Dissociation Explained

[victoria]

Hi everyone,

Could someone explain to me the difference between CPTSD and PTSD? Thanks.

 

[Abstract]

Hi Victoria,
There is a diagnostic section somewhere but hopefully someone will be of more use than me and will direct you to it.
Complex PTSD happens from multiple traumas and there are affects on personality/fuctioning that are not commonly found in those with PTSD. Attachment problems are part of the diagnoses. It is not yet officially in the DSM but apparently will be.

The CD is sporadic, never really able to predict when symptoms will be at their worst, I work on managing the symptoms.
Great to get to meet you!

Great to meet you too!
It sounds like it really impedes and disrupts your life! I am so sorry you deal with this so often. Its great you have worked out a stategy.

What I am still puzzled about is where conversion starts and classic dissociation begins.
If one is totally dissociated and cannot speak or move then is that conversion and dissociation combined?
My falling happens in an instant and then is fine after and I have not seen anyone else have that. Anyone???:)
The worst fall I had I was standing and then next thing I knew I was falling backwards in a sitting position. My brain was too slow or body unable to respond for me to put my hand out so hit concrete at top speed and dislocated my coccyx. Second worst I was running and my legs just stopped and I fell like a tree and hit my head. One elbow came up at very last instant so that helped lessen it. Nothing really bad!

May I ask something? When you cannot speak do you ever find you can move your lips slightly but no sound comes out? Other times I feel my lips are anaethetised and I speak but with effort and not destinctly.

Anyone have emotions linked to a trauma dissapear for periods of time? :)

Thanks!

 

[Abstract]

Now what you said has made me curious i notice i have vision issues .

Hi Justin,
I feel as if I can't focus and everthing is slightly blurry. Reading something is more difficult as the words are not clear. I have twenty twenty vision normally so that might be a way to address it! Have your eyes tested when you feel clear headed and that will give you something to compare to. Just a guess!

 

[Abstract]

"Am I putting myself in situations in which I can be re-traumatized?"

Hi JC,
Noone should have to be as hypervigilent and protective as you had to be there but well done to you.

I found that there are things that I could change to cutdown on my chances of being retraumatised all the time.
Being self aware. Trusting my six sense (yes you do that one too;)!) Being assertive (a biggy for me!) Avoiding dissociating to avoid difficult decisions or feelings when possible (this is a big trouble maker). Feeling I deserve to be treated well.
Sometimes w can't control what happens to us but many times we can learn to look after ourselves and trust in our selves and that can change things enormously.

 

[victoria]

Hi Abstract,

Thanks for your answer. I'll explain what happens with me as best I can. Time goes by, and I don't realize it, I have zoned out and basically just sit and stare. Often I don't feel like a person, I feel as if I'm outside myself, and don't know who, or what, I am. I'm not sure that is the definition of dissocation or not.

When my CD is acting up, I am completely aware what my body is up to. If I'm not walking good, my mind is sharp (lol, as sharp as it gets!). I have physical symptoms, but I know what I'm supposed to be doing.

When I can't speak most times I can move my lips, I know what I want so say, but no sound comes. Other times I just look at the person, or sometimes stutter or repeat words. That could be conversion or dissociation, I'm guessing? CD and PTSD seem to be all jumbled up together with me.

It is very interesting to me that you fall backwards as I do! I belong to another forum for CD/SD (Somatoform) and never met anyone else who does this. Great talking to you, Abstract.

 

[anthony]

Could someone explain to me the difference between CPTSD and PTSD? Thanks.

There is no such thing as CPTSD, it was an expectancy hopeful to gain entry into the DSM, though has died and useless. See link below in response to Abstracts quote.

PTSD: [DLMURL]http://www.ptsdforum.org/c/wiki/posttraumatic-stress-disorder/[/DLMURL]
CPTSD: [DLMURL]http://www.ptsdforum.org/c/wiki/complex-posttraumatic-stress-disorder/[/DLMURL]

It is not yet officially in the DSM but apparently will be.

Incorrect: [DLMURL]http://www.ptsdforum.org/c/threads/cptsd-forum-now-complex-trauma.15536/[/DLMURL]

 

[J.C.]

Anthony,

Going on seven years ago, two doctors said I had "CPTSD" and two others said it was PTSD. I always had the weird gut feeling too...like just go with what the other two said. Thanks for your info, I will look into those links sometime. It used to feel complex and I just said yeah it's certainly complex. I'm glad it's not as bad as it was seven - five years ago. Bums me out that it's back...huh. I really thought it was gone for the past two years. Oh well, not the first time I've ever been wrong. Just like, not being mislead. Those doctors though, I could just never fully believe in them. When I get a gut feeling of something being off, it usually is. Too much other life distractions going on to go research everything. Thanks for helping me bridge that gap.

