News Woody Allen Is Not A Monster. He Is A Person. Like My Father.

[Pencil]

Is it just me, or has this forum become a very argumentative place? I've been noticing it a lot in the last weeks.

Sorry, Lost Pup.

 

[ms spock]

The main reason I didn't go to the police was that I had no idea how it would affect my daughter - I didn't want to make things worse for her.

That is a common mistake. If it is not dealt with at the time it will come back in some form or other. I wish you had had adequate support and advice at that time.

 

[ms spock]

Is it just me, or has this forum become a very argumentative place? I've been noticing it a lot in the last weeks.

There has been a bit of tension in a few places. I have been surprised.

I don't mind debate or being challenged and I don't mind a fair and balanced argument but when people don't even read your posts but post what they think you are saying that is a little annoying. But understandable given how hard and heart breaking child sexual assault is.

Depending on where people are at in their own recovery period it can be very difficult.

And if you haven't been protected and you are feeling that keenly then this debate would be very upsetting for you.

 

[ms spock]

to obscure the lesson she learnt - that strangers are strange people and not unknown.

I am not sure what you mean here - stranger danger is pretty much a myth - pretty rare stuff in comparison to what happens in families, and family friends.

 

[ms spock]

Everyone has been very brave contributing what they have to this thread.

It is not an easy topic and we all come from it from multiple angles - all wanting the same thing - to stop child rapists having access to children (for me particularly in my family) and preventing the sexual abuse from continuing on to the next generation. We all have such different ways of thinking about it and managing it. Further complicating this is our own personal histories.

It is the beginning of social change when people begin to talk about how to change or manage things even if we don't quite understand where each other is coming from or is reacting to at this particular time. Even at times if we don't exactly understand what each other means.

Part of the problem with this is we are talking about creating social spaces that don't exist for children at this time. So as we talk we are creating a new reality.

 

[Survivor2Thriver]

So how does treating them as dangerous and a detriment to society protect the children? All that means ~~~~~~TO YOU~~~~~ is people don't want to see a member of a family through that lens and go into denial thus enabling the child rapist to continue their behaviours.

Now that we understand how you feel. Try exploring other possibilities to the same problem.

Putting a human face on the inhumane behavior of sexual predators will solve/lower sexual crimes? Christ! That sounds like brainwashing 101. Nothankyou.

One of the many reasons sexual predators are successful is due to the fact society as a whole denies/ignores the problem.

~`It's much easier to make good men wise than to make bad men good.~

 

[Pencil]

Putting a human face on the inhumane behavior of sexual predators will solve/lower sexual crimes?

No, the point is rather that you should look at the perfectly ordinary men around you - your bank manager, IRS guy, policeman, nice father playing ball with his kids in the park, EVEN YOUR THERAPIST, your aunt's attorney, any male - or female for that matter - and know that this ordinary, fully functioning person may be a monster. The monster is not the odd looking social outcast janitor.

 

[Lost Pup]

I may be in the minority here, but I think there is a lot of sexual abuse in homes committed by people who do not fully qualify for the classic clinical picture of a pedophile (ie not a serial offender but someone who, for example, takes out their rage against their spouse on a child.) And I tend to think that the classic clinical picture of such a perp is really based more on the idea that their pedophilia is a sexual compulsion, rather than a form of evil, interpersonal violence. Clearly, both exist. I think the problem is very, very big.

Yet I've never met a human being who did not warrant compassion, only one who challenged my ability to feel it. I am of the opinion that feeling compassion for the most damaged, dangerous, violent, etc. among us is not something we do *for* them. I think it is more that it will allow us to see them more clearly, treat them more effectively and thus strengthen the core values of a society in which denial and victim-shaming and scapegoating are no longer part of our culture.

So, despite his absolute participation in something evil, I feel utter compassion for Loskarn and am grateful to him for explaining one of the routes by which survivors become perps. Given that he paid for what he did with his own life, out of the intense shame he felt (surely fueled by his own earlier traumas), I see absolutely no reason to hate or demonize him rather than try to hear what he had to say.

 

[Pencil]

it will allow us to see them more clearly, treat them more effectively

Exactly.

 

[Pencil]

sure what you mean here

I meant that the kids are taught to beware of 'strangers' - but it confused her as any person she met was immediately no longer a stranger (she's extremely sociable). Also, she asked me what strangers actually did. AFter that incident she knew, and we could talk about it - and about the fact that even people whom you think you know can suddenly become a stranger by behaving in a way you would never have suspected.

 

[Survivor2Thriver]

@Pencil.

"The point is to suspect anyone and everyone around you."

You don't understand that comes naturally with me and many many others?!

The person who gave birth to me tried to put a "human face" on my older brothers abuser. He's a good man...he did a bad thing..blah blah blah. GUESS WHAT? It pissed him off and he took his rage out on me. Granted my brothers an idiot. Regardless it's a dangerous mindset. Do you understand?

For the love of God people NEED to think before they speak.

I may be in the minority here, but I think there is a lot of sexual abuse in homes committed by people who do not fully qualify for the classic clinical picture of a pedophile (ie not a serial offender but someone who, for example, takes out their rage against their spouse on a child.) And I tend to think that the classic clinical picture of such a perp is really based more on the idea that their pedophilia is a sexual compulsion, rather than a form of evil, interpersonal violence. Clearly, both exist. I think problem is very, very big.

Thank you

Thank you Lost Pup! My grandfather was a power rapist. I wasn't groomed so to speak. A pedophile wants your participation and a power rapist demands it.

 

[Pencil]

Do you understand?

Yes, I do. And the 'he's a good person' is mind boggling. But that is an almost universal reaction, and that is what the article was trying to get across, and what some of the comments were about.