Somebody Please Help Me. Was This Sexual Abuse??

[Ije]

I'm new here. I hope I found the right place to post this. I thought it said I could post even if I don't have PTSD right?? If not, sorry, I'll delete it.

Anyway, I'm really struggling with trying to figure out if I was sexually abused as a child. I know no one else's opinion matters. My experience is my own and it's up to me to ultimately decide how to interpret it. I get that. But I'm having trouble figuring out what it was. I don't need counseling for it (I'm already getting that) and I don't need advice on how to get past it. I honestly just need someone to say "yes, that's considered abuse" or "no, that's not considered abuse." I'm fine with either answer. If it is, then good, I'll process that and work with my therapist to get past it. If it's not, that's fine too; I'll just have to process it in a different way and figure out where these feelings are coming from. Sometimes it fits the definition of abuse and sometimes it doesn't. I just need someone to help me figure out what it was. I can't handle the ambiguity.

Basically... when I was between 5 and 8 (I'm not sure on the age, I just know I was at least in kindergarten but I wasn't 9 yet), my babysitter's son used to make me do weird things that were sexual in nature. Like he would make me go in the bathroom and sit naked on the floor with him and hold his hand and he wouldn't let me leave cuz he said he wanted "to look" at me; he would make me go in the shower & pull my pants down so he could kiss me on the butt and then he would make me do it to him; he would make me spread my legs and pull my underwear to the side so he could hit me in the vagina with a ball & he wouldn't let me go until he did it a certain number of times. He was always really mean and would punch me if I didn't do what he said (even if it wasn't something sexual) so basically I was afraid of him and just did whatever he told me to do. The problem is, he was my age. I don't know if this counts as abuse. I knew it was wrong, but how do I know that he didn't? For all I know, he thought it was normal. Where do you draw the line between abuse and simply inappropriate activity between 2 kids, even when one isn't consenting?

When I think about the way this made me feel then and how it still affects me today, I think yes, that was definitely some kind of trauma but when I think about the acts themselves I think no, that's no big deal, just get over it already, people go through WAY worse. These incidences really messed me up though. It changed the way I dressed and acted. I have really bad intimacy issues to the point where every time a guy is on top of me or tries anything sexual, I freak out and start shaking and panicking and I feel like I'm gonna throw up and I'll be on the verge of tears. I always have to make them stop and leave. I have issues with any physical contact, even if it's just hugging. I almost had a panic attack just going to the gynecologist for the first time. And I have a general fear and distrust of men, although I did have other significant incidences in my life that could have caused that. :(

Can anyone give me an answer?? Any and every opinion is welcome!

 

[Ase]

Similar age is always difficult to nail down. Both the same age, both consented at that age. You're thinking differently about it now, but really it all comes down to your thoughts then, and only then. After the fact as an adult is not an accurate recollection.

I would say sexual exploration... not everyone likes sexual exploration, which is why kids explore it to begin with to find what its all about.

 

[Rulaki]

I guess I should have mentioned that I didn't consent to it. I mean, I guess technically I did since I did the stuff he told me to? But I did it out of fear. I was scared of the kid & neither of our moms ever took it seriously when I said he was being mean to me. I used to throw tantrums whenever my mom would take me over there & she just chalked it up to me being tired. I had these same feelings back then, I just didn't really understand them. If that makes sense.

Thank you giving me an honest answer! I really appreciate it. I want to get as much input as I can to try and make more sense of this stuff.

 

[Sivur]

Similar age is always difficult to nail down. Both the same age, both consented at that age. You're thinking differently about it now, but really it all comes down to your thoughts then, and only then. After the fact as an adult is not an accurate recollection.

I disagree. Recalling something from childhood as an adult, does not necessarily make the childhood memory inaccurate. The memory may or may not be accurate - The mind/memory can be "funny" and everyone is different. I remember things as a child with great accuracy and detail, much more than other people. And when family members have questioned my accuracy, tested it, 9/10 my memory is/was spot on.

I think the line is drawn between abuse and non-abuse by the presence or absence of consent. If you did not want to; if you felt afraid; if you did not receive genuine good feelings from the experience; if you felt confused and/or shamed afterwards, etc. then I would say abuse occured. How deeply was it's affect is a different matter that only you can evaluate.

 

[Ile]

I disagree. Recalling something from childhood as an adult, does not necessarily make the childhood memory inaccurate.

Thanks for your response too! I agree with that statement. This wasn't something I just suddenly recalled as an adult. I literally thought about it every day from the time it happened until a few years ago when I told someone about it for the first time. After that the thoughts were less frequent, but the details of what happened and how I felt have never once changed. None of the details have ever been exaggerated or minimized. My memories of it have always been very matter-of-fact: this is what happened, this is where it happened, this is what he said, this is all I can remember. I've never been worried about the memories being inaccurate or false, I've just always struggled with how to label them.

