General Ukzies Familiar With Esa, Serps, Atos, Etc.

[Peach]

I was wondering if anyone has much knowledge about these various...I don't even know what they are...services? Departments? My vet has tried to explain, but I am just not getting it. Seems like we're talking about at least 2 separate and distinct payments/groups here - ESA and SERPS, that he has lumped into one. It's quite possible he gets so wound up that he confuses himself, and/or it could be impossible for him to try to relay the information to someone else. I dunno.

I'll try to explain the situation the best I can. Unfortunately, it is really getting into Tater's craw (again) and I wish I knew how to help him. I'm worried he's gonna have a heart attack.

At some point in time, Tater started receiving payments from SERPS, because he was awarded an Unemployability Supplement with his disablement pension as part of the Welfare Reforms Bill. The eligibility perimeters changed 2.5 years ago. He had been entitled to SERPS, but when he had to redo the paperwork he was deemed "unfit to work, but fit to attend group sessions to look for work" which threatened to put a stop to the SERPS (£40 a week) and he's been fighting it ever since.

He says in his case, it was "contributions based," something he paid in while working. This is where I get confused. He also says it's ESA who he keeps having to fill out the papers for. He just sent back a huge packet to them a couple of weeks ago, and now they want him to go for a medical assessment. Problem is, he has enormous anxiety over answering the telephone, let alone making an outgoing call to set up an appointment - which he wrote about extensively in the forms.

SERPS he paid in, but ESA sounds like Government assistance. Right?

He's had an ongoing tribunal about this stuff all this time, but the DWP keeps delaying it with "false" evidence that he says he has disproved with his own papers. By now telling him that ATOS, a "disability denial factory," will conduct his medical assessment, he's worried it will cancel the tribunal.

He wants so badly to keep fighting for what he believes he has a right to, but now he's also getting scared that he'll piss someone off so much that it could put his war pension in jeopardy. Here's another thing, when he was very down about it yesterday and ready to give up he said, "It really wont matter what I do as the local government here is voting in the British governments welfare reforms as I write this. I paid SERPS, but the new legislation means your only entitled to it for 1 year so I will lose it anyway."

Can anyone make heads or tails of this?

 

[digger]

In short - SERPS is/was a pension scheme. ESA is Employment and Support Allowance. ATOS are a bunch of twats.

I'm not sure about the SERPS. ESA is a benefit (or state assistance) yes. The goalposts are constantly changing, people are constantly having to fight for what they're entitled to. His story is sadly not unusual.

ATOS are the company used by DWP (department of work and pensions) to do assessments of people for their eligibility of benefits. They are notoriously bad at it. A lot of people's lives have really been messed by them.

Has he been to Citizens Advice do you know? He may be able to get some assistance in tackling this.

 

[Sandstone]

It sounds to me as if it's ESA he is talking about in connection with being unfit for work but fit for work related activity. There are two ways to be eligible for ESA - Contributions based, related to National Insurance payments while in work, gets you it for as long as you need it, income based only lasts for a year. Then there are two groups you can be put in after an assessment Work Related Activity, where you can be required to do everything short of getting a job, and Support Group, where you are deemed unfit to do any work. At the moment they should be getting the same rate whichever group, but lovely George Osborne has just announced that he will be reducing the rate for new Work Related Activity group claims. That makes me absolutely livid and despairing. This government is beyond awful.

ATOS are indeed a bunch of twats, but do sometimes get it right - they have put me in Support twice. That was a surprise, as very often people have to appeal to get the right assessment. I understand yu start by asking for a mandatory reconsideration, then go to appeal. The forms are horrible, and I like any others found that filling them in sent me into a pit of self hatred. However it is essential to complete them properly - you need to get hold of the criteria used to understand what ATOS will be judging against. For instance there is a section on Awareness of everyday hazards where I gain points because I lose track of what I'm cooking if I try to have two pans on at once, so I burn food a lot. There is also one on "Occasionally has uncontrollable episodes of aggressive or disinhibited behaviour that would be unreasonable in any workplace." that would be relevant to many vets( and other PTSD sufferers), but many would not admit to because it isn't socially acceptable.

