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What Happens When We Stand Up For Ourselves

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...you know where these things are coming from.

Fin, I have to tell you this, I really wanted to sleep but

"I do not need to know where these things are coming from"

It doesn't matter where 'they' come from, if we're lookin for where they're coming from then we're going to get triggered and it's not necessary, and it's not a good idea, we need to watch out for triggers learn from them and let them go.

That my tuppence worth! :wink: :smile:

from the list:
It is what it is, nothing more, nothingless
good night again and thanks,
Heather
 
"I do not need to know where these things are coming from"

It doesn't matter where 'they' come from, if we're lookin for where they're coming from then we're going to get triggered and it's not necessary, and it's not a good idea, we need to watch out for triggers learn from them and let them go.

I have only come back to this tonight because I can see you have gone off line and sleep is good ...I didn't say you needed to know where "these things" come from, I said I believed you knew where they came from.

And you may find that what I said was;

"Please try to trust yourself now on this....you know where these things are coming from. I know you do. Please, please know this ...you are not alone in any of this heather...please believe that. PLease..."

And I want to say now...and I am not trying to wind you up, although I don't know if you will believe me, I hope you will believe me ok...it maybe also depends on your interpretation of what "things" you believed I was referring to.

This is "the stuff" Heather...Because while I don't know how good or bad it is for you to avoid facing what triggers you, I am wondering and would like to point out that if you don't know what it is that triggers you and where it came from, then how can you guard against being triggered?

For me I managed for years (and I mean years) and I believed I was doing alright, really alright and ok, yes a little depression but I could control and cope with all the triggers and flashbacks and all of it..ok.And believe me when I say I had worked all my PTSD into my very high functioning life, and I almost thrived on it some. And then one day...when I really wasn't expecting it...right in front of me..it all got soo much worse, and it was sudden, real sudden...and from almost no-where, although I knew I was facing some heavy stuff, I had done before and had been fine. No this was different, I could no longer face any of it any more...and from then on in it was a fast decline into the nothingness I have known for a couple of years or more now.

I hope this doesn't happen or wont happen for you, but it did for me and now...this here, this forum and everything I have done and faced down here, well this has been what has worked for me. This has seen my life change quicker than I thought it possible. And while I know I have only just begun, I am really begining to see definite change, I know I will have to keep working on it, and I know I have so much yet to do, but I have started now...and it doesn't have to be all or nothing, but I am sure as hell going to keep trying and keep going. Because now I know it works, I trust what I have been doing here, and I trust myself better now than I have done in a very long time. And to me...all "these things" are the good stuff.

I really believe we have to in some way face our trauma's so we can begin to try to reduce their hold and affect on us. And if we can begin somehow to try to learn to contain their effects on us and we can do this within a controlled safe environment, then I believe this can only be a good thing.

I do honestly think we have to be able to address some of this in order to be able to understand and effect serious change. Lasting and serious change...and I may really be wrong here and if I am, I hope someone will tell me, but in trying to understand where we are I do believe we have to in some way understand where we have come from. And yes it may not be vital to managing pTSD I don't know, but so far from what I have done and tried to do I know that this is what has helped me.

And that is all I can share on this, and that is where I am coming from on it, and I hope that this can help you.

~fin

And That's my tuppence worth! :wink: :smile: hah!!! NO WIND UP I promise. I really hope this can help you Heather, I really do.

And that said I would like to say I hope you had a good nights sleep and that you have a great day tomorrow. Please remember what I have written here is only my opinion, but it is based on what I have experienced now and up til now.
 
"I do not need to know where these things are coming from"

It doesn't matter where 'they' come from, if we're lookin for where they're coming from then we're going to get triggered and it's not necessary, and it's not a good idea, we need to watch out for triggers learn from them and let them go.

That my tuppence worth! :wink: :smile:

from the list:
It is what it is, nothing more, nothingless

One last thing also...I was not clear if you were saying that your list was nothing more and then nothingless than it is what it is. (???) Because it may seem like nothing "all that" but I think it is -ok. And I am going to chalk it up to low self esteem that maybe has allowed you to put yourself and what you did there down.