JC

 

[anthony]

Many thought CPTSD would make it into the DSM V, but it didn't. The inventor, Judith Herman, of Complex PTSD, being she coined the term, though it would make it into the DSM IV, but didn't, nor the DSM IV-TR, and now the DSM V have published their reasons for on http://www.dsm5.org/ProposedRevisions/Pages/AnxietyDisorders.aspx for all their changes on proposed revisions to date. CPTSD was breaking away from the categorical system in place, ie. PTSD + Dissociative Disorder NOS + BPD if applicable, being a more specific isolation of each disorder. There are medical implications that come with this as well, ie. because CPTSD would have had to off been classified as an anxiety disorder, then to prescribe meds a physician would still have to tack a list of comorbid diagnosis to it in order to legally prescribe to cover the range of symptoms.

So really the medical model has a purpose, which isolating several disorders into one would not legally or realistically be workable. CPTSD seven years ago was gaining much momentum internally only, for validity purposes to gain entry into the DSM, but it just wasn't to be, and its pretty official now and not happening.

This does not dismiss, complex trauma, which is extremely valid.

 

[victoria]

Thank you, Anthony, for the clarification. I'll check out all the links you provided.

 

[Iam]

There is no such thing as CPTSD, it was an expectancy hopeful to gain entry into the DSM, though has died and useless. See link below in response to Abstracts quote.

My T told me the same thing, that C-PTSD will not be included in the DSM.

I also agree with your last statement about complex trauma being valid. It is and it's important that the treating therapist be familiar with complex trauma that causes PTSD. While the symptoms are the same, the underlying causes and dysfunctional belief systems (common with all PTSD no matter the causing event) can be a whole different ball game because of the longevity and constancy of the traumas.

 

[Abstract]

Hi Victoria! :)

Hi Abstract,

Thanks for your answer. I'll explain what happens with me as best I can. Time goes by, and I don't realize it, I have zoned out and basically just sit and stare. Often I don't feel like a person, I feel as if I'm outside myself, and don't know who, or what, I am. I'm not sure that is the definition of dissocation or not.

Yup, that all sounds familiar. I also have the floating above myself and looking down; hands or arms looking foreign; not recognising my image and being sure all is not real.
If you are sitting and staring and someone attempts to get you to speak or move then what happens?
I sometimes then find I move my lips with difficulty but no sound comes out.

When my CD is acting up, I am completely aware what my body is up to. If I'm not walking good, my mind is sharp (lol, as sharp as it gets!). I have physical symptoms, but I know what I'm supposed to be doing.

My symptoms are v mild compared to yours but the falls happen without me feeling detached and they happen suddenly. My head and brain appears to fine.
Sometimes though I appear to be a bit derealised when drop things. Am clear minded but can't really believe what I am doing is real or holding onto something will have any impact.

When I can't speak most times I can move my lips, I know what I want so say, but no sound comes. Other times I just look at the person, or sometimes stutter or repeat words. That could be conversion or dissociation, I'm guessing? CD and PTSD seem to be all jumbled up together with me.

I agree that conversion and dissociation seem to mix together! I have the first sometimes briefly. More often I have difficulty or delay in motor control of mouth or struggle to get voice out. Mosly whilst being clear headed but sometimeswhilst being dissociated.

I wonder where a dissociated freeze fits in?

It is very interesting to me that you fall backwards as I do! I belong to another forum for CD/SD (Somatoform) and never met anyone else who does this. Great talking to you, Abstract.

I believe have only fallen backwards like this a few times but am happy you feel less alone! I feel less alone too! Most often I loose control of a foot for a few moments and then all is well.
Thanks so much for chatting and sharing and I hope all improves for you!

 

[Powder]

I am interested in the loss of balance as it relates to anxiety and/or dissociation also. In my last house, when I vacuumed my stairs (very steep) I would feel vertigo and then I would fall backwards down the stairs. Both times I thought I could handle the vertigo, I started to fall, and was able to throw my balance back toward the incline and fall "up" the stairs instead of all the way down. But after the second time, there was no denying that I couldn't handle the task safely; so, I requested my husband to start doing that chore for me instead.

For me, I saw it as part of my fear of heights and steep plains (vertigo) that caused the loss of balance. But I didn't have this before and it may fall under PTSD.