"There is No Cure."

[Sweet_E]

I just read an article on here that I think is pretty brilliant and then my heart sank at the end when read that common phrase, "There is no cure." I don't want to undermine the usefulness of the article so I'm going to write my thoughts on this specific point here.

I cringe whenever someone says, "there is no cure" about anything. The only thing that I think we could accurately say that there is no cure for is death - and even then, there is some gray area about when someone is considered legally dead, clinically dead, etc. We've all heard accounts about people being revived. If someone is in the grave, I feel confident that they aren't coming back. But if someone has flat-lined in a hospital, there is still hope. My point: Even with death, it's not all black and white.

Unless someone is God, I don't think it's their place to assert, "There is no cure" as a blanket statement to everyone with PTSD. And even then, the "Atheists Unite" forum could still argue against it.

When someone says "there is no cure for XYZ," I would argue that a more accurate statement is, "I am not aware of a cure" or that a particular field of study has not found a cure at this present time. Although the brain's response to trauma has evolved since humans existed, "PTSD" is still a fairly new diagnosis. In a way, we are all pioneers in how to deal with it. "There is no cure" sounds like "It is impossible to cure." How do you really know that?

Maybe this is just semantics but I feel it is important to discuss this because the statement of "There is no cure" for anything has the power to unnecessarily deflate someone's hope. I never want to take someone's hope away or limit what they feel is possible for them.

There are also so many people with PTSD with various levels of severity. For me, my PTSD worsened when I experience a second trauma 20 after the initial traumatic experience, and THEN it finally got diagnosed. I'm not sure how far my personal journey of healing will take me but what about someone who has a one time trauma and is diagnosed early and seeks treatment right away? Perhaps it is possible for them to resolve it completely with the best treatment for them.

There are many illnesses that have a cure, where it was said at one time that there is no cure. I hope that some day, the same will be said for at least some instances of PTSD and then treatment will progress from there. I'd hate to see a situation where complete resolution of PTSD is possible for someone but they resort to just accepting the status quo because someone in authority told them there is no cure.

The way that I choose to look at it is that, again, we are pioneers of this diagnosis. If someone wants to believe for themselves that there is no cure for them, I'll let them believe that. Maybe that belief is more constructive for them in coping with and improving their symptoms. However, maybe someone else needs to believe that a cure is possible. Maybe that belief is more constructive to their healing journey for them. Even if they do not find "a cure," perhaps reaching for a higher goal will result in a better outcome.

All of us here with PTSD are all very different. One person's attitude about how they choose to see their prospects for healing is not necessarily better than another. However, I respectfully wish that people would not make inaccurate, blanket statements and apply them to everyone with PTSD.

Thanks for listening. Rant over.

 

[DharmaGirl]

I get it. The T I'm seeing now has all sorts of new tools to use to combat the symptoms, so there is new information. There is all sorts of new info about how the brain is structured, there are new findings every day. It's only been recently that we, as a culture, allowed mental illness out in the open. Imagine what we will know 20 years from now! I'd like to be hopeful but I hear myself thinking, "but I have complex PTSD, so I have so many traumas that I can't begin to even think of healing them all". But you don't have to heal them all, I don't think. I don't know, but I would like to remain hopeful.

 

[EveHarrington]

I think Anthony wrote that article?

I understand that you feel minimized, but I think you’re reading way too much into that one statement.

I think that this is kind of passive aggressive. Why not just respond directly to the article (that you haven’t even linked so we have no idea if you’re taking that statement out of context)? Do you have problems with being assertive and standing up for yourself directly to those who upset you or violate you? I mean I’d hate for someone to get pissed about something I said and go off and rant about it elsewhere without addressing me. It doesn’t really solve anything.

 

[ladee]

What a great conversation!!! Thank you @Sweet_E for starting it.

I completely agree that we have no idea what can be accomplished in the future. I am 68 years old and have been slaying trauma demons, seems like forever. The major traumas have been processed and laid to rest. Many memories with no feelings or knee jerk reactions to.

My base line of depression and anxiety remain. Of course I am on meds to keep me from letting my messed up brain chemistry from killing me, or giving me permission to kill myself.

My brain is different. After all the work I have done, I often question what may have happened during my birth process. I was a big baby, born to a mom in her late thirties, and ended up being born by cesarean. How long was she in labor before they decided that was the only way?? How long was I in certain stressful positions, or pressure on my little brain for who knows how long.

Many variables. I don't know that I wasn't born with brain trauma. And don't know if there has ever been studies and research done on these types of births. Lots of questions. So many questions.

I have been depressed as long as I've been on this earth. Of course trauma added to an unstable brain, so I was doomed from the start.

It won't happen in my lifetime, but I certainly have hope for future generations, to not have to endure the life I've had, and continue to have. And it's not from my own lack of doing everything that was available at the time to do healing work.

