Treading Dangerously?!

[Eleanor]

This is not going to do even a smidgen of justice to the depth and breadth of the discussion in this thread but FWIW the line between "supporting" and "enabling" is one I struggle with a lot. Particularly because it seems to shift around.

Also, "shower" is one of the things I personally struggle with - self care being an issue for me as a supporter. Honestly this is the sort of thing I have LEAST success with. Exercise and relaxation being other epic fails for me. For "shower" to even MAKE it on the "to do list" for me is embarrassingly unusual. I have started remembering to put "eat lunch" on my list. Until recently "Manage Anxiety" and "care for child" were the only two things ON the list... I wonder if we aren't all - stable or not - closer to the edge every day than we'd care to admit?

And @ Nicolette: (lowered voice and raised brow) if you are letting physical pain get to the point of possible collapse, Nicolette, you are NOT taking adequate care of yourself. There are appropriate and healthy limits, and you are blowing right over one there.

 

[Froggie]

I agree with my forum family on what they said about you Nicolette, you were the perfect person to bring this subject up, which helped greatly to do a better insight in our motivations to write in that thread. So thank you Nicolette for this feat that brought alot of enrichement in our lives.

 

[piratelady]

This is what confuses me...... I am trying to put the shoe on the other foot and perhaps be more supportive or even identify someone needing support but because it's all different than what it 'appears' and varies on a person by person basis I feel I am being told this is futile.

I think it's a matter of getting to know people, to know how to respond. That is hard to do with so many people on the forum and new people all the time. I am a sufferer and I don't always know how to reply someone who is suffering. Everyone is so different on here and all respond differently to certain types of support. It gets to be so complicated. The only time I feel completely comfortable responding is when it is to someone I know well.

It appears to me, and I could be way out of line, that Anthony speaks to what he sees, regardless of if it is the best type of support for that person. He calls is like he sees it. I will be perfectly honest, when I see Anthony reply to one of my posts my heart races. I know if I am out of line he will tell me and I don't always know if I can handle hearing it, even if it is true. In the end, it is accurate and helpful and after I take the time to digest the input I've received, I find it makes sense and I can run with it.

The point I'm trying to make is this place is about speaking freely, provided another member is not being attacked (which you would never do, obviously). Maybe just call it like you see it, in the end it's usually what people need to hear, even if it takes them a while to realize it. In a forum of this size, with so many people, you can't cater to everyone. Just be honest and yet polite. That's all you can do, and I think most people would be open to that. As I've seen Gizmo say a few time, the member can either take the feedback or put in the trash.

As a disclaimer: I've re-read some of my responses to other threads after the fact and realized that my response didn't make any sense to what was posted...that may be the case with the response as well...sorry if I'm way off base :unsure:

 

[Nicolette]

And @ Nicolette: (lowered voice and raised brow) if you are letting physical pain get to the point of possible collapse, Nicolette, you are NOT taking adequate care of yourself. There are appropriate and healthy limits, and you are blowing right over one there.

There is no rule or rhyme to my suffering Eleanor - just like PTSD. So I can go to work, feel fine, stressful things happen and muscles tighten, work environment is not the best ergonomically and it compounds and sometimes quickly. Initially I would try to soldier on - now I say I have to have a break, go for a walk, say I have to use the bathroom and have even resorted to taking a break and lying in my car. So I have learned to speak up and it's not about adequate care - it's that it happens so quickly but now I listen to the signs and respond rather than putting work first.

 

[Nicolette]

Nicolette, I believe if Anthony had posed the original question he would not have done so with an apology for upsetting anybody. I am not criticising you just commenting that you have entirely different styles. In many of your replies within this thread you appear frustrated but still share your kind heart by thanking people for their input.

This was lovely to read Lucycat - thank you :hug:

 

[goingonhope]

Until tonight I'd read only post 1 thru 4, at which point I became jammed up and stuck, frustrated and with no time left, nor focus, if available time had remained.

At some point I popped into the middle of this thread at about post 17, while still frustrated, thinking fearfully and yet only with minutes to my own.

Then the next day came and I was useless and thinking obsessively until I was able to sort and sift through my thoughts as well as baggage and come up with a comment, ...very much of a release as well.

Upon settling down some and enough to continue on with yesterday and today, I find myself this evening drawn back to this thread, as here and there with bits of uninterrupted time, I've popped in and read that there is very good discussion happening here! Such appears so and therefore, I'm interested in reading all comments.

However, as I do I struggle in places from my own stuff.

