General Granddaughter, lying & fractured relationships

[Trauma]

My 12 year old granddaughter was diagnosed with PTSD. She and I recently spent the day together. We haven’t necessary had a close relationship due to my health and her parents didn’t bring her over to see me through the years I couldn’t go see her. Nevertheless as she started getting older conversations on the phone were more frequent and we became closer.

During our recent visit she wanted to talk to me about her parents splitting up. They continue to live together but as roommates. She shared she felt like it was her fault that they split and thought if she had been “better” they would be together. She was in tears and told me she had started cutting herself during that time. I was aware of that as her mom told me. It had been 2 years and she said she had not done it since then. She asked me not to tell her mom about thinking it was her fault because she didn’t want to hurt her feelings.

She is in counseling and said she talks to her about this. I told her I wouldn’t say anything but if I found out she was hurting herself or felt like she wanted to I would have to say something. I raised 2 of her siblings for 10 years. While we were talking I said something about the house where I use to live and she didn’t remember me Iiving anywhere else and I said it was the house when your sisters lived with me. She had no memory of any of it including her sisters living with me.

She asked me if her mom had done something to them and I just said she needed some time to get things together so they came to live with me. We hugged on each other and it was time for her to go home. A few days later I got a text from her mom saying my granddaughter had told her I said she was violent to her sisters and she was to keep it a secret that I told her. I was shocked and devastated and of course her mother didn’t believe me when I told her what happened. I don’t know what to do.

I’ve researched PTSD and lying is not uncommon as a coping mechanism, attention and other reasons but I have no idea how to handle this. My grandchildren are my world and my entire life since they were born was to be there for them and love them with all I have in me and this has completely destroyed all of us. All of my grandchildren were told this.I don’t know what to do. I would appreciate any help. Thank you.

 

[arfie]

not to discredit your granddaughter, but these days 12 year olds think not getting the latest greatest tech gadget causes ptsd.

setting that snarky pearl of cynicism aside. . .

"ears open, mouth shut" is the mantra i use when listening to my youngers. experts are a dime a dozen in our information saturated world. somebody to open up their ears and let those feelings through are more rare than telephone landlines. i find that when i only talk enough to prove i am listening, the younger sorts his/her way to where she/he needs to be. self-discovery carries far more weight than expert expostulations.

 

[Movingforward10]

You have your daughter's account, not your granddaughters. So, caution first.

Second, she's a child. Who is going through a lot. So, maybe that's what she heard in her head? How she interpreted it? Or maybe she outright lied to get a reaction from her mum?

Either way, I would come at it with kindness and curiosity rather than anger or confusion or upset.

 

[Yaya7]

not to discredit your granddaughter, but these days 12 year olds think not getting the latest greatest tech gadget causes ptsd.

setting that snarky pearl of cynicism aside. . .

"ears open, mouth shut" is the mantra i use when listening to my youngers. experts are a dime a dozen in our information saturated world. somebody to open up their ears and let those feelings through are more rare than telephone landlines. i find that when i only talk enough to prove i am listening, the younger sorts his/her way to where she/he needs to be. self-discovery carries far more weight than expert expostulations

You have your daughter's account, not your granddaughters. So, caution first.

Second, she's a child. Who is going through a lot. So, maybe that's what she heard in her head? How she interpreted it? Or maybe she outright lied to get a reaction from her mum?

Either way, I would come at it with kindness and curiosity rather than anger or confusion or upset.

Thank you for your reply. Everything you said made a lot of sense. Since my post my granddaughter sent a text setting boundaries for us being together. I know this came from her counselor due to the wording. She said she was setting a boundary that we wouldn’t spend time together without a sibling or parent present. I’m all for an adult being present because quite honestly I don’t want to be alone with her.

The very next day she sent a text wanting to talk to me about the situation I asked if her mother knew she was contacting me and she just said she told her mom she has sent the text about boundaries so basically no her mother did not know she was trying to talk to me alone. I reminded her she was not following the boundary she set for someone to be present and she said she was okay with texting. So I said I was setting a boundary that this would not be discussed without both of us feeling safe and having someone present.

My purpose in saying that is I didn’t want there to be any confusion as interpretation in a text can be tricky. I’m not one to handle conflict by text and she attempted to manipulate me into talking about it then but I would not give in. I actually am waiting to speak to my therapist before talking to her so she can guide me on how to word my discussion with my granddaughter and my appointment isn’t until Monday.

I really don’t know what is behind this. She seems to be holding on to what she said happened. I don’t know if she is confused but it’s hard to understand how she got what she is saying that happened out of anything we talked about. I guess another thing that’s been on my mind is my granddaughter has frequently stolen things when she has been in my home. It may seem insignificant because it’s been things like candy but not just a piece or two but everything in the house, money( not large amounts so far) etc but just taking whatever she wants without asking and hiding it.

