News Sign This Petition - Ban Rape Pornography

[Pencil]

I really do get the point of consenting people acting the part. But many years ago I accidentally saw a pic of a woman, naked and spreadeagled with lots of blood and the caption 'Raped to death!'. I KNEW it was not real - the woman was alive and well and covered in lots and lots of ketchup, but it has stayed with me, and I STILL find the memory disturbing. We all know the difference between action movies in which the majority of the cast get blown to bits and die violently in exploding cars on the one hand, and snuff movies on the other hand. Even if the snuff is fake, it still has a completely different quality - and a different purpose for a different audience.

My view: yes you have the right to whatever fantasy you want to indulge in, but keep it to yourself, or your circle of like-minded cronies. I have a God-given (not only constitutional) inalienable right to bowel movements, and I even have a liberal right to subject others to it, but this is where some higher aesthetic or morality or delicacy should prevail.

On that high note I'm also done here.

Thanks again Springer.

 

[Pencil]

Err, so if I understand you correctly you think that any and every activity that can be done is equally open to being banned? Because that seems to be what you are advocating. Murder and theft are illegal because there are victims. Actual rape is illegal because there is a victim. Grown ups play acting rape on film really should be in a different category.

(Sorry, had to say one more thing)

Err, seeing something upsetting makes the viewer a victim. And err, these films create the impression that there is a victim, and then some really strange people use it as pornography, which means they use it to, err, masturbate as the enacted victimization turns them on.

Freedom of expression is an ideal based on certain supposed levels of sanity and civilization, but it is used (abused?) to feed the baser twists of the human mind. And we are supposed to be politically correct by condoning it out of sheer liberal-mindedness. Now THAT is following the letter and not the spirit of the law / ideal.

 

[Springer80]

Hi,

As you can see I'm not very vocal on this issue, although I potentially have quite a bit to say on the subject. My brain is just too fried and I'm at the very end of my emotional fuse.

All I wanted to add, is that if you able to forward this to any organizations, women's centers or refuge's, psychologists, trauma centers, academics or whatever then feel free :)

 

[rightkindofme]

I spent ten minutes on google and found a lot of studies on internet availability of violent porn reducing incidences of sexual assault. If you are interested in such research it exists. I am not going to present a long list of links for you to blow off. That seems like a big waste of my time.

We do not outlaw movies where people play-act violent murder. Why is that legal? Why is that less disturbing to people than violent rape? Unless we are outlawing all upsetting play-acting I think it is inappropriate to ban any kind of consensual adult activities.

I have spent hundreds of hours reading statistics and trying to become convinced that I can jump on the "porn is evil! It should be banned!" camp because personally I have some issues with the industry. The data just isn't there. The opposite is proved.

But that's all annoying and stuff to people who are mad on the internet. So I will walk away from this conversation and say have fun.

 

[Lost Pup]

this is where some higher aesthetic or morality or delicacy should prevail.

I wholeheartedly agree. I just disagree that the law is the way to make that happen.

 

[Abstract]

I have glimpsed through despite myself but am not going to comment specifically as have not read properly and don't want to be drawn in. The one thing I did want to say is that this topic is always going to contentious in a place like this for many reasons. Other than the political ones which are a given.; personal freedom versus affects on others.

It is going to be contentious because many peoples histories are touched in one way or the other by this subject or the symbolism has some significance one way or the other. Many who have experienced abuse have had their preferences affected or are stuck in re enacting scenarios and many of those feel great shame about it. For some in safe adult, mutually consenting relationships that is how they express this aspect of their lives. And some are OK about that. Many I am sure find the concept of it being used triggering or at least very deeply disturbing or have personal histories which make it problematic. It is all grounded in trauma sadly.

 

[Hashi]

I just disagree that the law is the way to make that happen.

I think Rape Crisis South London's findings show that it isn't happening without the law.

I spent ten minutes on google and found a lot of studies on internet availability of violent porn reducing incidences of sexual assault. If you are interested in such research it exists. I am not going to present a long list of links for you to blow off. That seems like a big waste of my time.

I think it's a shame that you're willing to spend time making a claim but not willing to spend time backing it up. I don't see how that helps anyone. If the research is relevant and sound we wouldn't be able to discount it.

Unfortunately it has been a big waste of my time, and mental and emotional effort, to read and respond to things that have been posted in this thread. I'm really trying to walk away from it, and failing. It's too important an issue to me. I don't want to leave views like this unchallenged on a site where people might assume the information to be trustworthy simply because it's been stated. I sincerely want to make this my last post here, although I don't even know if I can.

I just googled your phrase "studies on internet availability of violent porn reducing incidences of sexual assault" and spent ten minutes looking at the results. What I found was a mixture of articles and research citations. Leaving aside the question of how robust and reliable the research and research conclusions might have been (I didn't spend any time on that, although I saw plenty of challenges that it wasn't) what I found was a lot of studies about how easier access to pornography might be associated with a reduction in rape.

