Relationship Girlfriend drowning

[lunalight]

I'm not sure where to start or finish this post. Just as I'm not sure what I hope to get out of it. But I need something, and so here I am.

Sixteen months ago I met who I thought was going to be my forever, who I still hope is. We met online, living in different cities, we texted and chatted on the phone for nearly two months. We learned about one another, what made us tick, what brought us joy. He disclosed his diagnoses of PTSD and I felt I somewhat understood, having suffered from depression and anxiety for years. I wanted to help him, soothe him. I felt I could do that.

The time finally came, I was heading back to school and back to his city, we were going to meet. The meeting was nothing less than cinematic. It seemed our months of talking had forged a bond I had never imagined outside of a romance novel. We instantly connected. We were everything to one another. Sparks, magic, it was truly indescribable. The months passed and our bond grew. I moved in quickly, and we soon got pregnant. Sadly, shortly after, I lost the baby.

Things then began to take a turn. Fights occurring more often than not, contempt, passive aggressive notions.
Coming into this I recall being positive, so positive he remarked on it. He called me his light, his hope for a happy future. But slowly, I felt his negativity infiltrate my being. His pessimism replacing my light, his intolerance teaching me the new right from wrong.

I just want help. I want advice. I want to know how to get things back to how they were. He refuses to talk to someone, and similarly, refuses me talking to someone about how to support his PTSD. There are honestly moments when I question if he has PTSD or if he's just a narcissist.

I have never in my life met someone who can show me the utmost affection one moment, and treat me like absolute garbage the next.

His triggers are all over the place, so avoidance is near impossible. Diffusing fights seems just as impossible, if I were to agree with him, he gets mad at me conceding and claims he "doesn't want a spineless slave" but if I defend my opinion he escalates the situation to win my agreeance. He routinely tells me he's never been treated so badly as I treat him, for simple things like me being in an off mood and being anything less than nice to him. Even a simple joke, he takes as me "disparaging him" and it turns into a fight. However, if he makes jokes about my appearance or intelligence or the like, and I take issue with it, he calls me too sensitive and says I'm stifling his joking nature. That I'm changing who he is.

He is determined to keep some of his friendships hidden from me, something I've read is a trait of PTSD and that I've been told by our mutual friends he does regularly to protect some of his privacy. This leads to insecurities in me, which he tells me is unfair and controlling and something he shouldn't have to put up with.

On a number of occasions, a fun happy night will quickly turn into some of the worst fights I've ever been a part of because he "thought of something I did last week that he didn't like and shouldn't have to endure". Example, last weekend, after a great game night with friends (drinks included), he lashed out at me. A simple conversation where I told him he didn't have to feel bad about returning a gift he didn't like, turned into him telling me he can't be honest with anyone because sometimes feelings get hurt and he shouldn't have to bear anyone else's pain. Which then turned into him getting mad that a week prior, I had made an insecure comment (which we dealt with at the time). He yelled for, in no exaggeration, for 3 hours. Three. Yelling at the top of his lungs, throwing things, slamming things. Telling me he hates me, that I've made the last year of his life the worst he's ever had, that I'm a miserable b***h, that he wants me to leave. Yet, the next morning he wakes me with kisses and hugs. But never an apology. NEVER.

I don't know what to do anymore. I no longer know if it is indeed me. If I'm somehow making these "rude faces" and "condescending comments" that set him off. As he says he is a reflection of what he is given, he isn't mean unless someone is mean to him.

He tells me that now, my tears mean nothing. That he wants to be mean to me more often than not because I deserve it. I deserve to feel the pain I've caused him. That all the nice things I do for him and our house mean nothing because I'm a c**t far too often. He'll say things like, "Maybe if we were on better terms, you could be upset sometimes and be in a bad mood and not nice, but we aren't and so you have no right to be." He tells me that the fate of our relationship rests on my shoulders and he should not and will not change for anyone. That he wanted the best for us and our future and we could have had the best life but I've ruined it. And I don't know why I hold on so tight and keep trying. But when he does like me, he is so sweet and caring and affectionate. I know I sound crazy and pathetic.. I'm lost and confused and I need guidance.

Please.

 

[bellbird]

He tells me that the fate of our relationship rests on my shoulders and he should not and will not change for anyone.

Ohh gosh.
I see so many red flags in the way he is treating you.

I'm lost and confused and I need guidance.

I'm from the sufferer side of PTSD, but my best guidance I can give you is to put yourself first.
PTSD doesn't give us the right to be assholes.
Being in any healthy relationship with your guy is going to be near impossible if he doesn't get help. It's not going to get better if he doesn't get help. And it sounds at the moment like he's completely unwilling to do so.

I know what it's like to hold on to that romance novel-esque feeling; the kind we think is the best we'll ever feel.
But we hold onto it so tight that we close our eyes to being treated horribly in subsequent times.