I’ve caught her repeatedly but her parents don’t think it’s a big deal and I hate to say this but this last situation has hurt me to the point that I feel I need to take a break while her counselor is working with her on the new diagnosis of ptsd. I don’t know how this diagnosis came about but her 16 year old sister received the same diagnosis.

If this is true as it came from my daughter what is going on or what trauma have they both been through to have this. This conversation all started with my granddaughter in tears about cutting herself when her parents decided not to be together and she thought it was her fault and she didn’t want me to say anything to her parents because she didn’t want to hurt them.

In addition my daughter is an alcoholic.

Sorry this has been a book. There is so much more but I will end it there. Thanks for listening. I am here for you to reach out as well. I have to catch up on your story. I just really appreciate your precious reply which showed great insight. All the best to you

 

[Sideways]

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[Movingforward10]

So I said I was setting a boundary that this would not be discussed without both of us feeling safe and having someone present.

I get the impression you're treating her as an equal. She's a 12 year old child who has PTSD, is self harming, has an alcoholic parent, and her parents have separated, along with whatever has caused the PTSD.
You're an adult and her grand parent. Can you keep your upset and feelings unsafe away from her rather than putting it on her?

. I don’t know how this diagnosis came about but her 16 year old sister received the same diagnosis.

Maybe exploring that? You not knowing is a big deal. There is clearly a lot you don't know about their lives. Which means that you have a relationship to build up with your granddaughters for them to share their trauma with you.

If this is true

Why wouldn't it be? Are you doubting what you're being told?

This conversation all started with my granddaughter in tears about cutting herself when her parents decided not to be together and she thought it was her fault and she didn’t want me to say anything to her parents because she didn’t want to hurt them.

It's very common for children to blame themselves about their parents separating. Or any trauma really.

In addition my daughter is an alcoholic.

it must be difficult to see your daughter struggle with addiction. And it must be very difficult for your grandchildren to be parented by someone with addiction.

 

[arfie]

interpretation in a text can be tricky. I’m not one to handle conflict by text

when my youngest son and his wife were living with me, it hit my 20th century sensibilities as ridiculous on high when i witnessed my son standing outside his closed bedroom door, arguing by text with his wife on the other side of the closed door. eventually i came to appreciate the more quiet approach. their yelling matches were high volume horror. the tension of conflict still permeated the house, but the quieter tension felt like an improvement.

fast forward a decade and i have grown a preference for arguing by text with my own hub-a-lub. it cuts down on the tit-for-tat and the temptation to say things i will regret later. yes, interpretation in a text can be tricky, but not as tricky as interpreting the sheer volume of an extended tit-for-tat skirmish filled with the unedited rancor of verbal vomit. reviewing an angry text stream is far, far easier than reviewing the evaporated verbal vomit.

Sorry this has been a book. There is so much more but I will end it there.

the venting is an essential part of my own recovery, but it is far easier to make sustainable changes when i take them in small chunks.

on the lying and stealing
my six year old foster daughter is looking like a natural born liar and thief. i routinely catch her lying and she has little to no respect for personal ownership. drawing boundaries on this score has set us up for continual conflict. outsiders accuse me of treating it casually, but? ? ? i feel like i am fast dancing on a razor's edge. i'm VERY picky about whom i invite to be my dance partner on that razor's edge.

 

[Trauma]

I get the impression you're treating her as an equal. She's a 12 year old child who has PTSD, is self harming, has an alcoholic parent, and her parents have separated, along with whatever has caused the PTSD.
You're an adult and her grand parent. Can you keep your upset and feelings unsafe away from her rather than putting it on her?

Maybe exploring that? You not knowing is a big deal. There is clearly a lot you don't know about their lives. Which means that you have a relationship to build up with your granddaughters for them to share their trauma with you.

Why wouldn't it be? Are you doubting what you're being told?

It's very common for children to blame themselves about their parents separating. Or any trauma really.

it must be difficult to see your daughter struggle with addiction. And it must be very difficult for your grandchildren to be parented by someone with addiction.

I responded to my granddaughter about boundaries because she sent a text to me setting boundaries for us to basically talk about anything or be together. In my experience in counseling this is frequently the advise that is given when someone is experiencing an unhealthy relationship. The wording of her text was very mature and I could tell had been put together by an adult. I believe the diagnosis. I am concerned that both of the youngest granddaughters have received this diagnosis. I raised my oldest granddaughters for a reason and for this granddaughter to share something with me that she said happened two years ago in tears and asking me not to say anything to her parents because she doesn’t want to hurt them and then for her to turn this around and say I said her mother was violent to the grandchildren I raised and I told her to keep it a secret I feel I have to protect myself. The family dynamics in general are toxic and all of my grandchildren were pulled into this by my daughter and I am being treated like a monster. I obviously don’t know why she said those things, I would never say anything to hurt her. I don’t know how to handle this so I am waiting for input from my therapist because I feel this has to be handled delicately.

