slept at all), that it's the day she starts to miss me, and it's one day closer to her coming back.

It's horrifying to think that---maybe she won't come back.

 

[Tinyflame]

Hi DWGUp, I can only speak for myself, and what I can take from your post.

First of all, she's not been diagnosed with ptsd (far as you know).

Secondly, seems you are describing a situation where there has been miscommunication, and misinterpretation. Irregardless of the presence or absence of ptsd, it may be from what you said (I might be wrong in the interpretation) that what upset her (at the core) was that you said you didn't 'need' her. I understand it that you meant it in a positive way (vs codependency-(?) ). But DWGU, I think everyone needs (or wants) to be both 'needed' and 'wanted'.

I think you have some great strengths going for you- recognizing she does mean (some) of what she says, for example. And trying to be honest, and accept your own responsibility. And trying to see it from her perspective. Even reading here.
But she also sounds very angry, and she also may not come back because trust is usually a very big issue. You cannot support her (nor would she 'want' or trust you to), if she cannot trust you.

I do not believe, however, that it is a 'world' no one else can enter; however very few would want to, or have the patience, resiliency, or perseverance.

I think offering 'support' at this time is useless, because I don't mean to be blunt but she wouldn't want it from you. However, I think what (may) open a door to communication is an apology from your heart- much of what you said here (but I'd leave out the ptsd). And that you meant (if you did) that you both need her and want her (if that was the issue). And to explain why you called repeatedly, etc.
Because december is absolutely nothing (ie no time) since that experience for her.

You may want to ask her if she will hear you out, or if you can give her a letter, and go by her response.
Just a thought, I hope things work out,she must have trusted you to open up. But I have to say also, if it is ptsd the fear that she will leave is very real.

 

[DontWannaGiveUp]

I don't like hearing that anything I do is useless. She's come back once before. I just hate that she's so far away, and hurting like this.
I hate that I'm hurting like this.

Maybe I'm in denial, or maybe I just can't accept no for an answer--- but I always believe there is a solution for everything. There has to be a way for me to reach her. Maybe my friend is right and I just have to keep testing the waters every once and awhile with a positive message to see what her response is.

 

[Tinyflame]

Came to me as an analogy DWGU, what I meant is, try to imagine even the most professional, least emotionally invested relationship you can think of. For example, what if you were at work, and your boss or CEO, told you that you were 'wanted but not needed' (or conversely 'needed but not wanted').

And however I do understand, verbal expression is almost impossible.
I can hear something, not even meant for me or for example on tv, and it can get me spinning and sinking into a tail spin. Ultimately, understanding 'words', or making sense of how concepts, etc, relate to my own life, or past, or future, or emotions, can be just awful. :( Of course, sometimes I'm wrong, but unless it's explained to me how it is that I'm wrong, or what something means (in a way I can get it), or that it means something else, I don't think of it in any other way.

 

[Tinyflame]

If she reaches out in a small way, then maybe you can make some headway.

Sorry, overlapped posting.

I don't think what you do or say is useless, by any means. Especially to someone who knows what the opposite feels like.

 

[DontWannaGiveUp]

I'm fairly confident she's going to reach out at some point, unless she chose to ignore the "I want you, I want you in my life" part of our conversation, and only focus on the "I don't need you," the million phone calls, the following, and the comment that triggered this entire situation. My fear is that she's not going to reach out because she thinks I don't "need her" and so she's not going to bother, and if I reach out too early---she's still going to be angry and push me further away. If I reach out too late, it's going to be too late.

I wish I had some way to get a sign from her. And maybe the way I have to do that is through the text messages every few days. I'm hoping and praying that I hear from her before the next time I plan on sending a message. This is full day 3 of no communication.

 

[Pale Warrior]

Hi DWGU, sad to read of your situation.

I am going to be blunt in giving you my opinion (and it is only that) and only you know what is truly going on in your life.

First, there is no diagnosis of PTSD, whatever you may "suspect". Who knows why she is reacting in this way?