And if you are referring to triggers or flashbacks as nothing more or nothing less I would like to say to you, that I believe that you are very wrong. And I also believe that watching for them; while good is not all we need or have to do about them.

A trigger can kill you, or someone else; if you get it at the wrong point in time, and a flashback can deceive you and also kill you at the wrong point or place in time.

Please don't be thinking "it is what it is" and playing it down as though it is no "bigee" because they are, it all is, and when it can -as far as I can tell and believe,- be managed; I think it is at least wise to try.

PLease dont ever kid yourself on these points. It is necessary and it is a good idea, and I am glad to see that you know to watch for them, although I do believe in that post there you did contradict yourself. But I am tired now so...

take care Heather

And thats it from me ..hah!! "finally!" I hear you sigh...!

~fin

Be safe Heather and know you are not alone, and that this can be managed better than just hoping it will stop and looking on the bright side. It takes a lot of work and it needs ot be maintained but it can be done. Please know that.
 
Heather, the way you processed your reactions to our comments and how it relates to your topic is totally cool. I wish I was better at gaining control over how I react to how I feel. IMPRESSIVE. :)
I want to say I'm sorry my comment wasn't more clear. I meant to communicate to you that your thread is something I can relate to, as people spent a lot of time telling me that I'm a doormat and/or I don't really stand for anything. Pretty much I cut those people out and stuck with the folks who had nicer things to say. And it helped me start testing the waters of speaking up, standing up, etc.
What I ended up writing was hard to decipher and ended in an instruction. UGH. I HATE when people don't listen and instead give advice, and then I did that very thing!
Lesson learned. Thank you for your responses - I appreciate it.
 
"I was not clear if you were saying that your list was nothing more and then nothingless than it is what it is. (???) Because it may seem like nothing "all that" but I think it is -ok. And I am going to chalk it up to low self esteem that maybe has allowed you to put yourself and what you did there down."
Fin, I believe the phrase, "Nothing more, nothing less" is meant as a way to accept how we feel in the moment. Heather can correct me if I'm wrong, but it is a sign of strength, acceptance, and normalization of reactions and feelings in the moment.
To me, it is a sign of high self-esteem, maturity and introspection. But again, I defer to Heather since they are her words. Just throwing my two cents in.
 
My mistake please accept my apology for any offense which may have been caused at my misunderstanding. I really had thought the thread was addressing something different, but it is all good I guess.

take care

~fin
 
You know I take back my apology...I know I am coming across as all over the place at the moment...but it is because I am going through this stuff here and changing..
so

I have found a quote of anthony's and i am going to use it...I hope this is ok...

...all about self esteem and posting and this is my struggle at the moment so...almost very apt and very appropriate..

. There is no need to defend yourself here. This is a global forum... who cares if someone else doesn't like what you say... You simply ignore what is said that you don't agree with, no comments what so ever, and continue posting as you would completely ignoring the nonsense. That is the great part about being online... you really do have a choice.

The problem is just that people feel they want to defend themselves because of low self esteem typically or feel they must justify themselves to some complete stranger through text. Why?

So what happened?.... I caved !! that's what and it feel slike crap to me..ok?

... and this is this thread and all it is about- COOL HUH?? yeah not soo much no...maybe yes...but for me personally at the moment...struggling...its urghhhh!! and it hurts over and over again...


This is why I believe the positive imput is so important...I try and Im sorry if that is not enough...you try it maybe you can help me and give me some pointers LOL yeah and then I would learn nothng no it is about doing it here, it is about us doing this stuff and not avoiiding it, facing off what hurts and is painful to us. We can all do this ok...I am still here just but I am still here...do it...it is your life nd no body can make you ...but it has to be better for me than my past life. Dont you think?



for enlightenment...
~fin
 
This also is a thread about submissive body language I hope it can help someone else
[DLMURL]http://www.ptsdforum.org/thread8305.html[/DLMURL] perhaps in trying to stand up for themselves, which I believe is the subject to some extent here.

I am glad to see that things are working out for you heather in this area, it is all good news, and very uplifting to read, I am learning a lot from you. You are very much inspirational to me at he moment, and that is so cool.