when my youngest son and his wife were living with me, it hit my 20th century sensibilities as ridiculous on high when i witnessed my son standing outside his closed bedroom door, arguing by text with his wife on the other side of the closed door. eventually i came to appreciate the more quiet approach. their yelling matches were high volume horror. the tension of conflict still permeated the house, but the quieter tension felt like an improvement.

fast forward a decade and i have grown a preference for arguing by text with my own hub-a-lub. it cuts down on the tit-for-tat and the temptation to say things i will regret later. yes, interpretation in a text can be tricky, but not as tricky as interpreting the sheer volume of an extended tit-for-tat skirmish filled with the unedited rancor of verbal vomit. reviewing an angry text stream is far, far easier than reviewing the evaporated verbal vomit.

the venting is an essential part of my own recovery, but it is far easier to make sustainable changes when i take them in small chunks.

on the lying and stealing
my six year old foster daughter is looking like a natural born liar and thief. i routinely catch her lying and she has little to no respect for personal ownership. drawing boundaries on this score has set us up for continual conflict. outsiders accuse me of treating it casually, but? ? ? i feel like i am fast dancing on a razor's edge. i'm VERY picky about whom i invite to be my dance partner on that razor's edge.

It has been my experience that things can be taken out of context in a text. This conversation is with my 12 year old granddaughter who accused me of saying things I didn’t say and it’s crucial when I discuss this with her that my words can be heard and not read and due to this being very delicate I want to make sure it is heard the way I mean it. I will not allow this to go into an argument but because all of my family has been pulled into this without even looking into it and she has just been diagnosed with ptsd I am waiting to discuss this with my counselor on Monday for guidance on how to deal with this appropriately. I understand when you say you feel like you’re fast dancing on a razors edge which is where I a right now.

 

[arfie]

I understand when you say you feel like you’re fast dancing on a razors edge which is where I a right now.

kudos on the grace and care in your steps. what an elegant dancer you are. easy does it, my healing warrior.

attempted humor alert
i have a jukebox inside my head which often provides soundtracks for my emotional dances. "fiddler on the roof" has been the soundtrack for this entry. that jukebox often drives me crazier, but it adds some beat to the dances on the razor's edge. small steps, big faith and lots of prayer. let god lead the dance.

 

[Trauma]

kudos on the grace and care in your steps. what an elegant dancer you are. easy does it, my healing warrior.

attempted humor alert
i have a jukebox inside my head which often provides soundtracks for my emotional dances. "fiddler on the roof" has been the soundtrack for this entry. that jukebox often drives me crazier, but it adds some beat to the dances on the razor's edge. small steps, big faith and lots of prayer. let god lead the dance.

Thank you so much for your help and input. You have a lot of insight and your humor is much appreciated. I have been sitting on this with my granddaughter although everything in me is screaming to let it out and say what I feel but dealing with mental health issues and the fact that no matter how much this has hurt me, I feel she must be hurting a lot more than me to go to the extent she has gone to whatever the reason is.The last thing I want to do is add to her pain. That’s why I hope my therapist can guide me on how to approach this with her. I think it needs to be short and to the point. I won’t apologize for something I didn’t do because that won’t solve anything and could cause her to continue to use this tactic because this has given her A LOT of attention which I think she obviously is crying out for but this is not the way to go about it. Prayers to you for your help and with your situation.

 

[arfie]

everything in me is screaming to let it out and say what I feel

this is a huge nag flag in my own psychotherapy. i make some of the greatest speeches i ever regret when my emotions are screaming. my current mantra for this one is, "listen for the quiet voice." the wisdom is available to me, but it never screams or expostulates. when i am able to listen past those screaming voices, the next step becomes obvious.

you are currently using many of the very tools by which i accomplish this minor miracle --when i am able to actually accomplish it. keep on dancing, my healing warrior. you are looking good. if it was easy, everybody would do it.

 

[Trauma:/Yaya]

I get the impression you're treating her as an equal. She's a 12 year old child who has PTSD, is self harming, has an alcoholic parent, and her parents have separated, along with whatever has caused the PTSD.
You're an adult and her grand parent. Can you keep your upset and feelings unsafe away from her rather than putting it on her?

Maybe exploring that? You not knowing is a big deal. There is clearly a lot you don't know about their lives. Which means that you have a relationship to build up with your granddaughters for them to share their trauma with you.

Why wouldn't it be? Are you doubting what you're being told?

It's very common for children to blame themselves about their parents separating. Or any trauma really.

it must be difficult to see your daughter struggle with addiction. And it must be very difficult for your grandchildren to be parented by someone with addiction.

Just to be clear I haven’t been allowed to be with my granddaughter since this incident. Everyone of my grandchildren have been involved in this conversation by their parents including my youngest daughter and my 17 year old grandson. I have been made out to be a monster. Imagine how confusing this has been to my other grandchildren who have close relationships with me and have never experienced anything but love from me. I am hurt and yes I can understand how all of her issues most likely played into this. I most likely will never know why except maybe it got her the attention she so desperately is needing right now. Thank you for your reply.