Getting Too Near...

[Red Feather]

Today I got triggered out of the blue. I am going to a day center regularly and two guys there who are schizophrenic have been watching me. One of them has a real hard time defining nearness or distance, and is always searching for nearness. The other one just stares at me for longer periods and I feel really uncomfortable.

I don't know what to do. The ergo-therapist says this is a chance for me to learn how to deal with this... and that it is best if I set my boundaries. I just don't know how. I have the impression that the therapists at the day center know really little about PTSD and what they can do to help me when I get triggered.

Today was healing dance workshop. I like the class so much and come extra on wednesdays so that I can take part. The only problem is, I have a real hard time dancing with males. Today, I don't know exactly how I got triggered. I was standing listening to Nicole, the workshop leader, and I realized that I didn't hear a word she said and in front of me was T (the "staring" guy) asking if we can be partners in the next excercise. I think he realized that I didn't want to, because he turned away, and I asked Nicole to repeat what she said. We were supposed to find a partner and practice dancing close to that person and far from that person, to be able to feel our boundaries and communicate them. I started dancing with Daniella, and noticed that I was dissociating, i.e. drifting quickly away.

And so I sat down and eventually had to leave the room. Me and the therapists have discussed already that if I get triggered I can go sit down in the office, but the Intern was alone in the office just then, and she didn't know that. So she told me to sit in the quiet room. I didn't want to sit there because I knew that R, the other guy who always wants to be near me, would go looking for me there. She said that they are all cooking so I should be alone, so I tried it. But sure enough, Ronald came in. I wanted to leave the room immediately, but he said I should stay and he closed the door and left. A minute later, he came in again asking if he could sit on the sofa, and I asked him to move out of the doorway so I can leave the room. And he said "No, you should stay here." And then I asked him to move out of the way again, and then I went running to the ergo-therapists room, where I was already in full blown panic and crying frenzy.

So I sat for a while with the ergo-therapist and we tried to discuss a way to solve this problem. It all comes down to having to tell T and R to..... what? "Uh, stop staring at me. Stop trying to be close to me. I can't dance with you EVER. Leave me alone!" Oh geez.

My question is, what can you do when your triggers are people? How can I set my boundaries to these people??? I just feel like such an idiot while these normal situations are so hard for me. I don't want to freak these guys out, and I am so embarassed. It is hard to talk about it to anybody, let alone the therapists, and now I have to be talking to so many people about this problem I have, and tell it to these two schizophrenic guys who I want nothing to do with. It's days like this I just want to avoid, avoid and avoid my triggers, and stay hidden at home. Why can't I? The day center has been otherwise really good for me, but... I can't. :bag:

 

[The Albatross]

Me personally? I'd have the same problem too... except that I'd follow the suggestion to tell T and R to stop staring at me, stop trying to be close to me, it makes me uncomfortable and to leave me alone.

Remember you are in a supervised environment. Practice some boundary setting gal. (((Hugs for you too, been missing you round here))).

 

[Springer80]

I find how your being advised wholly bizarre and its making me angry. Your physical health is not a game. Its like they're telling you to play chicken because you lost someone in a car accident. It makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.

You have stated your boundaries already and they are legitimate and appropriate to the current grip your condition has on you.

 

[Justmehere]

I don't have any advice - I just want to say that I know of much lesser incidents that have triggered people I know WITHOUT ptsd.

I used to be a case manager for developmentally disabled population and a few of my clients had Schizophrenia and they routinely triggered even trained mental health care professionals.

I'm furious the way you were advised and I'm super proud of you for clearly stating your boundaries and asked for help. I'm deeply bothered by what you were told to do... These are not normal situations. It is technically a crime for someone to even momentarily block someone's freedom of movement by blocking a door. I've seen people arrested for just threatening to block freedom of movement, let alone actually doing it. (I've also seen people who have done worse not get arrested but that's another topic.) I'm not suggesting that the police be called, but that was absolutely wrong behavior your reaction is absolutely healthy and normal. It should be alarming. Having PTSD probably made it have a deeper impact and that makes it all the more concerning. But your alarm was good and healthy.

