Piecing things together

[somerandomguy]

Any chance for couple's therapy? It really helped us.

 

[HealingMama]

Any chance for couple's therapy? It really helped us.

We did couples therapy twice before and because he gets so defensive and has self esteem issues I asked him to do his own individual therapy before we try couples again. Otherwise I feel like it will be a waste of money.

Part of why I'm so frustrated is it took so long for him to start his individual work so that we could hurry up and see someone together because we very much needed to.

 

[HealingMama]

Reasons to fight for my marriage

1. He stuck by me when my attachment issues were really destructive.
2. We have a kid together.
3. Single parenting will be hard.
4. If I don't address my part in relational problems I'm likely doomed to repeat it next time (if I could ever tolerate a next time, which isn't feeling likely)
5. He's started his own treatment which might move some things in a needed direction.
6. I need to learn to share control.
7. Cheaper to maintain one home, more to share for the child.
8. Embarrassing to tell the community we failed.
9. Might be alone forever

Reasons to say uncle
1. Same fight different day.
2. He won't proactively learn about resources that could help us and apply them.
3. The energy feels toxic and negative.
4. His therapy won't change his avoidant attachment style which means we will always have that problem where I request something and he runs away.
5. He's made it sound like I'm the problem.
6. We don't have fun or shared positive rituals and because of his ADHD he will never take responsibility to create any of that on his own so I have a heavy burden of domestic and emotional labor on top of being the breadwinner.
7. There are some characteristics of his that are embarrassing to me and I'm not proud to call him my partner for these reasons.
8. If six years of asking for emotional needs to be met and for conflict to be processed not just dropped in a way that doesn't resolve anything hasn't gotten me results then why would I think any other effort will meet these important needs?
9. He doesn't respect me and says I can earn it back by not picking fights but he refuses to manage himself in a way that doesn't inflame our issues all the time.
10. He's underemployed and owes 5 figures in child support so he's not likely to be much financial support whether we live together or not.
11. When the going gets tough he falls apart and plays the victim which makes me feel like he will never have my back.
12. Things are only good when I'm too sick to communicate, and when that happens plenty of things do not get accomplished so when I'm well again there is fresh resentment.
13. I'm the designated work horse.
14. He's underemployed, and has legal issues, and somehow he thinks he is superior to me.
15. He has more free time than I do but still sees domestic work as my responsibility that he "helped me with" when he decides to.
16. His severe executive dysfunction probably means we will never be able to collaborate, coordinate or communicate effectively and he doesn't even consistently carry on conversation the way social skills are taught to people.
17. He won't look up from his phone when I'm trying to have a conversation.
18. I prayed about what to do in church and the very next thing was children sharing their affirmations and the first one shared was a little girl praying that people who are divorced can still love and find love.

 

[Jade-]

Omg it's so eerie how much I can relate to what you're saying here.

But,I just wanted to throw out a quote I saw that really has me thinking.

"All you can change is yourself,but sometimes that changes everything. "

You sound so much like me in your posts,I'm also so obsessed with everything my husband says or does,doesn't say or do and all the things about him and this marriage that I'm not ok with or that make me unhappy.He finally went to a dr,got some meds and is putting forth a bit of effort and I guess instead of appreciating it I bitched because he took so f*cking long to do it.And I'm still holding onto all the bad instead of letting it go and actually putting in effort myself.

The quote made me stop and take a look at myself.Im trying so hard to change him when in reality there's so much I need to work on and change about myself.

 

[Mach123]

I'm so sorry. I have felt like that so often. We have a lot of repetitive patterns. I know how hard it is when "you have your hooks in each other." Everything hurts.

She assaulted me verbally awhile ago. I wasn't innocent but I didn't deserve the the torrent she unloaded on me.

But I did that to her plenty of times.

So I was able to be the one saying "calm down."

I knew she was going to explode, she had a tough week and she needed to take it out on someone. I had done our devotion because we skipped church and I made breakfast. Then I said something "wrong." It was wrong too, I admit it.

