Experiences With Sociopaths

[Queen Boudica]

Lizio you strike me as a bright lady who has all sorts of skills. If you're used to being a housewife then start there? Watch neighborhood kids while parents work, or clean houses, or organize people's stuff, or sell baked goods. You can do it. It takes tons of smarts to separate from the abuse only a narcissist can dole out. I believe in you!

How about you congratulate yourself for taking such a big, wonderful, noteworthy step toward doing what's right for YOU? :D

Thankyou doglover for your kind words.

Feel like even my housewife skills have been eroded. My back is a problem, can't even clean my own house a lot of the time. But hoping that will get better.

I am now looking after a couple of kids in the afternoon after school, that will help. It is a start And I have started looking at ideas. Just get overwhelmed and feel I can't do anything. It will get better, I am hoping it will once he is moved out.

Don't feel I can congratulate myself yet, until I know I will not fall flat on my face. Too much else i am avoiding doing at the moment. Yes It is a huge step for me. It is a move in the right direction. I am pleased with that, just bloody scared I won't be able to cope afterwards. It is a start, I'm trying as much as I can.

 

[Queen Boudica]

Re me being brave when I held up the iron? No Liz. I didnt feel brave at all. I didnt CARE any more! And it was because I didnt care, I was so calm.

When I am acting 'brave' is when I am most scared.

Yes, but you were still brave, scared or not. That was not acting.

Know that feeling too. We had a big argument the other day and he was scaring me the way he was talking and he had that look on his face, but I just did not give up told him a few home truths. (Not that he got it). But then I did know that whilst he is seeing the marriage counsellor and I am seeing my psychologist he is not going to lose it completely, again his image is the most important thing to him. But does scare me how I will feel brave and take him on, when he is scaring me. Anyway, does not make any difference. Last time I had realised he was out of control and told him that was enough and run to the bathroom for safety, but he still followed me in there.

 

[Queen Boudica]

it's my dad.

(((((((((((((James B))))))))))))

 

[sea]

it's my dad.

Mine also. Unfortunately I am not as adept as you or the others who posted on this thread in relating personally with things like this. (As, uh, evidenced by the really impersonal response...:cautious: sorry about that.) But, yeah.

 

[Queen Boudica]

((((((((((((((Sea))))))))))))). Sorry about your dad.

Don't be sorry. Your response was good. All that information, very helpful.

Find it hard to get my head around that stuff at the moment, Read it but still does not make sense to me (don't know why, I studied engineering and worked in IT so I should be able to get it!). But it is there so I can keep looking at it and eventually I will get it. And others posting have commented on how useful that information is.

The personal stuff is very hard. Not sure I get that anyway. Just write what I am thinking and feeling. Shows you are relating personally when you wrote it was your dad too. Sometimes only a few words, can convey a whole lot.

 

[Jacquie]

So your head knows you are not an idiot? But he makes you feel like you are an idiot so you start acting like one?

Then your head that knows you are not an idiot comes out swinging?

When you can get to a point where if he is ranting you can just look at a total loser, feel nothing, and say 'yeah whatever', then go back to what you were doing. Then....then you're not scared any more.

As long as you feel the need to be 'either' afraid or fight back......you're scared.

How does this guy react if you laugh at something he does? Does he fly into an uncontrollable rage? Does he walk away? Does he laugh with you?

 

[maddog]

I think this sample sociopath is many of our dads... a very common theme. Mine is all of the above and more, or so it feels anyway. Image... image is everything to him, it always was. Image, power, control, domination and humiliation of others more vulnerable. He lives and breathes for them. Yuk, can't go there anymore tonight.

Lizio, I wanted to comment on something you said a few messages back about not wanting to congratulate yourself until you know you weren't going to fall on your face... you know, at some point, you probably will, because we all do, especially when we're embarking on a climb as steep and dotted with potholes as the one you're about to commence. I hate to quote a cliche, and please don't feel that my meaning is devalued by doing it, but truly, it's not whether or not we fall over that counts, it's whether we get back up again. You have fallen and risen so many times that your gravel rashed knees are made of steel... they will endure a few more scrapes, there's no doubt about that, but they are stronger for each one. I don't think it's wise to aim for the end goal at a time like now. You deserve congratulations for the sheer act of having gotten to where you are - stuck firm to your desire to have him gone, begun planning your next steps, etc. You need to congratulate yourself for each successful step you take along the road, even the tiny shuffling tentative ones, because they are the ones that count. The end goal will speak for itself when you get there.

I hope this didn't seem patronising, I just see, and sadly relate deeply, to someone who beats herself viciously to succeed against the greatest and cruelest of odds, and someone who is perhaps the only one around her who cannot see the courage and strength and progress that keep her going. I know you don't feel it, but try to keepit with you anyway, because I don't even know you or have any reason to do anything other than call it as I see it, and what I see is a very courageous woman with a lot to offer the world and a whole new impending opportunity ahead of you to offer it.

Maybe just the tiniest self-congratulations to you then hey?

MD

 

[Queen Boudica]

Thanks MD.

No, did not seem patronising at all.