I hear you that you don't want to be triggered but in the words of a famous author, you can't cure normal. It's normal to be freaked out by some of the boundary busting behavior of these two men. Learning to feel safe being touched and to dance with guys involves taking small steps with safe people and these are not safe guys! Schizophrenia or not, they are not respectful of boundaries and not exhibiting normal social behavior.

I'm so sorry you went through this.

I'm so glad this place has been good and helpful for you in other ways. I would suggest maybe speaking to a supervisor - or maybe just trying to stay far away from these guys. Clearly some of the staff is just so used to being around what should feel creepy that they can't see this for what it is - you having a normal healthy response to their abnormal unacceptable unsafe behaviors.

 

[Red Feather]

Thank you all very much. I am all over the place today.

But WHY would a therapist suggest you attempt this with a diagnosed schizophrenic?!!

Well everybody there has some sort of mental illness... most of them there are schizo or have a psychosis, and I am the only one who has PTSD. So the therapists are much more used to that kind of illness, than PTSD. I sometimes think I am so much more mentally fit and focused than others there, but it honestly really is helping me. I don't know. I even started working on my music again. So she said that because if I am to stay at the day center, there is no avoiding me confronting him. Apparently that is what the day center is for, so that the clients learn these kind of things. :bag:

Clearly se of the staff is just so used to what should feel creepy that they can't see this for what it is.

There is some sense in this. On a bus trip last week, R. sat next to me, and I had no choice but to endure a bus ride for an hour and a half sitting next to him. And his hand kept on moving closer and closer to my leg so that his fingers could touch me. At first I literally picked up his hand and put it on his lap. The hand came back, and so I asked him to move his hand. And it came back again and again... until I almost burst and said "It's not good for me that you are so close to me! Do I have to change places on the bus? And he said, no you should stay and moved his hand and more or less kept it that way.

For some people, it is just a hand... but for me is disgusting, scary and freaky. Rebecca offered to switch seats on the way home and she also said that he had done the same to her once... So I am not just imagining these things. I told the ergotherapist about this too. She said it was good that I asked to switch seats on the way home. I think she doesn't see him as dangerous, but sort of goofy and likeable. She understands that he shouldn't be crossing these boundaries... and even offered to tell him that for me a few weeks ago. But he seems to look for closeness quite often, and then forgets it even when somebody tells him to stop. But it's getting out of hand. I am afraid that getting triggered this bad might make the whole thing fall apart.

Remember you are in a supervised environment. Practice some boundary setting gal

I still just want to flee... but one step at a time. I have therapy tomorrow. My therapist wrote me to tell me I should take care of the little girl that wants to run away. But I still don't know how to do that. I think writing this out on the thread will help me prepare for the session tomorrow. Thanks all.

 

[Deleted member 1860]

I think I'm a bit concerned that she wants you to practice boundary setting with people who are unsafe. I mean it's one thing to say go practice setting boundaries with a friend who guilts you into things or with a co-worker who tends to dump their work on you. These people aren't necessarily unsafe. I think it's sort of playing with fire to throw you into boundary setting with people who may or may not understand the concept of a boundary. I hope this makes sense.

 

[The Albatross]

What, Solara would lead you to believe that they are "unsafe"? I have had clients who are managed and schizophrenic. Just curious.

 

[The Albatross]

Hmmm. Nadia which is it? You're the one who's in the group? Are they safe or not?

 

[Red Feather]

I am not sure if my flashbacking is keeping me away from discerning that. I guess thats my problem huh?

 

[The Albatross]

Um yeah. You did a pretty good job of sizing up the situation without flashbacking so I'm not really sure what's going on right now.

 

[Red Feather]

Well yes, because it's the people who are triggering me and their actions... not writing about it.

 

[The Albatross]

I have experience with schizophrenics who were in either group... some safe and some not. I think short of being in the situation yourself it would be difficult to discern. Staring at somebody is perhaps uncomfortable and triggering but hardly unsafe. Especially not in a structured environment. Just my take.