She Pushed Me

[piratelady]

is therapy always going to be like this when facing different traumatic experiences?

It is not uncommon to have a spike in symptoms after dealing with or talking about a traumatic experience. In my therapy we space out how often we discuss trauma, I assume for that very reason. We will discuss it one week and the following appointment the focus will be on current things in my life - not the trauma.

I do find it helpful to discuss my trauma in therapy and to try to push through the difficult feelings that come afterward. It takes me a few days, if not a week to come down from that spike in symptoms. Spacing out how often we dive into that helps me to stay functional in my life.

 

[Abstract]

I am still so confused about this when it comes to me. So mostly just "listening".

As soon as the client felt the faintest glimmerings of trigger or disassociation

But what happens if one dissociates on entering the room. Always.

I was pushed very hard and I am still confused about the aftermath.

 

[Leah123]

Wow, Abstract, that is a tough one. Sometimes I can find the path back into myself, if I and my therapist work gently at it together in session. There have been times I couldn't, right away, but if I was struggling with it as consistently as every session, I personally wouldn't feel comfortable doing that hard trauma work. I tried that for a long time, about two years with one therapist when I was younger, and got very little benefit from it. I would ask myself what I needed to work on the dissociation- a new therapist, a new method, more safety elsewhere in my life...

Just my 2 cents. I'm sorry it's such a struggle, sigh.

 

[BlackbirdSinging]

It takes me a few days, if not a week to come down from that spike in symptoms. Spacing out how often we dive into that helps me to stay functional in my life.

It's having the same effect on me. And it's taking way too long to calm down again. It's hard to be this hyper alert for so many days. I like the idea of spacing it out. I think I'm going to bring that up to my therapist and let her know I think I need to do that. This week has been very hard for me. And the dreams and nightmares are making it hard to get actual deep sleep.

I was pushed very hard and I am still confused about the aftermath.

I think I have mixed feelings about this pushing. I can see where it's beneficial to have to face things. And I can see where people would hesitate and a therapist would need to push. But what I don't like is the idea of pushing so hard that it pushes you literally outside of your head where you're not processing anymore anyway.

I love the incredible strength I am getting from reading your responses here.

l liked reading how the therapist dealt with the client in The Body Remembers. The author/therapist talked about how important it was not to do anything that felt unsafe to the client so that - if they could help it - - their talk wouldn't lead to disassociation etc. if at all possible. As soon as the client felt the faintest glimmerings of trigger or disassociation, the therapist and she would go back to talking about times when the client felt safe in her life. She would have her describe how it felt, what the place looked like, what it smelled like, etc.

Thank you. And I like this idea much better. I think this would be much more productive than pushing someone until their scared to death. I feel like I'd be more willing to do it this way if I need to be pushed again.

 

[franciemarnie]

Abstract, that's the pits. I am so sorry that is what happens for you. It's like you're damned if you do, damned if you don't.

I never had that situation of disassociating walking in the door. Another great therapist could be out there, one who you would be safe with, but the dilemma would be getting in his or her office long enough to find out without disassociating!

The only thing I can imagine would be finding a way to keep yourself safe from within that would be powerful enough to risk the possibility of being triggered, like thru mindfulness meditation. Easier said the done sometimes. I do mindfulness meditation a lot and sometimes still a powerful enough trigger can blast on thru. But I have an easier time pulling back in since I have done the meditation every day.

Knowing me, I would probably forget therapy until the risk in trying it again was less painful than the pain of life without it.

But I don't like all the ideas people have for me sometimes if they haven't been in my specific scenario, and that's what I am kind of doing so forgive me.

 

[Abstract]

And it's taking way too long to calm down again.

mixed feelings

Blackbird,
Maybe you need to start off with talking about that with her. Maybe she would see the need to change tactics as a result. I get confused as Anthony is very pro pushing and has also said a lot about all symptoms going through the roof when tackling trauma. But I also think that some of us have complications where that could be re traumatising. In some senses I think that happened to me. Just that dynamic of being pushed can feel very triggering (like franciemarnie said).

The other thing that happened to me was I went into that state where I become a zombie and don't have the ability to say no. I loose all capacity to have any input on what is good or bad for me.

Maybe pushing is good as long as we are in a fit place to still make that final decision to talk and as long as we in theory are open and ready for it to happen. There is a subtle difference between 1. not being able to speak and not wanting to do so in the moment but being ready in concept to speak about something; and 2. not wanting to speak and not in concept being ready to speak about it at all yet. I hope that makes sense.

I also saw Safenow (who is experienced in trauma therapy) say that if a therapist does not help her ground afterwards that they are not a safe therapist for her. Maybe you could discuss that.

I hope I am not treading on boundaries if I discuss my stuff. Please let me know if I am.

wouldn't feel comfortable doing that hard trauma work.

Thats very much for your kind words Leah. Sadly it happens way before trauma work even comes up. Therapist + me = dissociation. It's normal for me to sit for 47 mins of the 50 mins not being able to speak.

but the dilemma would be getting in his or her office long enough to find out without disassociating!

Thanks FrancieMarnie too for your kindness. Exactly! The last t was the best I had ever had and relatively speaking I did trust her (I don't trust) and yet it was severe.

I would probably forget therapy until

Thank you for this! This is exactly what happened. I have been out of therapy for a year now. It has taken until a few months ago to get to a place and recover enough to be able to speak less fearfully on somewhere like here. Dead end though.

 

[Leah123]

Therapist + me = dissociation. It's normal for me to sit for 47 mins of the 50 mins not being able to speak.

