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Childhood Mother In Denial Wrote To Me

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Nyssa

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I'm not sure if this is the right section for this post. I apologize to the staff if they have to move it.

So my mother wrote to me during my vacations this month.

I got it last week, and I spend my time avoiding my feelings since then.

Context

I broke ties with my mother 7 years ago.

Before that, I told her about my brother's abuse. She believed me right away, because she "sort of knew it without knowing it".

Long story short : after my disclosure, she had contradictory and hurtful reactions. Like telling me "The only way for me to survive is to pretend you don't exist, so I ask you to disappear for my life", and the next day "It felt good to talk to you yesterday and get it off my chests". I became more and more distant, and ask her to leave me alone for a while. She kept writing to me, I stopped answering. She mainly talked about her pain and her needs.

Then I started to remember my father's rapes. Flashbacks and memories I had conscientiously avoided until then. And it was crystal clear to me my mother wouldn't hear anything about it. I finally accused him in a letter, and both my parents showed up at my place. I didn't let them in and my mother left a letter in which she said I was making it up. After that, I told her she was out of my life. For ever. She seemed to hear that, and left me alone.

That's when I officially became familyless.

Meanwhile, I had pressed charges against my brother, and then against my father. She didn't know it yet when I kicked her out of my life.

To the cops and the investigation judge, my mother keeps saying I am crazy/manipulated by my therapist, that I am having false memory syndrome, that she never believed any of my accusations. She also said mean and useless things such as "My daughter never had success with men because she is too skiny", "Unlike my son, my daughter failed her life".

The judge organised a hearing with her and I last year. I expected nothing good from that, and nothing good came out of it. It was really painful. I didn't recognize her. It was like I was in front of a cold stranger desguised in my former mother. There was almost nothing left of the woman I had known. While calling me crazy to defend her son and husband, she kept saying like a robot "I love you, come back home, you have to go see a real doctor". It was pathetic and creepy at the same time. After a while, the judge told her to shut up with that, as she was close to witness subornation. That felt good. When it was over, my lawyer told me "You were right, there was nothing good to expect. I've never seen such a dehumanized mother. That didn't feel good.

Last year, it turned out that my brother had raped several children over the last years (after I had pressed charges...). He admitted part of it, and therefore ended up in jail waiting for his trial. For a short while, I hoped my mother would come to me and say : "I was wrong, I'm so sorry". I knew it would most probably not happen. But still, for a few weeks, I waited for it.

And now my mother writes me that absurd letter about love and life being stronger than anything. She says I put myself through hell for nothing. That I live in a dark place and can come back to the light (meaning "with her, as part of her family"). She wishes we could take a walk together without saying a word, so that we wouldn't hurt each other.

Of course, there was not a word about her son having confessed rapes and agressions very similar to the ones I accused him of.
 
Feelings

It's disturbing.

Reading her letter, I felt nothing but that sad weariness. I thought : here she goes again...

Then I started to be scared she would try over and over again to make contact with me (she had me followed by a private detective at some point). Then I tried to write an answer that would prevent her from doing that, and I lost myself in her confusion.

Then I felt sad for her.

There has been some anger too. Not so much though. I feel more despair and comptentuous pity towards her.

Deep down, there is that huge sadness. I miss the loving mother I though I had. I miss the woman she was, too. But thinking about the good memories with her hurts too much, as it reminds me there's nothing left of that mother... if she ever existed.

I felt loved by her. Deeply and unconditionnally. She couldn't have faked all that tenderness and kindness she gave me. She's not some kind of sociopath. What is she, then?

She was so blind to her children's suffering. Even if she didn't know about the incest, she let her husband be violent with us. She knew her son was abusing me, she saw him become a paedophile, and she did nothing to help. How can love go with that? It doesn't, I know. How come I felt so much love from her, then?

I'll never know what goes on in her head, and I know I should stop wondering. I thought I had...

I think she knew all along. She knew everything "without knowing", as she admitted for my brother. But she never had the strenght to face it. Her need to think we were a happy and normal family was stronger. She was excessively kind and tender to make it up to us. And to make it work for her, to make her see herself as a decent mother.

She was a weak and a coward. Still is. I despise her for that. But I believe she was sincere in her former affection for me. It felt so good at the time ! It screwed me up, too. It enables every abuse to go on, and it played a big role in my own denial. I've realized that intellectually, not emotionally yet.

Her fake world collapsed when I started telling her the truth. She lost it, and now tries to hold it together in denial. Her husband must be a great help for that! I just wish she didn't use me to that purpose. It's actually the one thing that makes me truly angry about her letter. I see it as a mean for her to keep seeing herself as the good mother estranged my her destructive cray daugther.

I know this is just an interpretation. I'm not in her head. And whatever goes on in there doesn't change anything for me : she's out of my life. So why all these questions again?

I don't hate her, as she assumes in her letter. She makes me sad.

To be honest, sometimes, I wish she would just die.

Ok, I'm done venting. And I feel ridiculous it was such a long double post.

I have no question to ask, actually... oh well, maybe this one : what do I do with her?

I felt like answering her letter, to make her see how pointless her attempt of having me back is. But it's dangerous, I get lost in it. Also, I'm afraid to hurt her to the point it would kill her. That fear could be very naive. Or not. I don't know. I don't want to feel responsible for her suicide, on top of everything.

Remain silent again may be the best option, I guess. I hope this is not the first letter of a series.

God, I can't believe that woman !!
 