I'm just very down at the moment. Do recognise I have had strength and maybe even courage at times to pick myself up, just could never sustain it, when the huge pot holes came. Needed that recovery time, to gain my strength.

Have not had that recovery time, been too overwhelmed and put down. And those knees of steel, just don't want to fully engage at the moment, they want to stay down and I am trying with all my will to get them up again. So I think I can only do baby steps., even those seem excrutiatingly hard at them moment.

Yes, will recognise I have taken one big leap and told him to get out, before my knees started to buckle. So I congratulate myself for that :eek:. And even keeping the momentum going is a big deal for me, just dealing with him is so draining. That is about all I can manage at the moment, but that is enough. It is still going the right way, I have not stopped moving, even though I am crawling now.

Sorry about your dad. I have briefly looked at your writings about him, but very hard to read about what he did to you as a child. Takes a lot of courage to remember all that and write it.

 

[Sethe]

Ultimately, these people are sick, and i wonder how their guilt works on them? And just how miserable they (in actual truth) really are, becoming - time after time - for all legitimate concerns, a social pariah. Hated, and with many enemies. File these types under 'self-defeating'...

This sounds like my father (though he did have a great number of people admire him as well- go figure). He was always having people who 'didn't understand his genius.' Oh boy. Yes, those words were used by both of my parents. Apparently, the professional world was jealous of his talent and that's why so many people in his profession 'didn't like him.'

 

[Sethe]

That can present similarly to narcissistic traits, but sociopathic traits are inherently more unstable, volatile, and harmful than narcissistic traits. They often present as self-destructive, addicted, psychotic, sadistic individuals (Though some garden-variety sociopaths can function reasonably well in society, it is hard for them to hide their true destructive, abusive, volatile and sadistic personalities in the home environment).

People with NPD are often abusive, manipulative, and damaging to everyone they come across due to their similar lack of empathy, and self-importance. As seen in many members who have PTSD from abuse by narcissists on this website, they are often abusive in the home environment as well. However, due to inherent differences in impulse control, behavior modification, self-destructiveness and volatility - narcissists are on the whole, a less dangerous species than the psychopath or sociopath.

This is my father too. Dangerous at home, but so, so kind to patients. He wasn't constantly violent- seemed to have 'mood swings.' I don't know if he's a sociopath or just NPD. Either way- the effects were damaging.

 

[PTSD sufferer]

Hi All,

I think we must be very careful about labeling someone a Sociopath or Psychopath without a clinical diagnosis. These clinical terms can only really be diagnosed by a professional. Why? Because, abusers are many, emotionally retarded individuals even higher proportion, of the population and that's bad enough. Some, attributes are common among sociopaths, psychopaths and abusers, so just because they have some attributes of each, doesn't make them one or the other. There are specific defining characteristics that are absolute - lack of empathy - which individuals cannot diagnose themselves.

It is very hard for an individual to determine a diagnosis of these traits because of their ability to 'mirror' emotions of others, they are so superficially charming, that when they verbally abuse you, you will never quite understand why it is that you are hurt or mad at them, because they are very, very slippery characters. Even clinicians struggle diagnosing them at first sight.

Physical assault is more often than not carried out by a scapegoat, and not them directly. They love the 'game' of being able to manipulate others to carry out their master plan. Aggression or physical attacks happen only when

1) they can no longer control you, therefore you are dispensable as they are possessive of long term targets
2) if you stand in the way of them, or stop them, completing their master plan
3) They can become unpredictable if things don't go to their plan and this is where they slip up, because they are unable to see beyond their master plan.

They have spent years building up a false image of themselves and their reputation or status. If you threaten their 'status', 'image' or 'reputation', you will be a target. They may directly hurt you or it may be their scapegoat who they are instructing, manipulating etc to cause you harm. Remember, its the game that they are interested in and you are just a pawn.

Psychopaths need to be formally (either admitted by themselves or by a clinician) diagnosed as 'lacking empathy'. For psychopaths it is the 'game' that they are interested in, like cat and mouse, that gives them some kind of chemical reaction in the brain that is 'thrilling' and addictive. Dr Bob Hare has done quite a bit of work on understanding psychopaths and it will serve you well to google his name. Other important sources of information are books like 'The Mask of Sanity'. Very helpful again.

I agree with Debbie, know thy enemy. Bui, if it is determined that you are living with a psychopath - get out now!

I want to make another point, about abusers who are NOT psychopaths or sociopaths......

Abuse, both physical and emotional is definitely a sign of an 'abuser'. Being abused by an ABUSER is extreme enough that you should leave the relationship. Seek help from outside sources - community and social services groups are there to help you leave and piece back together your life. Again, what they are doing, the fact that they are an abuser IS BAD ENOUGH. You don't need to add another label to describe the horror of what abusive, emotionally retarded monsters that they are.

 

[PTSD sufferer]

PS. You never, ever, ever, play a psychopaths game - EVER! In any form, EVER!

That means not rubbing their ego and giving them the attention they crave, or agreeing with their abusive words, or undertaking tasks that they set out to for you to do. WALK AWAY. If you play their game, they will win and you will loose.If you try to stop their game you will loose. Walk away and never look back = you win.