No diagnosis = no treatment, and if she does happen to have untreated PTSD it is not going to sort itself out just because you want to support her. If she doesn't want to involve you in her life you can sit there crying till the cows come home. Sorry to say this, but you can't make her come back. She will only return if she wants to. Somtimes the more you push the further a sufferer retreats. Hang loose, get on with your life.

If you do get back together with her, I wish you luck and peace together.

Read the supporter threads on here, find out what life is like with untreated PTSD and be sure to understand codependancy before you commit to anything. It's very, very easy to say to someone during the first flush of a relationship "I will be there for you no matter what" without understanding what that really means.

 

[Tinyflame]

PW is so right.

It's really not a question of ignoring the rest, if the trust gets blown, it's blown.

The average person has arguments based on misunderstandings, expectations gone awry, etc. People with ptsd get all the 'norm' too, but also there is so much more to it (over and above it). (If indeed she has ptsd).
When I said that before, I meant when 'words' are misinterpreted, they're done so within the context of ptsd by a sufferer, always in a negative way.

 

[LizardViolet]

Take deep breaths. Take a step back, emotionally.

Maybe she will want to be with you, but giving her space is what you need to do right now. What you described, a little positive contact now and then but no pushing, is the right thing to do.

Your support will not fix her, however. If she does in fact have ptsd and never seeks treatment, things will never be normal. Look at that word again: NEVER. It's quite possible that she will always misinterpret and overreact and put you through hell. My bf has untreated ptsd and although he has come a long way, and I know that he is committed to me in his own way, my life is no bed of roses. Not long ago I missed a phone call from him and he didn't speak to me for a week. I was going to see him last Wednesday night and ran late, and he told me to go home and was pissed for another few days. (I believe he is especially stressed right now because his father is dying of cancer. But all the experienced supporters here will tell you, and tell me, that ptsd is NO EXCUSE for acting like a jerk.)

It's great that you care about her. Don't beat yourself up about the fact that you were honest with her. IT IS NOT POSSIBLE TO GET IT RIGHT. It is not possible to say just the right thing at all times, act just the right way, so that your relationship will go well. It's a two-way street. I hope things come out all right, but in the meantime, it's out of your control. And it will ALWAYS be out of your control. Think about what you are signing up for.

Good luck.

 

[ProudWife99]

Sorry to hear you're experiencing something that is hurting you.

Like the others and in the interest time, I'm going to honest with you.

Treating someone who has not been diagnosed with PTSD like they have PTSD is definately it's own form of abuse. It is not your place nor responsibility to make that decision and is truly unfair to her.

I read about scenarios like yours often here and while I hate to be the one that extinguishes hope (because hope is healthy, it is), sometimes I think we as supporters give PTSD too much credit because it hurts us less.

"He only says he doesn't want me because he has PTSD." or "He is only cheating on me because he has PTSD." or "She refuses to accept my love and help because she has PTSD." I find those things to be said to benefit the supporter more than the sufferer.

If she says she doesn't want to be with you, believe her. Just because she had PTSD does not mean her feelings are unimportant OR that she can say and do whatever she wants. If she realizes she had made a mistake it will be necessary for her to deal with the consequences. If she hasn't made a mistake and truly no longer wants to be in a relationship with you, you should respect that.

PTSD is an awful, nasty thing, but it does not have to control every word that comes out of someones mouth. If it DOES, then that person is in no place to be a part of a relationship anyway.

Coming from someone who is dealing with their own traumatic experiences regarding abuse, what I'm saying is this: Someone calling me over and over, sending me even the nicest texts, and refusing to RESPECT me when I ask them to leave me alone does not spell support for me. It triggers me even further into isolation, as all I've asked for is to be left alone and even that small request cannot seem to be respected. If she is dealing with the symptoms of abuse, refusing to l eave her alone does not help her. When I ask my husband to leave me alone and instead he calls or pounds on the door of the room I'm in, I don't feel loved and supported. I feel afraid, and angry, and less and less like being anywhere near him.

My suggestion? Let her be. PTSD or no PTSD, her wishes deserve to be respected.