The only thing I saw that specified rape pornography drew the conclusion that this had a different effect than non-violent pornography. There was one other thing that claimed watching highly violent movies reduced the rate of rape, but only for the time people were actually sitting watching the movie, and a few hours afterwards.

The petition and this thread are about rape pornography.

We do not outlaw movies where people play-act violent murder. Why is that legal? Why is that less disturbing to people than violent rape? Unless we are outlawing all upsetting play-acting I think it is inappropriate to ban any kind of consensual adult activities.

We don't outlaw movies where people play act violent rape, depending on how it's portrayed and how explicitly. Many Hollywood and TV movies include some sort of rape scene. However, the whole movie is not focussed on that, and it's not presented with the overt and sole intention of sexually arousing the viewer and encouraging them to imagine participating in it. Similarly, violent movies portraying murder don't do it with the overt and sole intention of arousing the viewer to fantasise that they themselves are carrying out a murder like this.

Of course, these things might be a subtext and of course there are people who object to the level of portrayal of rape and violence in general movies. That would relate to the arguments about freedom of expression etc.

This thread isn't about where to draw the line, though. That's a different discussion. This is talking about the extreme end of the spectrum - rape pornography.

But that's all annoying and stuff to people who are mad on the internet.

I'm not sure what you mean by this. Mad keen on the internet, angry on the internet, crazy on the internet?

I'm certainly angry. I think you might expect people to be angry about this subject. If no-one was, I'd be very disheartened. I'm still providing evidence for what I say, or making it clear that it's my personal opinion.

So I will walk away from this conversation and say have fun.

I'm not having any fun at all. I just feel too strongly about this issue to leave it as I'd like to. As Abstract suggests is likely for some people on this site, it touches on trauma that I've personally experienced.

I'm leaving this with two hopes. One is that I can really stay away now. The other is that this hasn't detracted from the original point of this thread, which is to invite people to sign the petition. I hope people will.

 

[Pencil]

it has been a big waste of my time, and mental and emotional effort, to read and respond to things that have been posted in this thread. I'm really trying to walk away from it, and failing.

I've been very disciplined in NOT posting, but I think now I will. Thanks Hashi :)

 

[Pencil]

Since the issue of drawing lines came up:

How could one possibly draw the line between real rape and enacted rape in these videos? How will one establish whether it is 'fun, disguised as the real thing', or as 'the real thing disguised as fun'? And who is going to do this? Given the blurb on the site, it is meant to look like the real thing. THIS line will be IMPOSSIBLE to draw.

 

[Springer80]

Hi,

As someone who has had underage pornographic images of them taken against my will by my abuser, although (thankfully???) not video footage as far as I'm aware...

I have also watched a documentary about a girl who 'consensually' involved herself in the pornography industry and made a video in which she 'broke the record' for the number of men a single female had 'sex' with in one video. I later came out that as a teen she had been gang raped by 6/7 men and subsequently ostracized from her family. My heart bleeds for her because in that distressed state, were she felt of no value and emotionally numb and without help or support for the consequences of he crime she endured she entered into something as a result of her pain and hundreds of 'ordinary' men as well as the pornography industry, took the opportunity to use her. I'm glad she had the courage to make the documentary.

Actual Rape videos are rape.
Videos which purport to be rape/abusive my be 'consensual' but under duress or in participated in in a state of trauma.
Video's which mess around the age of consent are either actual rape, coercion of vulnerable minors.

When I first told a member of my family about being raped and sexually abused by a family member for years, his first response to me was, 'Oh, my girlfriend has rape fantasies, what's your take on that.' As you can imagine hat was not the port of compassion and security I had been hoping for and it was actually pretty traumatizing because I needed a male in my family to be emotionally responsible about toward me. However, this is the point...if you fantasies about rape it isn't rape. Rape is non consensual and therefore a rape fantasy is actually one person who fancies and sexually wants another person, wants sex, what erotic bit is to do with the fantasy of relinquishing control..and is therefore consensual. If you asked a person who had his fantasy if it would then be okay for them to be jumped by a stranger on the way home from work, I doubt that he answer would be yes.

Rape porn that deliberately dances around these lines, especially with apparently or actually underage CHILDREN should be stopped.

 

[Springer80]

Unfortunately it has been a big waste of my time, and mental and emotional effort, to read and respond to things that have been posted in this thread. I'm really trying to walk away from it, and failing. It's too important an issue to me. I don't want to leave views like this unchallenged on a site where people might assume the information to be trustworthy simply because it's been stated. I sincerely want to make this my last post here, although I don't even know if I can.

I hear ya! :hug:

 

[rightkindofme]

This lawyer does a far better job of addressing these issues than I can.

I understand all of the emotional arguments against rape pornography. I truly do. I don't believe that legislating against consenting adults doing something they want to do is the road to keeping people safe.

This post in particular addresses this petition.