Opinions On This Interaction Please!

[ClairBear226]

By the way - an apology is a short simple I did such-and-such-wrong and I am sorry. There are no caveats. No qualifiers. No threats. You didn't get an apology. You got an explanation for bad behavior.

Yup, Yup, Yup.

 

[doglover]

I was trying to avoid thinking about this. Since I've been paying attention to feelings more I've discovered just. how. ANGRY. I am about the dynamic she's used with me.

I'm glad I had this written exchange to pull from. Much of what's gone on was not recorded in this way.

Girl3, you are very insightful in what you said about Southern, Catholic and Jewish mothers. I wonder what it is about Southern women that leads to that. Perhaps the more traditional gender roles create a preference for passive aggressive behavior in women since assertiveness doesn't fit with submissive behavior.

Boy do I have some rather icky stories about the pageant world of young Southern girls. Yes, really. Interesting to think back on now that I see the narcissism in my mum more clearly.

Agree as well with what you said about apologies. What she said wasn't an apology. I'm glad I'm owning my anger, except sometimes it bumps against the conditioning where I wasn't allowed to feel anything different from what she wanted me to feel. Least of all anger.

 

[Girl3]

It is hard to feel anything when you've been trained to feel nothing. But feeling things is part of the healing process.

 

[doglover]

I agree Girl3. Part of the healing.

 

[BloomInWinter]

Context: She treated family to a meal, but then put a stipulation that you had to eat everything - and then she checked the plates of the children at the end to be sure they really did finish their meals. I asked her if she was doing that. She said yes, then came to me and whispered "You spend two hundred dollars on a family dinner and then you get to decide how you handle it." Prior to that, I was using my phone at the table and she chastised me (I'm in my late 20s). When that happened I said yes I am using my phone, I think I'm allowed to decide to do that. She replied with something to the effect of "I have a lot of trouble getting the kids to not text at meals. I'd think you'd want to set a good example."

A gift is something one 'gives' - free of obligation, conditions, or threats. Otherwise, it's not a gift, but a manipulation.

...and a healthy, sane person would never do this.

I would NEVER willingly subject me or my family to such boundry-violating, disrespectful, hurtful behavior. FORCING people via manipulation to ignore such a basic inner connection as 'fullness' is reprehensible. Sick. Manipulative.

...and deserves no gratitude nor indebtedness. Nor time explaining why you don't like it. That deserves complete distancing and detachment. Please, NEVER allow children to be subjected to this abuse. They don't have a choice to leave when the adults tell them to submit.

...this IS abuse.

Your feelings about it were right on. You owe no justification to anyone for your feelings.

You do deserve to listen to, and honor your feelings.

I hope you'll find an 'Adult Children of Alcoholism & Dysfunctional Families' (aka... ACA) to go to in real life.

This is typical sick dysfunctional family stuff. You are not alone. You'll need help escaping the dysfunctional system.

Please be kind to yourself...keep reading, sharing, and knowing freedom from this emotional manipulation is ahead of you.

I'm so sorry for all of you. That is awful.

 

[ClairBear226]

I was trying to avoid thinking about this. Since I've been paying attention to feelings more I've discovered just. how. ANGRY. I am about the dynamic she's used with me.

I hear that one loud and clear. Currently quite angry with my mother, and have an APB out for numb. Lots easier to deal with this stuff.

I find it interesting that as a nurse, knowing what healthy relationships supposedly look like, that I still haven't managed to deprogram myself from the trained responces I'm "supposed" to have by family code. Anger isn't allowed. Display of emotion isn't allowed. Confrontation isn't allowed. I feel like a trained animal, conditioned to only reply the way they want and expect me to. It's been hard to stand up and push back, but I do it. And I do it hard. For me, it's a matter of self respect.

 

[doglover]

Same here, ClairBear. My professional background also makes me all too aware of the ideal, the healthy example. And I'm intellectually aware of how the tricks and tactics work. But in large part still rather stuck in the role and conditioning.

Had an initial appointment with an EMDR practitioner today. I have some budding and careful hope that this treatment will help me break out of the conditioning.T seems to suggest it can do that.

I stand up to her too, though for myself more than to change the patterns. I'm not trying to change her. I'm just setting boundaries. I may not always feel like I know how to do that, or like I deserve it, but my intellectual sense of deserving it motivates me well enough.

Glad to know I'm not alone in trying to rise above and heal from this wonky mother daughter crap. Hugs :)

 

[doglover]

BloominWinter, thank you. To hear from others like yourself that this behavior isn't healthy means a lot. Wishing I had this awesome crew around growing up to witness things and help me accept when I felt like I was being manipulated.

I don't have children of my own, but don't see myself ever doing that to them. That's like begging to have them develop disordered eating. It's like she sets up the illusion of a joyful experience just to see everyone squirm when she sucks all potential for joy out of it.

I mean honestly, her upbringing was a lot worse in some ways. But something's gotta give. I refuse to pass on a less intense dose of this crap to any children I might have down the road. Which is why I'm determined to work with an effective T.

 

[ClairBear226]

I stand up to her too, though for myself more than to change the patterns. I'm not trying to change her. I'm just setting boundaries. I may not always feel like I know how to do that, or like I deserve it, but my intellectual sense of deserving it motivates me well enough.

Glad to know I'm not alone in trying to rise above and heal from this wonky mother daughter crap. Hugs :)

Yup. That's what I've found that I need to do too. It isn't in my power to change my parents, and frankly, neither of them are worthwhile enough human beings for me to even try. They're both a waste of perfectly good oxygen. But I need to set those boundaries for my own sake, and make darned sure they hold. You can absolutely rise above the cards you were dealt. It just takes the clarity to see them for what they are, and enough guts to draw a line in the sand.