So I have spent the last , at least, 10 years feeling that I had not done 'enough', or did things wrong because the depression is still ever present. No, today, I understand my brain is different. And that is not a BAD thing.

This is such a large topic, covering so many variables. Am looking forward to comments and different experiences.

Do I still have PTSD, which would be considered C-PTSD today? I don't know. And I have nothing to prove that I don't. Except for my own experiences of healing what I could, and accepting the rest.

I don't believe every tiny rock needs to be turned over and examined to some finite conclusion.

Being of a generation that 'mental illness' was shamed into dark corners and hidden, who knows how much faster my healing would have happened had I even been diagnosed with ADD, which I also have. Back then, it was just 'brat'... ignorance. Pure ignorance and the studies and research done since then have shown a light on so many aspects of how our brains process or don't process events in our lives.

So glad you started this conversation!!!!

 

[Still Standing]

@Sweet_E, I understand what you were saying. I think what you had to say was positive and hopeful. I may have long-standing trauma but I believe that I will be able to live above it all, at some point...at least this is my hope. If I had not thought this was possible, I would not have sought out help to learn how to counter the symptoms left by such events in my life. The mental health field, as with general medical, are fluid. They change and improve. Perhaps, today, it is believed there is no cure for PTSD symptoms but tomorrow, there may be. Your thoughts were positive and logical concerning your reactions to the statement that "there is no cure." It was not passive-aggressive from what I could see... but, what do I know? I tend to look for the positive, so maybe I am biased by my own idea that there is still hope in most matters. Thanks for sharing your thoughts.

 

[grit]

Thank you for writing this. When you see how you have overcome somethings, it is hard not to see how you can also overcome other things.

I think, personally, those that come up a new way of working with those who have trauma are people who have overcame themselves (even though they may not disclose) and we are getting closer.

I will just make a comment that may or may not relate to this topic.

Those with PTSD or CPTSD or any other childhood trauma have been saying forever, therapy sucks because they did not agree with therapists are above them. and they were called difficult or hard to treat or cure.
Now therapy is changing and saying there is inter-subjectivity! REALLY??? YOU DO NOT SAY!

That is from blank state to full on inter-subjectivity...to my feeling that if a therapist can hurt me, I can also hurt the therapist and to me that is why therapist can terminate you out because their ego, feelings, or competence is hurt. Otherwise, if they were hurt why are they terminating you out? it is a legitimate question.

So in essence, therapy is changing and what is cure is changing.

Thank you for sharing but this is a person or few people's opinion(s) and I know what I know true for me and I have come a long way.

 

[Abstract]

I am a believer in taking what is useful for you and working with that. Whatever that may be. You are definitely not the only person to believe that a proper full cure is potentially possible. Also, I think people often easily misunderstand what is meant by incurable when that is stated as what follows that statement is that it is treatable. Treatable means dealing with the symptoms and getting to a healthy life. Anyone knowledgeable believes that PTSD is at least treatable (just in case you missed that aspect of what was being said). There are quite a lot of people who will get PTSD and all their symptoms will resolve without any treatment. Maybe usually people with a single trauma etc. Yes, that probably isn't the majority of those on here.

I also think most people who are knowledgeable will agree with you that anything is possible in the future and that the field of psychology is an ever developing and changing one. They would totally agree with you that psychology is not a black and white field and rather a messy attempt to quantify and treat things that are very hard to quantify.

The way this site is run is that it closely follows present official accepted stances and diagnoses but that doesn't at all mean you and everyone on here has to believe that those will remain set in stone or that you aren't free to have other opinions.

I do actually believe that the potential for human beings to heal is ceilingless. Its remarkable what we can achieve at times with the right support and belief. Potentially. And who knows what science will bring to us in the future.

 

[Friday]

I respectfully wish that people would not make inaccurate, blanket statements and apply them to everyone with PTSD.

It not an inaccurate or blanket statement to say that there is no cure for PTSD. It’s a scientific fact.

There no cure for diabetes, AIDS, cancer, or the common cold or flu, either. Do you get your nose out of joint when people say so, wear ribbons, raise money for research, walk-for-the-cure, too? Or is PTSD the only condition that’s not allowed to not have a cure, yet?

I'd hate to see a situation where complete resolution of PTSD is possible for someone but they resort to just accepting the status quo because someone in authority told them there is no cure.

Seems like you hold a pretty low opinion of people with PTSD, to think we’d have to be lied to, to seek treatment.

What about every other disorder and condition that doesn’t have a cure, either? Should scientists and doctors keep that fact secret from people, too? Because we’re all too stupid to make informed decisions about our own lives? Can’t be trusted to learn about what’s affecting us, for real, and need to be manipulated into doing XYZ by being fed pretty lies? Shall we hold a press conference announcing the cures for cancer, PTSD, et al? Make all research Into treatments and cures state kept secrets, so no one knows there aren’t cures? ...That that way people can get the help they need? :confused:

Does any of this actually make sense to you? Because none of it makes sense to me.