You don't sound crazy.
You don't sound pathetic.
But you need to know, it's not right -- the way he's treating you. You don't deserve to be treated that way. You are worth more than this way that you are being treated.

 

[QueenBlue22]

I could have written your post.

I have no advice to offer as I'm in the same situation. Just know you're not alone. sending a hand to hold. I know how you feel. I'm there every day as well.

 

[siniang]

PTSD is a diagnosis, not an excuse, and it certainly doesn’t give us a free pass for shitty behavior.

All of us sufferers misbehave one time or another. It happens. But you know what I have not read in your text? Him apologizing for how he treats you in those moments even once.

I’m really sorry it is like this? But PTSD or not, you do not have to put up with this.

 

[lunalight]

Thank you all for responding. I want to know I have read and heard every word written. I appreciate the time you've taken to respond and although I can see that what you're saying is right, we all know I am not in the mindset of walking away. I do see how he is acting isn't fair or healthy, but I can't deny that it takes two in a relationship and I will work until I can't to make this work.
That being said, I know you've all said you have no advice to offer, but perhaps you have something? Some way to help diffuse situations that I have yet to learn, or a way to be more diplomatic when tensions raise (because I'm no saint and definitely snap back once I've been pushed).
Again, any advice would be hreatly apprecaited.

 

[siniang]

No one said you have to walk away right away. All we say is you don't have to put up with this :hug: Just be careful to "blame" the PTSD for his shitty behavior.

but I can't deny that it takes two in a relationship

Well...yes it does. But does he play his part?

He refuses to talk to someone

It doesn't sound like he's in therapy.

So why should it be all on you to fix this? Because he said so? I know it's hard, but when you have a moment, re-read your initial post. I agree with bellbird, lots of red flags....red flags we all refuse to see when we're deep in love.

Frankly? You've been together hardly a year. This is exactly the time when the hormones slow down somewhat and we lose our rose-colored glasses. From here, it will hardly ever go back to "how it was" -- because the initial phase of most relationships is significantly determined by hormones. This NEVER is a longterm thing, just biologically speaking. The first several months usually aren't sustainable. What happens when we regain some control over ourselves, independent from hormones, when we loose those rose-colored glasses...determines what's gonna happen in a relationsship longterm. And I'm sorry this sounds harsh, but given how fast it flipped in just a short time.... given he DOES Have a mental illness....I doubt it's gonna get better from there. Especially when he refuses to seek help.

 

[Ronin]

Honestly I think the awesome bond etc in the beginning was just chemistry. You being in love... not who he is or was.

The rest is very telling of his character. Who he is. Theres no fixing the relationship to what it was... because only one person is that awesome one. You.

Edited to add. Ive been in a looong string of abusive relationships, currently in one healthy so far with someone who has more actual health issues than the prior morons claimed combined... and guess what? On their worst day, the boyfriend wouldnt dream of calling me names.

It aint PTSD or else.. but them.

 

[mumstheword]

Yes, the way he is treating you is narcissistic. I put up with this for 20+ years. It didn't change, it didn't get better. I couldn't "win his love and respect". No approaches got him to become reasonable.

It isn't the symptoms of ptsd, it's how a "cluster b" disordered personality behaves.

You holding out and thinking things will get better is a really, really dangerous mentality. Thinking like that nearly killed me. I stayed until I was really, really close to death. You might think this is hyperbole, I wish it were.

He doesn't take responsibility for himself. That is textbook cluster b.

Sorry, I can't be more positive for you. I am worried for your wellbeing, staying in this very unhealthy codependant relationship.

You are probably very empathic and idealistic, people like us are very much an attractant for cluster b people, because we are manipulatable by our hearts. We think that if we take the blame, try to please them enough and try harder to be impeccable, that, eventually, they will stop treating us like that and that we can.win their love.

Cluster b's don't operate in any reasonable capacity, ever, unless they own their problems and get treatment, and that is very, very rare.

They despise themselves, understandable, they behave in vile, harmful, lame ways, and they despise people who put up with their abuse. They have more and more contempt for us, the longer we submit to their contempt and take on their projected self-loathing.

They ooze with envy for us. They resent our shining light, because they don't believe in their own inner light. They want to own it and control it, but they despise themselves for their own sick, depraved desire for control of us. They know we give them acceptance and allegiance that is undeserved and they can't forgive us for it.

I could be misreading or projecting here, so feel free to disregard whatever does not fit, but if you read anything that resonates as true, please accept my genuine condolences as you are in a no-win situation.

I'm so sorry. I wouldn't wish this kind of psychological and systematic break down on my worst enemy, if I had any.

