Bdsm Relationship Vs Therapeutic Relationship

[Deleted member 35429]

When I first got into BDSM, finding men to sexually enslave me felt like a biological urgency that couldn't be controlled. I was driven to it and obsessed with it. When I was being dominated and flogged, tied up, etc I would tremble with adrenaline and complete submission.

Fast forward two decades and I finally had enough PTSD symptoms to send me to therapy. As soon as I found a therapist I felt a desperate urgency to be there as much as possible. I felt like he was my oxygen mask and I couldn't hardly breathe between sessions. I would tremble with a high heart rate before and during each session.

I kept telling my therapist that this experience feel just like when I'd go to dominant men for BDSM sex. I realize now BDSM was not only a way for me to know and understand my dissociated past, but it was a desperate need for someone else to see it and experience it with me.

Anyone else feel there are similarities between a BDSM relationship and a therapeutic relationship?

 

[Ronin]

While I can see where you're coming from, no, not really.

But then, I try to avoid both like a plague as a rule of thumb, to histories of control I've had both sides.

If a therapeutic relationship looks like a D/s one? I'd wonder about its toxicity and about its professionalism, big way. There's lines & one isn't the other. It might be a thing to bring up in therapy why you feel that way, though, certainly.

 

[Nevermore]

Hmm that's really interesting. Could it possibly be about having the full attention of another rather than similarities in other ways?
I had a childhood that, although not at all terrible, was full of emotionsl neglect as my mother had mental illness.
I became a sexual being young and I wasn't like other girls who seemed to do it just to please his boys. I loved sex!!
And sadly I got hurt by sex.
But when i look back now, I wonder if it was the attention that I craved and loved so much. That kind of attention is intense and I hadn't experienced much attention before that
Therapy is, or should be, a healthier kind of attention and hopefully a healing kind of attention. Not about fulfilling needs, but understanding them and changing the way you see yourself and therefore the world!
It's helped me a lot more than sex ever did!
Do you think that's part of it?

 

[Leighlee87]

Hmmm....I might be able to relate in a very different type of way. Do you think it could have a lot to do with transference (or in this instance, negative transference)? Therapy relationships tend to be an experience like no other, and it really puts you in a position where you allow yourself to depend on another person to lead you through, and often makes you feel vulnerable in the process both by the relationship (at least for me) and in the material being discussed. The therapist really does have a position of power in the relationship if you think about it. This might be why some of those feelings between therapy and bdsm are the same--the vunerability, trust, power exchange, dependency.

My personal experience has been very different, but you might be able to relate to some of what I say here. I just left a really abusive relationship with my dad. And honestly, I miss and crave that type relationship, and have nothing that feels similar to it in my daily life.

In session, my therapist finally pointed out that I have a bit of an issue with authority or someone in an authoritative type position. Anytime my therapist became even the tiniest bit firm, or started to push me a bit, I would curl up into myself. And she was right. I curl up, my breathing gets shallow and fast, my heart starts racing, I tend to start to dissociate a bit. She made the point to tell me that she isn't my dad. I know this, but sometimes (okay, a lot of times), it feels familiar and I'm not sure why. We've recently changed the dynamics of our therapy session to greatly reduce the frequency of it happening. BUT, I'm mad at her for it, I complain, beg, plead, tell her I hate her, because she is having me lead the sessions and that feeling is gone. There was a sense of familiarity and comfort there, that transference was comfortable for me and played on a relationship that I miss terribly despite how unhealthy it was. If your therapy sessions end up leaving you with the same emotional reaction that occurred in bdsm, I'm guessing that it is transference, something that needs to be worked through, and maybe things need to change in session as far as how the two of you communicate to make it healthier. For me, it means that I have to completely take over the session, determine the topic, do all of the talking. She interjects very occasionally, but in a very gentle way. I hate it because I don't feel like I know what I'm doing or that I'm getting anywhere. And the unfamiliarity of it pushes me way out of my comfort zone. But it's forcing me to be in charge, which is a complete role-reversal, and not something I've had a whole lot of practice with, which might be a huge learning experience on its own.
I'm not sure, I'm not sure if this is relatable for you or not. Either way, I think it is important to continue pushing the topic in therapy and maybe explore ways of maybe changing the dynamics of things so that it doesn't feel the way it currently does.

 

[Sideways]

I've used BDSM in the past as a way of recreating my trauma. It's complicated, but in essence that's what I was doing. And having grown up with sexual abuse, my body responded to it sexually because that's what I learned was sexual.

Flip over to the therapeutic relationships I've had, and I can see why they might feel similar. My first pdoc was a truly exceptional man - very good at his job, completely trustworthy, and bent over backwards for years to help me. Logically I could see that he was a safe person.

But ultimately, it got too confusing. As an older man in a position of control and authority, my brain was wired to assume that he ultimately wanted sexual control over me. It defied logic, and mostly was occurring on a subconscious level, but in retrospect it was always there.

I was told on more than one occasion that I'd be better off with a female pdoc, because until I got further through my healing, it would always simply be too confusing to my brain to have a male in the position of authority, and that could interfere with my recovery. I stiffly refused to change pdocs, because he was that awesome.

Ultimately, for me, it was disastrous. I should have listened to the advice. It was too confusing for my brain. And it took several pdocs before I found stability again. Listen to what your brain is telling you. If your brain is confused about the dynamic with your T, if your brain thinks this is supposed to be a sexual relationship, or that sexual submission is appropriate, listen to it. It makes sense that, with a history of abuse, your brain can't make sense of this new type of dynamic yet.

Whether that all applies to you, I can't say. But just know that if you do raise this issue with your T, and your T recommends that you find someone else to help you, it probably is coming from a place of genuine concern for what's the best and safest therapeutic environment for you, not a place of "need to dump this patient asap".

Hope you work things out so that your recovery isn't compromised.

 

[Keming]

Had a Master for years. Craved the structure, the simplicity, the honesty. Loved and obeyed.

Had BDSM sex partners (after Master). Pretty obvious (now) that whilst I felt 'good' at the time, they were just getting their rocks off w/ an eager subject. Not proud of that.

Have a Therapist. Don't give a crap about him and our conversations bore me.
--- --- ---
One doesn't feel any similarity between a BDSM relationship and a client-therapist relationship.

The vulnerability and non-reciprocal trust of BDSM might feel comparable to therapy despite the obvious differences in situation and context. However, the sex partners wanted something for themselves. T just wants to help. Being unafraid of revelation during therapy perhaps was useful for you, in the short term.

 

[Deleted member 35429]

Interesting perspectives... I'm just speaking freely here, I haven't organized my thoughts much, so pardon if this doesn't read well.

Looking back, I feel like my traumatized dissociated part FORCED me to go to BDSM to show me what had happened to me through reenactments. After 3 years of that I buried it all again for decades. PTSD came back hellaciously and I went to a therapist instead of kinky sex this time. There was definitely very negative transference for a long while, and erotic transference, and a lot of dissociation, but what struck me as the most similar to BDSM was the perpetual reenactments occuring in therapy that led me to have a deep craving to come back and back and back. I was hooked on the reliving. It was the first time I was having someone with me to hear what had happened to me and the desperation to be with him felt very similar to my desperation for domination and reenactment. The transference in therapy has been so powerful that we have discovered a lot about what happened to me through our own transference/countertransference and reenactment. So it makes sense that the BDSM reenactment feels similar to my therapy because therapy communication has been largely through reenactments for me.

It is also true that I'm the only one having to trust in therapy, just like when I was a sub. I hadn't thought of that. I also feel like the focused attention is similar, and reliving trauma in front of someone is similar. Having an older man in the role of therapist/power of course adds to it. There is also the intensity of the relationship and deep intimacy... That is uniquely powerful in BDSM and in therapy.

 

[whiteraven]

Hm, I was in a 6 year D/s relationship where the focus was on the power dynamic, although we (of course) engaged in the physical aspects of bdsm. For me, it was a very stable, very good relationship, in that it helped me learn to trust a man and to develop excellent communication skills. We talked about everything and he always checked in with me before we did anything. He was interested in my pleasure, as well as his own, so I really grew in my relationship with him.

I can see some similarities in this relationship and the client/therapist relationship in terms of the power dynamic the way my Dom ran it. It was *always* filled with mutual respect and lots of conversation, directed by him but focused on my needs and interests, there was a development of trust over time, and we talked about (and experimented in play with) deeper and deeper matters as time went on.

What I do NOT experience - in any way - with my therapist is any sort of physical reaction like I had with my Dom. None of the physical anticipation or desperate need, no racing heart, no shallow breathing, no arousal. I would be concerned if I experienced this.

It sounds like you are connecting the one thing with the other because the feelings are similar? There are a lot of intense feelings that are aroused in bdsm - being cared for, sexual arousal, being in a vulnerable position with another (which, in and of itself, can be arousing, or scary, or both) - have you asked yourself if you are having any of those feelings with your therapist?

In any case, it would definitely be a good thing to chat about in therapy, I imagine.

 

[Tinyflame]

Something that exposed for me, personally, the illusions of any positives in pursuing (unconsciously) trauma re-enactment was the book called (I believe) "Women Who Hurt Themselves". I think it showed me I would have compassion for anyone going through the same in the same circumstances, and in crying for the first time for that reason broke the need for re-enactment in many ways, exposed it for the desperate need, though not solution, it was. The writers revealed trauma re-enactment in their studies as an attempt to alter the past, though much like shooting an arrow with a crooked bow, and hence perpetuating the cycle (again, quite unconsciously), and really preventing living in a healthy, grounded reality-based and engaged present . And also, that pity was not love, nor did I deserve only pain (all I thought I deserved, or what constituted love).

ETA, on second thought, no, I never thought pain was love, just what I deserved.

Then again, what do I know. My ways aren't useful, maybe other ways are. Good luck to you. :hug:

 

[Beaglefan61]

Not sure i can add much, but wanted to say this topic caught me off guard with regard to issues involved. I don't particularly like to control or dominate nor be controlled nor be dominated, so the thought that bdsm could have an element of yielding 'trust' to the other was something i may have been not aware about. There is a surrender and trust element to it, not just a putting self in harms way is maybe something i wouldn't have understood. I had always just feared it as subjugation of one persons will. Can see how transference issues could happen with the best of types when it comes to surrender and how that needs to be worked through. Good thing to talk about in therapy to keep transference issues at bay.

"it was a desperate need for someone else to see it and experience it with me" can be an issue which is not about transference though. When hurting long enough and being alone with the pain it can be such a huge relief to be able to share and thus the desire to get back to therapy can be driven by that. So on that part itself maybe that is just a normal need in many ways.

Other ways therapy can be like bdsm i may not have thought about without this thread. This is where good communication for how therapy is not like bdsm is important in healing. We have to surrender ourselves in ways and entrust the therapist, but domination should not be an issue in therapy (note that i said 'should').

 

[Tinyflame]

Yep. Lack of respect and/ or lack of communication will surely do any relationship in, IMHO. In a therapeutic one, it's a business transaction in my mind (and a costly one at that).

 

[talon]

When I first got into BDSM, finding men to sexually enslave me felt like a biological urgency that couldn'...

I can only reply from experiences supporting someone with DID an extreme PTSD resulting from extreme trauma and childhood abuse . Often people who have such abuse at an early age may have that abuse continue to adulthood often with a catastrophic effect seeking abuse because it's all they understand and see this as normal. Many who are prostitutes or abused as slaves seek such relationships . Low self esteem is a part of this and the more extreme and dangerous the BDSM is the more addictive it becomes often with tragic results . Strangulation and asphyxiation often resulting in death or brain damage.