There are a lot of hoops to jump though, and as MIND has raised with government, people with mental health issues are the least able to do it all.

I don't know about SERPS, beyond it being the State Earnings Related Pension, and that it has been replaced. Probably another way to take money away while pretending not to.

 

[Purplemunchkin]

I don't know about SERPS, beyond it being the State Earnings Related Pension, and that it has been replaced. Probably another way to take money away while pretending not to.

SERPS was replaced by S2P (State Second Pension). Both are effectively a top-up to your basic State Pension, and are only paid out when you start receiving that at State Pension age (or later).

They are not technically contributory, however the amount of National Insurance you have paid (together with other factors like years spent working, caring, disabled, etc) is used to calculate what you are due. It used to be possible to 'contract out' of SERPS/S2P and the state would pay a lump sum into a personal/occupational pension instead of increasing your State Pension.

Obviously there is a lot more to it than that, it is very complicated and entirely dependent on an individual's circumstances.

He had been entitled to SERPS, but when he had to redo the paperwork he was deemed "unfit to work, but fit to attend group sessions to look for work" which threatened to put a stop to the SERPS (£40 a week) and he's been fighting it ever since.

This makes me think he's not talking about SERPS at all. The earliest he would be entitled to receive anything from the State Pension (including SERPS) would be age 65 (now increasing), and it is not affected by any other benefits. Again, if he contracted out he could access the funds earlier (from age 50/55 depending) but the income would not be affected by any state benefits (unless it increased the rate of tax he had to pay).

However other benefits may be affected if he receives a pension income.

Not much help I'm afraid, although I would suggest he double check the various acronyms as this could be causing confusion.

 

[Peach]

I cannot thank you three enough for replying, it's already starting to make more sense!:hug: I am getting a better idea of who gets what, when, and what for and am able to match it up to services in the US that I am much more familiar with. SERPS sounds pretty similar to Social Security and ESA is like DFCS (Division Of Family And Children Services) which helps with food cost, energy cost, child care, Medicaid, etc for low income families.

Has he been to Citizens Advice do you know?

I don't recall him ever mentioning Citizens Advice to me. I've checked it out and it seems helpful and comprehensive. Thank you, I'll pass it along and maybe it will be of some benefit to him. :tup:

It sounds to me as if it's ESA he is talking about in connection with being unfit for work but fit for work related activity. There are two ways to be eligible for ESA - Contributions based, related to National Insurance payments while in work, gets you it for as long as you need it, income based only lasts for a year. Then there are two groups you can be put in after an assessment Work Related Activity ... and Support Group,

Okay, I think the issue here is he's saying his ESA was contributions based, and so therefore, it should not be reduced or stopped, and they're saying he's on the income based payout.

Yes, he had said, "If he'd just been put in the support group they would have left me alone." So now I understand this "support group"...the name conjures up a different connotation for me. I'm still unsure how you can be unfit to work or "do everything short of getting a job," but fit to look for work at the same time. What tasks are just short of getting a job? Why would you look for work if you were then unfit to perform a job that was offered?:confused:

Awareness of everyday hazards ... "Occasionally has uncontrollable episodes of aggressive or disinhibited behaviour that would be unreasonable in any workplace."

I'm so glad you haven't had to fool with ATOS much. I hope it continues in your favor. ;)

I will share that with him as well. I would hope he would know not to make himself sound better/healthier than he is in this instance, but you're right, sometimes pride or embarrassment can get in the way.

SERPS (from age 50/55 depending)

He's 57, so it could be that he took it early and accepted the penalty/higher tax rate.

double check the various acronyms as this could be causing confusion.

If he didn't get SERPS, then, yes, perhaps that is part of what is throwing him. I'll discuss with him and try to figure it out.:wideeyed: