Sludge's "everything You Wanted To Know About Your Meds" Thread

[Sarg]

Still running the Kanger system. But, they came out with a 1000 mA/hr battery called the EVOD. Cost me $15, but I didn't know what a plume was until I fired up one of these. Man, what a hit. 5line, are you running evo batteries? They shouldn't be defective in a few months. Next time one shuts off, tap the button five times and see if it fires back up. Like all rechargeable batteries, they will develop a memory. Need to discharge them completely and then recharge.

Sarg

Oh, and Bryan, prazosin is reported to help with nightmares.

 

[Friday]

Hey Maj. Biochem, sir! :D

Q for you:

- Is there a similar pathway or mode of action (or ___) involved in both cocaine & codones (oxy or hydro)?
- And if so, is there a medication on the market that utilizes that pathway or mode of action?
- Qualifier... Negate all overlaps with desoxyn. Unique to cocaine & codones.
- Qualifier 2 if needed to narrow the field... Not commonly used to treat bipolar disorder. ((Under the rule of thumb that if it helps someone with bipolar disorder, it will make someone with ADHD f*cking nuts. LOL the 2 disorders that, while closely sharing symptomology, never ever ever present comorbidly! I always feel so sad when I hear someone has been dx'd with both. Because it means their "professional" is an idiot who specializes in neither field or they'd know this, and they've got major suffering in their future. I just want to reach through the screen like Bill Cosby in GhostDad and throttle people who dx both comorbid.))
_________

I've been rx'd all 4 (as well as all the variations, the ine-group of opiates, methylphenidate family, various flavors of amphetamines, as well as some numbing agents) and there is something similar in the first 3 cognitive-emotionally that simply isn't present in all the rest. Something very usefully present.

 

[Friday]

Oh crap. Cringe. Or Is that MasterChief Biochem?

LOL, Well...sir or not, you outrank me!

 

[BaMuoiBa]

Where did I put my Chemistry 101 book I thought I seen around here it yesterday........

"Progress through Science" - yeah, I think that was the chapter

WTF, myself and two vets gave up the "Demon Weed" (Cigs that is) in a gin mill New Years Eve 1969.

We decided we'd rather drink ourselves to death, obviously, I was not successful - my friends, well..... be careful what you pray for.

Ba

 

[OldDoorGunner]

Ba, I gave up the Booze 31 years ago this coming xmas. But I still smoke.........till the end....I don't think quiting at this point is a good idea....My body has it down pat, take it away.....shit my go south.

J R

 

[BaMuoiBa]

JR, I'm a firm believer in the credo "If it ain't broke-don't fix it"

Life is a series choices that we make, each of which we evaluate as either good or bad. In the end it's about what works for you to maintain that balance.

Go for it!!!

Ba

 

[Sludge]

Need you help Mr Wizard. I know nothing about vaping!!!! So here are some questions I am sure you know the answers to.

Not sure if I want to spend the money for an Ego Starter Kit, with the Proposed FDA Regulations on E-Cigarettes wich are due out this month!!! Depending the outcome, we may not be able to buy what we need....

Next I have been looking a Ego Starter Kits (2 anyway)

What is the best battery section size, 400 mAh or 650 mAh? I am guessing bigger is better!

Nicotine level 30ml Bottle 24 mg/ml - XHigh Nicotine (Link Removed) my body is use to high amounts. (2 -3 packs a day) is this a good pick for amount of Nicotine?

This is the first kit I liked, but remember I dumb as a rock on this. :whistle:

Halo Triton Ego Starter Kit inLink Removed
Link Removed

First Battery 1 x Midnight Blue | 650 mAh | Manual
Second Battery 1 x Midnight Blue | 650 mAh | Manual
Crystal Clear Tanks 2 x Crystal Clear Triton Tank
Midnight Blue Cone (35mm)1 x Cone | Midnight Blue | Large
USB Adapter 1 x Triton USB Charger
Wall Charger1 x Mini Wall Charger
Halo Case1 x Triton Display Case

$64.99 + Nicotine level 30ml Bottle 24 mg/ml - XHigh Nicotine Plus $19.99 Free S&H Total $85 bucks.


Next is the V2 Pro Series 3 or maybe the Series 7
Link Removed
Seems more expensive and you need to buy extra stuff. (n)(n)(n)

Thinking of vaping full time....