Have you considered online therapy? I feel safer and more centered doing it, from the comfort of my home, with music I like playing, and the ability to vary the connection, from email to chat to phone, depending on my comfort level.

 

[BlackbirdSinging]

Maybe pushing is good as long as we are in a fit place to still make that final decision to talk and as long as we in theory are open and ready for it to happen. There is a subtle difference between 1. not being able to speak and not wanting to do so in the moment but being ready in concept to speak about something; and 2. not wanting to speak and not in concept being ready to speak about it at all yet. I hope that makes sense.

I also saw Safenow (who is experienced in trauma therapy) say that if a therapist does not help her ground afterwards that they are not a safe therapist for her. Maybe you could discuss that.

I hope I am not treading on boundaries if I discuss my stuff. Please let me know if I am.

You're not treading on my boundaries. I know she's going to push me. I expected to be pushed and challenged in therapy. I've dealt with therapists pushing me before on other topics so I knew it was coming and I know it will again. I guess mostly I was just talking about what happened when she pushed me and how hard it was for me. And how effective is pushing while dissociated? And also talking about how triggered I've been since. You know the hypervigilance and the stupid nightmares. It was just so intense for me. And I definitely need need to discuss how often she pushes and grounding after and also coping with the effects at home. I mean for one thing I drove home dazed and half out of it in a thunderstorm after that. I sometimes get nervous in thunderstorms due to one incident. So I don't think that was the best idea. But my issue isn't so much the pushing as the how hard how often and coping with the effect if it after.

 

[Abstract]

I can very much understand what you are saying and why you are discussing it! As I said I am still very confused about all this myself and am interested in hearing what all of you say. So you discussing helps me too. I am still new to all this too.

talking about what happened when she pushed me and how hard it was for me. And how effective is pushing while dissociated? And also talking about how triggered I've been since.

I had not even considered that being dissociated and speaking could be unhelpful until this thread so that is helpful for me to consider. All of these considerations sound good. I think for me I am probably going to feel much less Ok with pushing than you seem to be. I would be OK with some of course but I think it is generally problematic for me.

to discuss how often she pushes and grounding after and also coping with the effects at home.

This sounds important too. Not at all safe to drive like that! Did she do any grounding with you after? I have decided I shouldn't drive at present because I am not reliably present.

online therapy

Thanks Leah. :) Need to think about. Shall answer on one of my threads.

 

[BlackbirdSinging]

I think for me I am probably going to feel much less Ok with pushing than you seem to be. I would be OK with some of course but I think it is generally problematic for me.

The thing for me with pushing is that I know it's part of therapy and so I'm as ok with it as I have to be. I know that for decades I didn't face these things and it didn't get me too far. So when I think about it I try to remember that. But when she started pushing about this which is something I didn't open up to with all of the other therapy I had and I kept buried inside for years and years.. it's really hard.

I don't even get to the "I can't talk" because such a big part of me doesn't want to. It's a catch you know? Wanting to get better and yet not always wanting to do the really hard stuff. But then life for me with untreated PTSD was pretty much like being constantly tormented so what choices do I have? It's moments like this where I'm basically calm that I can actually HEAR my logic louder than my symptoms. For now.

This sounds important too. Not at all safe to drive like that! Did she do any grounding with you after? I have decided I shouldn't drive at present because I am not reliably present. .

Our session ran over so we did very little to ground me. I was walking down the flight of stairs with her feeling so out of it and dizzy that I wondered if I was going to fall. And then driving home in a thunderstorm. When thunderstorms depending on how bad they are make me really anxious due to a traumatic event.. in fact that was the one we were discussing before she pushed me. I literally screamed as I drove down the street when there was a loud clap of thunder. It was a little embarrassing.

 

[piratelady]

I don't even get to the "I can't talk" because such a big part of me doesn't want to. It's a catch you know? Wanting to get better and yet not always wanting to do the really hard stuff.

I struggle with the same thing. One one hand you want to get better, which means addressing it in therapy, but talking about it is hard, scary, and as we've all discussed, causes symptoms to get worse before they get better.

In my therapy, when we decided to start talking about it, he would ask me at the start of the session if I wanted to talk about it that day. I would say yes, but then immediately changed my mind and told him no. Somehow though, as we talked about the things going on in my life, it would tie back to the abuse. In the end we wound up talking about what happened to cause my PTSD. It was hard and uncomfortable. My nightmares came back, my other symptoms spiked, but it got better in time.

I was so worried about going to my next appointment thinking it would be a repeat of the previous week. But we didn't talk about the past abuse. I felt like we should - I mean you know, to just get it done and over with. He kept the conversation on present-time issues.

I think it's a good system, we are working through the past little by little, but also focusing on what's going on in the here and now so I can learn to cope and keep living my life the best I can right now. Honestly, I think with this system of about 1/3 abuse work and 2/3 present-day work I am healing and progressing faster than I ever have before. Maybe you and your therapist can work out something like that or something else that will help you get what you need?

 

[BlackbirdSinging]

I'm so upset. I don't know what I'm feeling yet. I just know that I'm upset. The guy my therapist pushed me about is the youngest son of my mom's best friend from kindergarten. She doesn't know what he did to me when I was a little kid for years. And she's here today visiting. I love her. But while we were at the pool she whipped out her phone stood behind me and had me flip through her pictures. Naturally I had to pause for each picture and make a remark of some kind. And just as I expextced I SAW his picture. Twice. I have no idea how to handle what I'm feeling right now. I haven't seen him in more than 20 years. I have no idea what to do with myself. And we've got a house full of people for dinner.