Safe/unsafe People

[PerfectlyFlawed]

Thank you for posting this. Very insightful.

-PerfectlyFlawed.

 

[Helliepig]

I think as you heal, and Albatross says, recognise these things in yourself, you get better at FEELING bad people - then you don't have to rely on being able to recognise them from a list. I used to try to do this and felt a bit overwhelmed. I couldn't rely on my inner wisdom because I was trained to give other people what they wanted from me, and my feelings of disquiet, the warning symptoms, I mislabelled as just symptoms of my issues/inadequacy.

Recognising you have your own warning system is a real step forward.

 

[Meadowsweet]

It will be interesting to see where your therapist is taking this. Because, to some extent, everybody has traits of being an abandoner, critic, irresponsible or exploitative. But not everybody we might see these qualities in, is an unsafe or abusive person.

It might be that the majority of people have these traits to a lesser extent. Or, it might be that people like myself allow these traits to escalate, whereas another person might recognise and curb these traits early on in a relationship? But that is very uncomfortable, because it puts the responsibility for abuse onto the victim.

The symptoms of PTSD I experience, make me an abandoner. But, having removed myself from people who triggered reactions, I'm taking responsibility and seeking help because I don't want to push people away or hurt anyone. And while I'm doing that, I avoid close relationships. So maybe the difference between a safe person and an unsafe person is more about what they are willing to do about those traits, rather than the traits alone.

Boundaries: what they are, signs of ignored boundaries, rational boundary building thinking, how to establish healthy boundaries, steps to establishing healthy boundaries.

I will look forward to reading this, as this is something that I can't do at all.

 

[Helliepig]

So maybe the difference between a safe person and an unsafe person is more about what they are willing to do about those traits, rather than the traits alone.


.

I like this. I think it is important.

The first step for me with boundaries was realising I had a right to choose whether or not I got involved in a conversation, gave someone what they wanted, allowed myself to be a "parent" to someone else's child, or said no. I didn't even realise I had that right, to start with, it felt like I was being rude, or uncaring not giving someone what they wanted... talk about sitting duck! I was confused about how to decide what my boundaries should be.. until I started listening to myself.

 

[maddog]

Firstly, thanks to SoulofLC for posting all of this information - it's very interesting reflective material and i know it must take a fair bit of effort to type it all out.

I found the lists to be interesting and particularly useful for self analysis, as others have said. Yes, I spotted myself in many indicators within the first three categories in particular, and imagine that there does not exist a human being who wouldn't score a few points in at least a couple of the categories.

I think the thing is to remember that any behavioural checklist will only ever be a guide, human behaviour being an undefined art, rather than a science, as it is. I also think that each of these traits are amatter of degree, and that they become problematic only in combination with certain others and only when they manifest beyond what might be considered a "normal" level of inevitable human frailty.

And yes, here again we see the paradox we see so often, whereby the symptoms of abuse may include the development of some of the same behavioural traits in the victim that were demonstrated by the perpetrator, which is part of the reason behind what I know as "schema chemistry", whereby we are often inexplicably drawn to people who behave in the same way our abusers did.

As with everything, self awareness and insight are so important - being able to recognize our own destructive behaviours and traits and to work on those as honestly as possible, is one of the greatest gifts we can give ourselves and those around us.

I think Helliepig made a really valid point when she said that part of identifying an unsafe person is just about "spotting" one. At the end of the day, it's never going to be a mathematical equation calculated by adding the number of undesirable traits and seeing if it reaches an arbitrary threshhold. We're too instinctual for that, whiche is both the blessing and the curse of it all.

However we can educate ourselves to be more aware of, and able to accurately interpret, our own feelings and instincts and reactions to people, it is a good thing.

I, too, would like to hear how this information is discussed and approached by your T, SoulofLC, and am also looking forward to the boundary setting info.

Thanks again for posting, and for generating some really interesting and useful discussion.

Maddog

 

[soulofLC]

Meadowsweet, I hear what you are saying. I too tend to abandon and be abandoned, because I expect to be abandoned, as I have been abused and neglected in this way. The trick is to set boundaries so that you are not the victim anymore, but you control with goes in and what goes out.

The goal is to change the pattern of abuse/abandonment on both sides. Yes, the victim has the responsibility to not be victimized anymore. It does place the responsibility on us to protect ourselves. As my therapist said, we cannot change their behaviour, we can only control our own.

 

[Meadowsweet]

it felt like I was being rude, or uncaring not giving someone what they wanted

the victim has the responsibility to not be victimized anymore.

I've put these quotes together, because I still feel more like the first quote than the second. But I do agree with the responsibilty of the second. But I Find it hard to feel victimised. I have a strong maternal instinct, and I recognise that in my feelings for harmful people. They are like children and I'm like a mother who should be able to make them feel better.

Having my own real children has made a difference, because I am a mother to them over and above any man. And that gives me a responsibilty to keep harmful people out of my home. But inside, I still feel a soft spot for the wrong people.

 

[Helliepig]

I can relate to that. Harmful people are often people operating from their own wounded child and we can sense the vulnerability, it is familiar and a role we instinictively understand.

 

[The Albatross]

Stupid as it sounds, I feel sometimes more empowered being around unsafe people... but the fact is, it causes more grief and stress than it's worth.

 

[freakofnurture]

Wow, this thread is a great idea! I'll use it to evaluate some of the people who got/are still getting a lot of mental screen time from me.

 

[soulofLC]

Sorry to abruptly stop my safe-unsafe people thread. I was happy to see that many were interested in the thread. Unfortunately, it triggered me really really bad. I also lost my mom and spent the last month or so curled up in a ball like a pill bug. Or in the proverbial fetal position.

Unfortunately, I also lost my therapist I was working with. I am trying to get her back, but insurance glitch is in the way. Haven't given up yet, but she is awesome and worth the fight.

Still plan to come back and at least finish what I started. That is, to enter the information she gave me, as I have time and energy.

Please forgive me and have patience. I will get it done! Stay tuned!

 

[soulofLC]

I am just now facing the reality of this in my own life.

VERY triggering stuff!

"

Wow, my younger brother to a tee! No wonder the whole family is so screwed up. I am his target. I am out of his range now. Knock on wood!

Yes, I was very triggered by this information and had to quit for a while. Also, see above post....life etc.