This is all great input. Thank you. It's really helping me to get other perspectives on this.

 

[Hoco]

I guess I should have mentioned that I didn't consent to it. I mean, I guess technically I did since I did the stuff he told me to? But I did it out of fear.

Knowing this, I would say it isn't sexual abuse in the legal context because it was two kids exploring sexuality, however; that does not mean it wasn't traumatic for you, which is different again.

Do we need to apply such strong terms such as "sexual abuse" to two 9 year olds exploring sexuality, which is considered quite normal in the scope of growing up?

Traumatic? Obviously... due to it's bothering you. Sexual abuse? Not so sure that is the right term to be using in conjunction with this one.

 

[Karora]

Knowing this, I would say it isn't sexual abuse in the legal context because it was two kids exploring sexuality, however; that does not mean it wasn't traumatic for you, which is different again..

Interesting that that comment is the one that made you say it wasn't sexual abuse. I said I didn't consent to it and that I only did it out of fear. I always thought that those things were important for determining abuse? But yes, I see your point. Do you (or anyone else?) by chance know what kind of sexual exploration is normal at certain ages? Like specifically what kinds of acts kids would be engaging in? In this case, I wasn't 9 yet. I was at that babysitter from age 5-8 so I'm not really sure exactly what age I was. I'm just wondering if these things were normal at one age but not another? or if it was normal for that entire age range? I hope what I'm trying to ask is making sense.

Thanks for sharing your opinion!

 

[Ohap]

I would say it's sexual assault. He was punching you to make you fear him and forcing you to do sexual acts? How is that "exploration"?

 

[Ebis]

We are talking about a 9 year old boy and a 5 - 8 year old girl here... both of whom wouldn't even understand what sexual assault is, nor rape, and so forth. Sexual exploration doesn't have boundaries. Kids punch one another for reasons they don't even often understand. Psychology 101. They don't have complex adult emotions, which are formed in teen years and adolescence, not at age 9 and below.

Big brothers punch, push and pick on little brothers and sisters at those age for the exact same reasons. Siblings explore sexuality at those ages with one another. All of these things are considered quite normal at those ages. Again... teen years onwards you would begin looking more deeply.

I'm not saying there wasn't something wrong with the boy mentally either... but I'm saying sexual abuse is a tough word to be using based on these ages. Consent is not something children understand either. Fear is what children pretty much live by. Parents use fear to keep their children inline, thus kids adapt to fear and use it exactly the same due to the results they learn from their parents. This is where bullies come from more often than not... fear at home, fear is used by them on anyone they find weaker.

You wanted opinions... these are opinions, yet you are now trying to use your own feelings to sway and change opinion. The facts are the facts, and childhood psychology just doesn't view things at those ages as sexual assault. Again... traumatic is one word to use, but sexual assault is an adult concept, not childhood behavioral basis.

If you feel it was sexual assault, then you have every right to feel that and say it was, as it is your body. Looking inwards though based on childhood normal behavioral concepts... it is very much sexual exploration. Sexual exploration doesn't have limits. Nudity, dares, inappropriate touching and exploring one another, are all childhood concepts of exploration of the other sex and themselves even. It would be rare that there would be penetration at those ages with a penis to vagina, because the childhood brain doesn't normally have that concept within exploration. That is about the only limit that would be out of the norm for those ages in sexual exploration, being actual sex itself. The child brain isn't that evolved at that age for that concept.

 

[Rome]

You wanted opinions... these are opinions, yet you are now trying to use your own feelings to sway and change opinion.

No no no. This isn't what I'm trying to do at all! I accept every opinion I'm getting, and I am 100% considering each and every perspective you guys are giving me. I needed help processing this and figuring out what it is and that's what you guys are helping me do right now by giving me your honest opinion and allowing me to agree or disagree with it and then providing more feedback. It's helping me figure out how I feel towards it.

I'm not at all trying to make you feel like you're wrong or that I'm trying to change your opinion. I'm really sorry if that's the impression I'm giving. I'm thankful for the little debate we have going, and the feelings/thoughts it's evoking in me. It's helping me process.

Sorry again. I really do appreciate you giving me your honest opinion.

 

[Ipeme]

I am the one who called it "sexual assault" and I am not the OP, I just came across this thread at the time I posted. But I'm going to have to bow out of this thread for now as I'm becoming incredibly triggered reading your post Ebis.

 

[Ucu]

Maybe I should also start making a point of noting who I am in my posts. I am the original poster, I am also Rulaki, lle, Karora, and Rome.

Thank you everyone who is contributing to this. And so sorry if it is causing people to be triggered!