I hope though heather that you are able to take something from what I have written about triggers. I hope that someone can be helped by what I have written here.

Self esteem and the psyche in my opinion can be very fragile things within us, they are in me at the moment and so I can honestly say I have learnt considerably from partcipating here in this thread.

Anyone please that ever feels that you have no voice, please try ...and try again and maybe oyu will hopfull find one day that you at least can begin to hear it. Because so much of what is said today is very negative and not very uplifting and also people can perceive things in all sorts of ways, as we know with PTSD, it is sad but true and all we can do, and I have said this before; is try to remain true to something we feel is of value within us...and try to let that voice be heard and somehow be strengthened inside in trying to take that step...we are all very special people here. And we can all learn from each other.


Please try and please know you are not alone
~fin
 
fin said:
---I am not trying to wind you up---to avoid facing what triggers you---would like to point out that if you don't know what it is that triggers you and where it came from, then how can you guard against being triggered?

A good question fin, so here's my answer! It's a little bit involved! It's a List!

I don't wind up, never have, never will, and I choose to read what I read and I assume that the opinions written are those of the writer. If I don't want to read something I don't read it, I may choose to come back at a later date to see why I don't want to read it, and that would be for my own learning process. I do not read everything.
I don't consider that I avoid facing what triggers me, I consider a trigger as a simple warning sign that something is going on that needs my attention.

I am aware that noise triggers me, possibly from a car accident. The only thing that I can work with is what is going on right now at this moment. The accident is over I can't change that, but it left some unfinished business in my brain which apparently needs some attention, I can't take care of the trigger in one shot so I process it, this is how I do it:

An example: noise triggers me, so I'm at a store and there is some noise - music or something on the speaker systerm

1. I am aware that I'm becoming triggered

2. I check to see what I'm feeling

3. I check to see that am I safe

4. I make a point of breathing and just being aware of my body sensations which also helps to distract the thoughts somewhat and it helps to take my pulse, another distraction which has a calming effect, something to do with the beat, I don't count the pulse I feel it.

5. I consentrate on breathing and 'listening' to what else is with the trigger, that is, what does it remind me of

6. I allow the trigger to be there, accepting it and acknowledging it's existence allows it to flow until it recedes on it's own

7. It is the trigger that I work with, I let it be there, as soon as I figured out how to do this the triggers got less frequent and less scary

8. I know now what they are, so the real fear is not necessary, they are very temporary, even though I may have a different one that gets to me before I realize it, I am aware that the next time I can process it properly.

The noise example is very common, the first time I had it I ran, scared, now I am less reactive, I say ah this one again and I allow it, process it and it disintigrates, I'm also able to function and think and be aware all at the same time and let the 'easy ones' just pass, perhaps with a sigh which signifies it's complete.

The really heavy duty one's happen because I'm not processing them and I get triggered first before I realize what's going on.

To find my triggers I carry a tape recorder and make a note of them as they role in, some days none, some days many.

All this takes the emotion out of it so I'm dealing with facts, which are easier.

So the big thing for me is that I don't guard against being triggered, I work with it.

When the big emotional issue is reduced, which happens if I put it in the back of my mind without working on it, but I remain aware ot it, it tends to calm down over a period of about two weeks, then I can write about it, just write and listen as I write, I don't plan what I write, it just comes up and that is what I deal with, I don't really think about it, I just notice what is on my mind.

I think this is fourpence worth, :thumbs-up
Heather
 
So what happened?.... I caved !! that's what and it feels like crap to me..ok?

... and this is this thread and all it is about- COOL HUH?? yeah not soo much no...maybe yes...but for me personally at the moment...struggling...its urghhhh!! and it hurts
for enlightenment...

But you survived it and came out ahead, and I thank you for your input, I think we did a great job, without everyone's input we couldn't have learned so much, just be you, don't worry about being positive, well at least I don't, I think that will come naturally, I think trying to be positive stops me getting to where I need to be, so I gave up on that, it's overated and it just doesn't work for me, I have to let the me out, and then be happy to be me, when I see what me is all about.

How's that? just A penny for my thoughts? :wink:

Heather
 
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