Thanks
J R

In my opinion, start cheap. Why blow a hundred bucks to find vaping isn't for you?

That is a nice kit you have picked out, my son swears by a similar rig. A good vape store has stuff for you to try out and actually has employees that know their products.

I am switching to a different shop, as the one I have been frequenting hires idiot s that have no idea about any of their products and are unable to answer questions let alone run a cash register.

Definately get a variable voltage/wattage battery. Bigger is not necessarily better, battery size only dictates how often you have to recharge. I also suggest a bottom coil wick using kanthal wire rated at 3 ohms. This allows you to experiment and find the settings right for you. Lower resistance coils burn out faster on variable batteries and may cause a fire.

For non variable batteries, shoot for the 4.2 volt/4watt range to start. a 1.5 ohm coil will do you right.

As for nicotine levels, I do not recommend anything over 18 mg/ml which is a concentration similar to a class AAA king cig. If you are that heavy of a smoker, that 24 will kill you, figuratively. That concentration would be like smoking 6 packs a day of Lucky Strike non-filters four cigs at a time!

Avoid Nichrome wire coils, and any set that does not use silicone seals and gaskets and all plastic tanks. Glycerine and PG will literally eat up your black BUNA seals and gaskets in a week and you end up covered is juice with nothing to puff on.

Also, the less PG in the juice, the better. I mean if you are into blowing smoke rings and being all trendy, go for it, but really, the PG is just there for looks and all I'm after is the nicotine. If you want big clouds of smoke, why bother vaping in my line of thinking.Thats just my opinion though.


For a first purchase, I advise skipping the web if you are new to vaping. Find a store with knowledgeable employees. If they can't tell you the difference between NiChrome wire and kanthal, or try to sell you on "throat bite" as a selling point, leave and go somewhere else.

Also note that right now vaping units are like LCD screens and microprocessors, and microscopes. They are all the same shit made in the same half dozen factories in China, the only thing that changes is the name stamped on the outside! Don't pay more for fancy names, the electronics are IDENTICAL!!!

Also, be careful of the batteries, many of them are pretty hazardous and you wouldn't want your dog or kid chewing on one. (That is true of all batteries though!)

As for the FDA regs, this will be the result:

Elimination of the myth that vaping is safer than smoking.

Increased availability of funds for valid, scientific research on the health and safety of vaping, I.E. federal funding.

Higher prices on "juice", as contrary to popular belief it IS a tobacco product and in my opinion should be regulated as such.(As stated somewhere above it is easier to extract nicotine from tobacco than synthesize it...)

Better regulation of the ingredients in the juice (see the PG EG discussion above as one example).

Removal of the "organic" claims- in chemistry, organic means there are carbon atoms in the molecule, nothing more. They like to advertise it in such a way to take advantage of consumers familiar with "organic" foods, which is a completely different scam. Additionally, nicotine is the base for nicotinamide pesticides- just remember that. They use nicotine with extra nitrogen atoms and extra carbon atoms to kill critters! Some of that stuff IS created when you heat vape juice, unless I am reading my lab equipment wrong.

Opening of the door to allow states and localities to tax vape juice as tobacco, resulting in higher prices.

Loss of many of the flavors for the same reason they outlawed fruity flavored smokes-it caters to kids! (I support this too.)

Additionally, the "Made in the USA" is better quality myth will be busted.

No worries on batteries and the like, the FDA doesn't regulate consumer electronics. However, I predict UL listings will be required soon. I have dissected a few failed battery units and found everything from lead solder to substandard wiring and a few other fire hazards.

A note on flavors: I have been running some of the popular flavors through the GC MS and FTIR in the lab and have found some unsurprising results. In these parts even the organic, food grade "flavors" utilize the same compounds found in products like scratch and sniff stickers, shampoo, and those fruit smelling markers we all loved as kids. In plain english, many of the popular flavors they sell will be proven to be far more harmful than tobacco.

 

[Sludge]

Sludge, wondered if you have any opinions on Effexor and prazosin? I've been through my fair share of cocktails, but this one is new.

I hate prazosin. Period. It does work really well for combat/military PTSD only in that is reduces sleep disturbances. I describe the mechanism earlier in this thread, and in detail in much older posts. There is a ton of valid research proving it works, but I don't have to like it. It is an FDA off label application currently and should be against the law when used off label in my opinion, unless one also has high blood pressure, which is what is is authorized to treat.
As for Effexor is a newer antidepressant, best described as a "happy pill". It really doesn't cure anything, but induces mild euphoria to make you feel good enough you don't care about being miserable all the time. This is the first I have heard of it used as a PTSD treatment.
http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/druginfo/meds/a694020.html
This is a class of drug called a stellate ganglion block and is similar in effect to Zoloft. It literally chemically turns off nerve clusters in the emotion control zones of your brain. Keep us posted on how this works for you, I for one am extremely interested. Unlike zoloft however, it has been known to cause the usual side effects one expects with SGBs such as mood swings, suicidal thoughts and other weirdness we already suffer from...
I honestly admit I need to do some more heavy reading on this one because the more I read about it, the more I wonder what your doctor is up to. Use of it with Prazosin likely makes you sleep like the dead, feel dizzy for a few hours in the morning, and may likely make you a safety hazard while driving, dependant on dosages and schedule. I'm guessing you likely have a heavy case of PTSD depression to deal with. (Been there, doing that too, just hiding it from my Doc as I really hate taking pills...)

I'm purely guessing here, but I suspect your doctor thinks you may have some additional mental health issues with the PTSD, which is perfectly normal and nothing to be embarrassed about. My own list of mental health issues and brain disorders fills two file folders, and I'm pretty sure a bunch of the meds I am on are just to counteract side effects of the PTSD and seizure drugs I'm on. (If it makes you feel better, the VA just sends me a roughly four pound box of pills in the mail every four weeks now, apparently. I'm pretty sure my blood has street value now...:ROFLMAO:

 

[Sludge]

Hey Maj. Biochem, sir! :D

Q for you:

- Is there a similar pathway or mode of action (or ___) involved in both cocaine & codones (oxy or hydro)?
- And if so, is there a medication on the market that utilizes that pathway or mode of action?
- Qualifier... Negate all overlaps with desoxyn. Unique to cocaine & codones.
- Qualifier 2 if needed to narrow the field... Not commonly used to treat bipolar disorder. ((Under the rule of thumb that if it helps someone with bipolar disorder, it will make someone with ADHD f*cking nuts. LOL the 2 disorders that, while closely sharing symptomology, never ever ever present comorbidly! I always feel so sad when I hear someone has been dx'd with both. Because it means their "professional" is an idiot who specializes in neither field or they'd know this, and they've got major suffering in their future. I just want to reach through the screen like Bill Cosby in GhostDad and throttle people who dx both comorbid.))
_________

I've been rx'd all 4 (as well as all the variations, the ine-group of opiates, methylphenidate family, various flavors of amphetamines, as well as some numbing agents) and there is something similar in the first 3 cognitive-emotionally that simply isn't present in all the rest. Something very usefully present.

To honestly and concisely answer your questions, I first have to admit psychopharma kinetics is not a specialty of mine, but I'll give anything a go if given the chance.

In response to your first point, yup, you got that right. Cocaine is/was a component of many of that class of pain medication drugs. The original one was simply codeine with some snort added to counteract the sleepy side effects and cardiovascular suppression of the opiate.

This is the paper that can answer your questions far better than I could here without writing another thesis:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16778732
However, I am having difficulty accessing a copy to share, which makes me question the validity.
In short, those drugs utilize the same major pathways, but fragment differently, dependent of CPDY2D6 and liver function. However, opiates tend to affect the sympathetic nervous system pathway cluster and cocaine mesolimbic reward system. (Gotta love fragmentation sub routes, eh?)

So to make a long story short, methadone looks like a generalized winner to the requirements you stated,save the desoxyn qualifier. So there goes that answer on my part... LMFAO This is a project I will work on over the next few days. I'm pretty good at SSRIs and beta lactams, but this is an area I never spent much time on. Nothing like a challenge to get my brain really working again!

I have always felt that even the terms ADHD and bipolar disorder, and their "related" afflictions are just painting the roses red. Personally, I feel that they would be better treated as differing symptomatology of the same root disorder. You example points out the serious risks of contraindications of both mental health in individuals and the pills they get fed. PTSD is the fun one in my mind, as we get the worst of both worlds, with schizophrenic spectrum symptomatology thrown in for good measure. As wishy-washy as it makes me sound, I support clumping it all into the category of social anxiety disorders and basing treatments off of epigenetic predispositions. But FSM forbid anyone does a little background research and some genetic analysis...

As for comorbidity, welcome to modern Americanized psycho-pharmacopeia! Everyone wants the Magic Pill, one drug to rule them all so to speak. I too want to stomp guts every time I see or hear of someone eating half the pharmacy because some asshole MD read a few checklists out of a textbook. The more I learn, the more I feel like no one knows shit, and no one communicates what little they do no in a fashion that could lead to cohesive solutions.

So before I ramble off random bullshit any longer, let me get back to you on this one. Gotta do some serious page turing in the uni library.

 

[holdenmonty]

So I have an interesting question. So after I first started getting treatment for my ptsd I was also what I feel as being miss diagnosed with A.D.D. but anyway was on Vyvanse for quite a while and felt good for the most part didn't have much of any symptoms of ptsd and thought that I didn't have it anymore. But the Vyvanse was eventually making my anxiety worse so they figured I was miss diagnosed and I have discovered that my ptsd never really left but I was wondering have you ever heard of or is there anything out there that the Vyvanse could have been suppressing the ptsd symptoms. I was thinking that maybe the Vyvanse was helping me focus so much that it made ignoring my ptsd symptoms easier so eventually I didn't even recognize them but was wondering if you might have heard or know of anything that might support that. I mainly am asking the question because I haven't had any flashbacks or trouble sleeping because of memories of my deployment when I was taking the Vyvanse but now that I have been off they have came back

 

[Friday]

If you are ADHD, stimulants calm you down. Which, at least in my experience, also puts a leash on the Beast. Makes him mind his manners. Mostly. But not always, and not in all ways.

Personally, I couldn't take amphetamine family ADHD meds even before I was PTSD, because they either kicked up rage, paranoia, or anxiety depending on the amphetamine. Even though stimulants (and stimulant precursors) generally calm ADHD down, each family has a general "feel" and then each individual one has its own unique qualities & "flavor". After picking up PTSD? Forget about it. Yes, amphetamines still calmed me down and cleared my mind, but the rage, paranoia, or anxiety attacks became insupportable because they accentuated what was already there. Bad news. Although the sleep was nice. I do miss being able to decide to go to bed, sleep, and wake up easily. Straterra (not an amphetamine) was the best for my sleep, but almost all the ADHD meds helped my sleep big time.

But I could give you the list of why I like/don't like certain families and certain meds in those families until the cows came home, but it would be flip a coin (or 12 sided dice) as to whether or not you responded the same way. Our neurochem is all different, even inside the same disorder, so we all get different side effects... As is what we like/don't like in those side effects. That's partly why there are over 80 different commonly Rx'd ADHD meds in 5 or 6 different families

You'd actually have to try them yourself to find out what "flavors" you like and dislike, and what the side effects for you individually are.

I'm not a doctor ... That said, I generally recommend / am in the school of thought that people try one from each different family, to get a feel of how you respond to each family, and then once you have a fav family, to try different individual meds & doses until you find your favorite. The other school is to try all the different individual flavors in 1 family, before moving on to the next family. It's personal preference, really. But one of the nice things about ADHD meds is that they're all fast acting. So you can "taste the rainbow" over about a year at most... And most people usually find a "Winner!" In a few months ((Unlike depression & bipolar meds which can take a really long time because they have to be eased in and eased out, and then once you find a combo, spend about a year tweaking doses. ))

Also, personally...I don't take ADHD meds. I've tried them all at one point or another, and I have to give up too many of the benefits of ADHD (and there are more benefits than drawbacks) even on the ones that work best for me. Maybe someday there will be a magic wand, but until then, I just take the edge off with caffeine & nicotine (and coca tea when in South America).

 

[holdenmonty]

Thank you that helps out a lot. I think I might be getting to the point where my therapist isn't helping much at all. Long story short we have gone through this 12 week program thing that she walked me through and all she does now is tells me that I have the tools in my tool box I just have to use them and that's basically all the appointments are now I tell her about what is going on and she refers back to one of the 12 sessions. It's like I could do my own therapy but the physiologist that gave me the Zoloft is helpful and I think I'm gonna keep seeing him.