I had many, many children, with such a cluster b person, and he has destroyed not only my sanity (I got it back though, eventually, after leaving him) and every aspect of health of myself, but most of my children too. It's 30 years now and no sign of him ever changing, even though my children who are under his influence keep getting psychotically ill and suicidal.

These disordered personalities are very, very unwell and toxic-to-be- around people.

Please put yourself first. Learn to believe in yourself and love yourself. You deserve so, so, so much more and better, but you have to believe you do, and disengage from this hot mess of a relationship.

I did it and I am in a truly loving respectful stable, supportive relationship now.

You can have that too, but I very much doubt it will be with this man.

 

[LuckiLee]

Imho... It is PTSD. Untreated PTSD. Symptomatic PTSD. That is my guy symptomatic AF and taking his meds all willy nilly, drinking, not giving a rats ass about anything or anyone. I have been in your shoes @lunalight. ❤

The only advice I can give is learn about boundaries and set and enforce them. (Search the forum for boundaries, you should be able to find different threads on the topic. I learned alot from @Sweetpea76 ?) Don't engage when he's being like that all it does is add fuel to the fire and drag you into the crazy making. (Omg!!! the stupid arguments we had before I knew I could simply walk away)

It sounds like your guy really neéds some help. Unfortunately we can't help. All we can do is support. If he isn't willing to reach out for help to a trauma specialist nothing will improve for him. My guy was untreated for 20+ (ugly) years. He had a really hard time. Today. He's doing so well. PTSD still likes to cause havoc but we have the tools and knowledge to deal with it. It definitely takes alot of hard work from BOTH of us. One person can't do it alone.

Good luck and I hope he decides to get the help he needs.

Welcome to the forums.

 

[mumstheword]

Wow, I've had ptsd for as long as I can remember and I've never mindf*cked people like that.

I really don't agree with the above post.

I guess, if he admits to and agrees to treatment, that would cause me to rethink.

I think the deciding factor might be the willingness to admit to one's own problems, those that don't, won't and "can't" (often) have disordered personalities - personality disorders, and those that do, genuinely, just, have a stress disorder that can be called PTSD.

Even those that get diagnosed with borderline personality disorder who go into treatment, have probably been misdiagnosed and actually have Complex PTSD ( I suspect, that is my running theory, based on experience and research, anyway) as they can modify behaviours, developed from increasing self awareness and input from helpful others, whereas personality disorders are melded in to their personality, they mistake their maladaptive behaviours (without ever admitting to it though) for "who they are" and constantly try to avoid responsibility because, I suspect, they doubt their ability to (ever?) change .

The people I know, with those kinds of abusive patterns have never and most likely, never will, submit to, or engage in, treatment, and so, I think it is very important to keep your eyes wide open about whether that person shows any capacity to be accountable, honest and self aware, about their problems and behaviour.

If they blame, blame, blame, ceaselessly, well, that is purely narcissistic manipulation ploys and should not be attributed to PTSD, even though the behaviour could still, very much, and probably is, caused by (most likely, developmental) trauma, at least, in part.

Is it just immaturity? Possibly, but the question is, is that person showing any signs that they are willing to do the work required to become mature?

Narcissism is really, at core a VERY stunted developmental issue. The person stays at tantruming, me, me, me, toddler stage, but learns adult manipulative ploys instead of, or, as well as, just screaming, throwing things, and the like.

PTSD is simply an injured brain/endocrine system from constant overload of extreme and harmful, life-threatening (or, at least, perceived life-threatening) stress(es). It highjacks our neural system and enflames our reptilian -amygdala and limbic- mammalian brain, causing fight, flight (dissociation is also a form of flight, from the body and or awareness itself), flee, freeze or fawn responses.
It is an overreactive nervous system.

I'm sure other interpersonal psycho/social disabilities such as personality disorders can involve the same damage to the brain/nervous system, but the person's manner of dealing with their stressed out and hyper reactive brain/nervous system probably determines whether they develop a disordered personality or PTSD.

The two are not the same thing, although they can look similar and be mistaken for each other.

The other thing to consider is that cluster B personality disordered people can lie about their condition or manipulate diagnosers because they (can) use "poor me" victim mentality ploys to manipulate people, to garner sympathy and compassion, in order to escape accountability and to mask their abusive crimes and misdemeanors towards others. I'm not saying bad things haven't happened to them, just that there is more to the story, that they won't admit to, and it's important to garner their level of honesty, in this respect, because diagnosers can be duped too .

They can manipulate clinicians into giving them a PTSD diagnosis, when in fact, they have another, more other-harming and malignant personality disorder.

I know this to be true. There are people in my family and (ex) friend circle who have done this.

It's important to know what you are dealing with.

There are some great resources re dealing with narcissistic abuse.

Please don't let yourself be manipulated by the "I have PTSD so it's not my fault" kind of excuse generation, by this person. That kind of behaviour IS NOT a symptom of ptsd.