But I’ve never really been a fan of being lied to, especially “for my own good” to manipulate me into doing what someone else wants me to do... but for that lie to stick, you realize you’re talking about an industry wide paradigm shift; where there is no informed consent, no shared information, no trusting the public with the known facts, no public research or fundraising, a complete and total alteration of how science & scientists operate? All because “we” can’t be trusted with the facts.

I have trust-issues in spades... but I think you’ve trumped me! :hilarious:

 

[Chris-duck]

I get what you're saying, and I get how you could feel disheartened by it. But I think it's similar to a bunch of physical illnesses. I have a physical illness that's in remission, not cured. But if I didn't have it already it wouldn't be detected because I've had treatment and it doesn't affect my day to day life. Maybe something will happen that makes it bad again and maybe it won't but it's still there.

I think it's the same with PTSD, can't be cured but you can get treatment and it can stop affecting your day to day life. Maybe it'll flare up/you'll get triggered every so often. But it's not the same as when it's untreated and f*cking shit up. I don't think you need to lose hope, things change all the time and nobody knows your own journey. Mental illness is weird and overlaps a lot in diagnoses so it could also easily depend on what mix and match symptoms you personally have going on.

I dunno, just my thoughts

 

[Justmehere]

“There is no cure” is not quite the same as saying “there is no cure that can ever be found ever.” When people say there is no cure for a condition, I don’t think they mean to say there is no hope. I think they mean there is “no known cure.”

I think it actually makes sense to say “there is no known cure” vs “there is no cure” - but this differences in semantics is minor and really doesn’t change the meaning that much.

I don’t see too many that fully give up hope because someone says there is no cure. I have seen many who chase treatments thinking it will be a cure, spend all their money, get burned out, and give up when the cure doesn’t happen.

In order to keep hope alive and encourage people to keep trying, it makes a lot of sense to me to emphasize the fact that there are effective treatments even while there isn’t a cure.

 

[grit]

I am not one of the people that compare mental conditions esp trauma to cancer or HIV or whatever. The reason I do not it is there are millions of people around the world who have childhood trauma and who do recover and who do change how treatment is dispensed and who do change how the world is changing. Other physical disease such as cancer or HIV or diabetes are not same as mental health.

The reason mental health has stigma and cancer or HIV to some extent do not have the same stigma (maybe aids is not a good example here cause it has history of its own) is that because many people do get over and get cured from trauma or other debilitating mental conditions. It is sad and unhelpful to dismiss those who made it.
Maybe those of us who are here have not made it yet and it is hard to imagine but our biggest issue is probably not to imagine that some do recover and go on with their lives in living in the here and now and having all trauma and its residue on their affects in a place of understanding and appreciating rather than total amnesia and not knowing where they have been.

Some trauma may not be curable. But some and many are.

If we go by the actual diagnosis of post trauma, it is easy to see that some are treatable and curable and some are not and for some people yes all are treatable.

To say there is no cure for every single person on earth forever who ever had PTSD is laughable!
cause the question is how do you know for a fact? and the other question is what one person actually was cured, just one single person? then does the statement it is incurable ever still true?

Another thing that science cannot answer before people throw the word science to silent others why some get PTSD but others do not? If they cannot figure that out, then the jury is still out.

I am basing these on my own experience and others that I know. So not scientific but if I know one case, there are others. Science is evolving and static. Science for today is not the one from yesterday where the earth was the centre of the universe! LOL

One sign of mental health is the absolutes. not all the time but most of the time.

One sign of health is ambivalence. maybe not all the time but most of the time.

I think that is all I can say about is PTSD curable or not. My best answer is I truly do not know but I sure hope so.

 

[Sweet_E]

I think Anthony wrote that article?

I understand that you feel minimized, but I think you’re reading way too much into that one statement.

I think that this is kind of passive aggressive. Why not just respond directly to the article (that you haven’t even linked so we have no idea if you’re taking that statement out of context)? Do you have problems with being assertive and standing up for yourself directly to those who upset you or violate you? I mean I’d hate for someone to get pissed about something I said and go off and rant about it elsewhere without addressing me. It doesn’t really solve anything.

I expressed an opinion about a phrase that is used by many people pretty frequently. The intention is to start a discussion, not to make personal attacks. Why don't we keep the discussion to discussing the points instead of making it personal and making assumptions about people's intentions or they feel. Thanks.

What a great conversation!!! Thank you @Sweet_E for starting it.

Thanks! I know I've probably ruffled some feathers but I'm glad someone got something out of it. I think we all have strong opinions about this stuff because it hits home so much.