 

[ms spock]

I agree with my forum family on what they said about you Nicolette, you were the perfect person to bring this subject up, which helped greatly to do a better insight in our motivations to write in that thread. So thank you Nicolette for this feat that brought alot of enrichment in our lives.

I agree that Nicolette brought this up well. I feel that this is an important thread and that the issues Nicolette brought up are important to continually revisit.

 

[Lady of Longbourn]

Clair, I have to respectfully disagree in some ways with your post. I am not challenging you, just offering a different view point.

I've begun to wonder if PTSD is sometimes used as an excuse to fail....How much easier would it be to just withdraw from the rat race? I can't, I have PTSD. Somebody do that for me, I have PTSD. I can't achieve anything, I have PTSD. Before you know it, we're right back to that womb. All comfortable and safe, and non-challenging. I can't do anything with my life, because I have PTSD. What a crock.

Everyone has different levels of functioning. Yours, from what I can tell, is pretty high functioning. You hold a job...you have never needed medication. I am not saying yours is less, but in all honestly there are actually levels of how disabled the person is. The VA for example will use scales on how disable the vet is: 50%, 100% etc. The US government for civilians is the same way...they use scales i.e will the person need social security for the rest of their life?

Yes, some people can push themselves more and some have fallen into what is more comfortable. But maybe that is what they can do right now. Maybe, like with me, they have been advised to just stick with what is working right now. I have been very stable for 8 months now. Pushing myself to do more right now would be stupid, even though I do want too. All my doctors and supporter have told me not too. I am not ready yet and I know that even if I find it very frustrating.

It is not always "an excuse to fail", I think in a lot of cases it is actually stay with what is safe or pay the price of over doing it and spending major money in hospital visits. There can be backlash to those that try to leave their comfortable zone to quickly or against doctor recommendation.

 

[heidi]

It's intriguing to think about long term goals because you're right I don't think that way. It is a mind blowing concept to think of a long term goal. It is just daily survival.
And I thank whoever started that daily goal thread because I think it's a very useful practice.

On days when I feel better I think if I ever got better I would be less held back then I was before this happened. When I feel better if all feels so easy. Just living, breathing.

It does sort of bother me when people say that it's sad when a goal is daily hygiene because from my perspective I've never felt that way about anyone.

 

[Eleanor]

Nicollette - what an awful thing! I am so sorry you have to deal with it, but sound like you are coping well now. :tup: How painful and inconvenient! Rats. Now, where did I put that wand...???:playful:

 

[Nicolette]

I have been thinking about this while seeing posts on the forum and I fear my problem is I see a to-do list (things you want to do) as just that and not goals. Goals are bigger to me and something to really strive for and more long term. I think my definition of 'goal' varies.

 

[Red Feather]

About enabling PTSD, I think in the last six months since I have been diagnosed, I allowed the PTSD to really take over and stopped eating and moving. The second time I was in the hospital, the T said I was "psychiatrised" and negated the PTSD diagnosis. I think I am very extreme in the way I do things. Yes I was in serious crisis, i.e. identity crisis, and was / am very depersonlized, so much so that I did not see any reason to continue, and feel very attached to the events that surround my life. So, was really put off by the agressive T in the hospital who showed no compassion for what I was going through.

In the end, I would not say he was right. But if I am willing to just look at things through this other point of view, negating PTSD, is a very big step. I can not negate my symptoms when I get triggered. I also am so disorientated sometimes, that I really just don't know what to do with myself, so do have a difficulty getting out of bed. So there are two sides of this issue. But knowing that PTSD is a lie, is going to help me very slowly to get out of the trap I am in. If I believe in the PTSD, it will trap me, and it will keep me from my children.

Another issue is that I have now 6 years of avoiding doctors and avoiding diagnosis. Knowing that a diagnosis can also very much be a trap in the mind... I worked really hard on myself. I just told a friend of mine that I had been doing so much self-help, that 6 months ago, it collapsed on me and I said F*** it. She pointed out to me that "self-help" also implies that there is something wrong with you, and suddenly things made sense.

I could not follow this whole discussion, but just wanted to add this, because it is true that it is really important to be careful. But the process of coming to that point is very special and in my eyes even sacred. Being depressed usually means that something or somebody is blocking you from your own sense of self and beauty. To be able to make a goal in the mindset that nothing is wrong with you, means that you have come to the point of really believing that. It's not easy. I just read that the word "depressed" contains the words "deep rest" in it. Just an added thought.