Abuse doesn't equal stress disorder, it's more likely to be a personality disorder, when no regret or apology is ever forthcoming.

The difference is, stress disorder? The person isn't so far gone they can't behave accountably or, at least, work towards owning their stress, when triggered.

Cluster B personality disorder? Not so much and maybe never.

 

[Justmehere]

I can tell that you really care a lot about exhausting options before giving up. It is admirable to really want to persevere. Coming from a sufferer standpoint, the input you are getting is good. It’s also hard. I wish there was a good way to help someone with PTSD change that didn’t want to change, but there isn’t one. That’s one of the crap things about PTSD.

It’s important to remember dating is about trying to find a good fit. Staying in a relationship based on a hope to fix or change the other person is a rough way to go that often ends up with both parties resenting the other. There is someone you can change, and that’s you, and only you.

He called me his light, his hope for a happy future. But slowly, I felt his negativity infiltrate my being. His pessimism replacing my light, his intolerance teaching me the new right from wrong.

Falling in love is a wonderful feeling, but putting all his happiness on you and your unhappiness on him is a sign of needing stronger boundaries between the two of you. You are responsible for your happiness and he is responsible for his. Try to resist enmeshment. It will only enable him to not take responsibility for his recovery and make it easier for him to stay stuck and miserable. Don’t take on managing his triggers. Let him work it out.

I want to know how to get things back to how they were. He refuses to talk to someone, and similarly, refuses me talking to someone about how to support his PTSD.

It’s not really likely it will go back to how it was at the beginning even if he did want to change and even get treatment. I know this stinks to read.

Online dating allows for people to put their best foot forward and really manage contact. He was probably symptomatic then, but it was way easier to hide. When I’ve developed an online relationship with a guy, I seem amazing and totally put together. Reality in person? I can live up to that online romance for a short time offline, but eventually symptoms leak through.

For you both, an amazing first date was built up during months of online communications. Now you are getting to know him beyond that initial honeymoon phase. He didn’t likely change but rather you both got to know each other’s flaws more. You are getting to know him when he is symptomatic. You can put all the work you want into managing his symptoms for him, and it won’t do any good, and might even massively backfire. (Usually does.) You can’t work harder than he is working for his recovery and get anywhere. He’s got to own it. All you have any power over is you.

I have never in my life met someone who can show me the utmost affection one moment, and treat me like absolute garbage the next.

One good book: Stop Walking on Eggshells -
it’s geared towards supporters of those with BPD, which he may or may not have in addition to PTSD, but the issues of how supporters can handle arguments and intense hot/cold push/pull are well addressed in that book.

I do see how he is acting isn't fair or healthy, but I can't deny that it takes two in a relationship and I will work until I can't to make this work.

I hear you that you are willing to work on it. Is he willing?

Some way to help diffuse situations that I have yet to learn, or a way to be more diplomatic when tensions raise (because I'm no saint and definitely snap back once I've been pushed).

Learn to hold boundaries and walk away until he is calmer. If he is reactive out of PTSD symptoms, then you won’t get anywhere trying to talk him down. His brain would be in fight or flight and executive functioning shuts off when that happens. Walk away from the interaction until he is grounded and calmer and able to better talk through an issue. Another tool is to google non-violent communication techniques. It’s a simple way to try to help someone deescalate themselves but at the end of the day, if this is a fight or flight fueled PTSD reactive state, it may not work very well.

Relationships can stir up a lot of things for sufferers. For me, I can do closeness, until I just can not do it. I have to go really slow to stick it out.

He may be telling you by his behavior and unwillingness to work on things that he isn’t ready for a relationship right now. Even if he gets into treatment, there won’t be a quick fix. Symptoms often get worse with treatment at first before they get better.

Stay in the relationship or not, the more you can focus on what you control, which is your boundaries and limits and what you choose to engage and not, the better.

I’m glad you reached out for advice for you, despite him trying to stop you. You get to do what is right for you. Hold on to that.

 

[LuckiLee]

That's the difference. My guy has always been accountable for his actions. He owns up to his f#ck ups. Apologizes..And we have always communicated with each other through all of it. Once he accepted his diagnosis and treatment the sky was the limit.

It wasn't easy. It took us years to get to this place. WE work hard every single day. He was a sad broken combat veteran who never had any support from wives, girlfriends or family. PTSD. Anxiety. Depression. TBI's, SI.... He was a mess.

I never gave up because he never did.

He is in trauma therapy, group therapy, on meds, eats ok-ish, doesn't drink in excess, gets exercise and sleeps when he can. And he treats me with kindness and respect.

As I said if he doesn't do the work nothing will change. He has to acknowledge there's a problem in the first place before he can change anything. That is a hard thing to admit. It's even harder to reach out for help.

XO