But I was probably trying to get it over with. I knew she was going to blow lol.

I will say a prayer for you guys. Just remember it's nobody's fault? I really believe that. And I hope writing is helpful? It helped me vent a lot.

 

[HealingMama]

Omg it's so eerie how much I can relate to what you're saying here.

But,I just wanted to throw out a quote I saw that really has me thinking.

"All you can change is yourself,but sometimes that changes everything. "

You sound so much like me in your posts,I'm also so obsessed with everything my husband says or does,doesn't say or do and all the things about him and this marriage that I'm not ok with or that make me unhappy.He finally went to a dr,got some meds and is putting forth a bit of effort and I guess instead of appreciating it I bitched because he took so f*cking long to do it.And I'm still holding onto all the bad instead of letting it go and actually putting in effort myself.

The quote made me stop and take a look at myself.Im trying so hard to change him when in reality there's so much I need to work on and change about myself.

Thank you. I know that I need to work on me.

I just am currently feeling the way we both are within ourselves, our innate tendencies and preferences, will serve to create mutual destruction. I should not have married such a passive person who struggles to pay attention to me because it reflects my apparent unworthiness. Then I blow up and he's like what's your problem.

My problem is I'm not married to be invisible, discounted, dismissed and told I'm crazy. It's not really worth it to me to be married if that's the territory.

You're right I can't change anyone. Only myself. I feel like I deserve better than this even though I've behaved really badly. I don't want to be with someone that doesn't see my worth.

 

[HealingMama]

I'm so sorry. I have felt like that so often. We have a lot of repetitive patterns. I know how hard it is when "you have your hooks in each other." Everything hurts.

She assaulted me verbally awhile ago. I wasn't innocent but I didn't deserve the the torrent she unloaded on me.

But I did that to her plenty of times.

So I was able to be the one saying "calm down."

I knew she was going to explode, she had a tough week and she needed to take it out on someone. I had done our devotion because we skipped church and I made breakfast. Then I said something "wrong." It was wrong too, I admit it.

But I was probably trying to get it over with. I knew she was going to blow lol.

I will say a prayer for you guys. Just remember it's nobody's fault? I really believe that. And I hope writing is helpful? It helped me vent a lot.

Thanks. Yes, it helps to write and it also helps to hear from others because I don't really trust my perception consistently. All I know is my marriage hurts. It hurts everyone. Yes, please do pray for us.

Sometimes I think divorce would be the kind thing because I'm not sure he has the capacity to be the sort of person that meets my bare minimum needs or certainly all the nagging and begging would have gotten us somewhere.

He says that I should not talk to people on the internet for advice because I don't tell the whole story. Well, the whole story is I've been terrible. I've been verbally abusive. I have had a perpetual feeling of powerlessness to stop the ways he creates chaos, destruction and extra work in my life.

The only time there is peace is when I shut up and don't try to get my own needs met. We can play games and have intellectual conversations and I can bite my tongue about the clutter and chaos and disorganization but God forbid I actually ask him to make space for my needs.

I get that no one is perfect, and really if he had learned to deal with conflict before we met, I think we would be in a very different place.

It breaks my heart because he doesn't want to learn. He can't be bothered to read evidence based marriage solutions instead of playing on his phone for literally hours.

And objectively from the outside looking in, he isn't a good partner. But I've stayed and worked so hard on things to make this a situation that I can tolerate. He's been so slow to try to implement any changes. I'm just tired of hurting in the one place that is supposed to bring comfort and security.

 

[HealingMama]

Things I can change

Give up on asking for my needs to be met
Leave instead of complain
Stop texting
Stop coming to him to finish a conversation after he has disrespected me by leaving

Unfortunately when I implement these things it just increases distance in most cases. In the case of stopping asking for my needs to be met, it just increases my loneliness. It makes him get closer but my needs aren't really met more consistently when I don't ask because he is content to hide from spiritual and emotional and vulnerable sorts of sharing.

I've tried positive reinforcement but I haven't been able to sustain it.

 

[Jade-]

Thank you. I know that I need to work on me.

I just am currently feeling the way we both are within ourselves, our innate tendencies and preferences, will serve to create mutual destruction. I should not have married such a passive person who struggles to pay attention to me because it reflects my apparent unworthiness. Then I blow up and he's like what's your problem.

My problem is I'm not married to be invisible, discounted, dismissed and told I'm crazy. It's not really worth it to me to be married if that's the territory.

You're right I can't change anyone. Only myself. I feel like I deserve better than this even though I've behaved really badly. I don't want to be with someone that doesn't see my worth.

Exactly what I think and how I feel too.Im just gonna do my best at focusing on myself instead of my marriage. Try my best to not even argue or waste my time and breath trying to get him to understand where I'm coming from.Then whatever happens I will just go with the flow and see where it leads me.

 

[Mach123]

That's what you do. Focus on yourself. You don't have to do anything or go anywhere? You just have to stop it. I thought about this so long. It's not about him I know he's dreadful. You just said you were too. Good.

Now leave him alone and tell him you will if he does. Whatever you are doing to take care of him just stop. You leave each other alone and don't talk.

Then you have to talk about things and it starts again, but keep going back to it. Just stop it. Stop thinking about him you can't do anything about him.

I know that sucks and there was times I couldn't think about it? Because you go back to "He owes me, it's unfair." He doesn't though, even though it isn't fair.

But you have to back away and stop talking and arguing. I started thinking about my wife and I got to "leave her alone?"

I was right I knew it. It means "stop trying to make her do what you want." They don't anyway.

But you know all this and again, I get how much it hurts. I hope you guys get through it? It's awful what we put each other through lol.

 

[Mach123]

PS. I was thinking about you and I left out the most important thing? Why I know this and I know I'm right.

If your circumstances were different you'd be having the same fight. I know this is hard to believe but I have a best friend from high school and he's married about the same amount of time and he's about the same age. Their circumstances are vastly different. He is successful and he has money. He's a strong guy, Very much a type A. But we stayed in touch all these years and during a rough patch on both of our marriages we opened up and it saved both of our marriages.

because in spite of us being so vastly different in terms of circumstances we were having the exact same arguments with our wives and I mean Word for Word.

We both changed how we were dealing with things after we learnt that. It was a really big moment I think for both of us in our marriages. I actually really believed it saved both of them, preserved our families.

Because we all are basically the same as couples in particular. I really hope this helps but more than anything I hope it helps you stop fighting.

 

[HealingMama]

That's what you do. Focus on yourself. You don't have to do anything or go anywhere? You just have to stop it. I thought about this so long. It's not about him I know he's dreadful. You just said you were too. Good.

Now leave him alone and tell him you will if he does. Whatever you are doing to take care of him just stop. You leave each other alone and don't talk.

Then you have to talk about things and it starts again, but keep going back to it. Just stop it. Stop thinking about him you can't do anything about him.

I know that sucks and there was times I couldn't think about it? Because you go back to "He owes me, it's unfair." He doesn't though, even though it isn't fair.

But you have to back away and stop talking and arguing. I started thinking about my wife and I got to "leave her alone?"

I was right I knew it. It means "stop trying to make her do what you want." They don't anyway.

But you know all this and again, I get how much it hurts. I hope you guys get through it? It's awful what we put each other through lol.

Yeah, I mean, we can go back to having a cold war instead of a hot one I guess.

You're right that he doesn't owe me anything. I made a choice to be here. And made a choice to behave destructively when I felt like he was destroying my life instead of leaving him. I can only control myself.

I've been doing a lot of reading today and I really don't want to give up but I don't want to hurt anymore.

(I mean actually I really really do want to give up because nothing else has helped and I think we just don't work well together and my effort to back off doesn't really get me the kind of relationship I want... but it is hard to actually give up and stick with that position especially since there is a child so I will not be able to even make a clean break.)