Nyssa, I am so so sorry, you deserve a real mother who would have supported and protected you, a father and brother who were safe. You are absolutely right to have no contact with these people, I am very glad you are protecting yourself -- you are worth it! I hope you never forget that for a second.

While there are undoubtedly "explanations" for the behavior of all of them, that is by absolutely no means any kind of excuse. It's possible that she had been abused as a child, never received any help, and it's twisted around in a particular way with denial, wishes to pretend happiness in her own "family" as a "mother" though she completely lacks the skills, and maybe her own mother or other relative(s) did the same things... (how far back in time do these things go?) No one can know her history for sure except maybe her, if she had years of therapy... Similarly with your father and brother.

These are just my guesses, I am not a professional, but it's my sense of what often happens and pieces of your story resonate with my life, and probably will for many others here. You are not alone! I am so glad you are choosing honesty in spite of this horrific pain; I hope that makes sense.
 
I think she knew all along. She knew everything "without knowing", as she admitted for my brother. But she never had the strenght to face it.

It enables every abuse to go on, and it played a big role in my own denial.
I think you've written very eloquently about what you experienced in reporting the abuse to your family and authorities. I especially think you wrote with great insight regarding your mother's state of mind, that state which allows her to deny what she knows.

I have not spoken to my family in many years, but I get sucked back in occasionally for brief confrontations. It's rare, but disturbing when it happens. Unfortunately, I am responsible for most of that, as I pine away for the loving family I thought I had and lost. I've thought it through, as have you about your family, and there is no way that my family was ever a truly loving, connected, caring family... and still made the choices they made for my life. However, that doesn't mean they didn't love me. They loved me conditionally. IF I didn't tell them about rape, or ask them uncomfortable questions about the contradictions in their words and actions, or ask them uncomfortable questions about what the rapists in my life taught me to try to clarify if my parents believed that too... and I mean, it's difficult to filter all that when you're a child, learning about the world around you, trying to understand it all and figure out what's safe and what's not.... well, THEN, my family treated me with love and support.

That IF-THEN statement, may seem long and confusing, but it doesn't tell the half of it! The conditional love I received was so confusing I could hardly make sense of it as an adult with children of my own, unraveling how my parents' parented me... versus how I wanted to parent my own children. It's no wonder abuse passes down generation after generation, when many of these questions aren't even confronted until we're guiding children of our own and are suddenly confronted with the absurdity of our own beliefs and decision-making processes. There must be some saying like, "We can't know what we don't know, until we realize that we don't know it." We can't know what questions to ask ourselves, or what the value of our answers are until we're confronted with teaching another human being how to navigate the world. Well, I'm sorry, I'm off on a tangent.

I have found that I continue to wonder if I should contact some of my family. I wonder if my parents will contact my children when they're grown. I wonder if I've done the right thing by sparing them any contact with my family. My family was mentally abusive to me, and continue to by through their obstinate denial, but it does seem to be targeted at me. So, my internal quandary is in regards to how beneficial or hurtful is it that I deprive my kids from knowing them... there must be some benefit though, to providing me with a little sanity/peace of mind by not having to visit them or hear about their perspective.

So, anyway when I am contacted, I have always wished I hadn't responded at all. And, when I haven't responded, sometimes I'm quite proud of myself for avoiding the trap... and other times, it feeds the PTSD monster within to fantasize about how I might have responded in order to result in a worthy relationship. The denial in my family is quite thorough. I was raised to believe myself to be the abuser, the liar, the manipulator, the heartless wretch... and now my extended family tell me that I was always such a good girl. I know that if I hadn't "turned out well", if I had gotten knocked up out of wedlock or become an addict or something... then, they would say that it was no fault of their own because I was always a difficult child to raise. It's like... reality or truth really... is fluid for them, and they don't have to maintain the thread of truth that runs through all our perspectives, they are content to say they cannot know what they do not know and they don't need to know more, they'd prefer to just be sociable on holidays and smile a lot at each other... ignoring all the rapists in their midst because the rapists aren't raping anyone at the moment, and haven't raped them.

I'm not sure I've made sense or helped you at all... But, I wanted you to know that your post was quite striking to me, hit a nerve, and not in a bad way. In a kindred spirit kind of way.

Take care,
Muz
 
I'm sorry it went down like that :/ I had a similar falling out with my mother, though she holds strong in refusing to have any contact with me, good riddance. When people are in denial like that, it really is sad, because you know they know on some level and they're just desperately trying to hold on to a happy lie, while sacrificing those they were supposed to protect.

If you want my advice, I'd say don't respond. It doesn't seem like she's changed her stance, and it would probably only hurt you, as well as her. You aren't responsible for her, and no matter how you do or don't respond can't prevent her from doing something like attempting to end her life, as sad as it is. You can only do what's best for you.
 
Postcard from Hell

Your husband raped me.
Your husband undoubtedly raped your son.
Your son raped me.
Your son is in jail for raping other people's children.
Make the textbook connection or not.
But this is the last postcard you'll get from my guilt trip.


__________

For the record, I'm in the probably best to keep no-contact as well crowd.
Intentionally opening doors marked "Warning : Toxic" is inherently dangerous.
If you do so, make sure you're suited up!
 
Judith Herman wrote about it. Lies. At the bottom of most traumas comes a unspoken (or at times spoken) pact that the family sees no evil, hears no evil, speaks no evil. Because there is no evil. That is the basis of a dysfunctional family. It is a bitter pill to swallow that our lives (what we thought to be true ie - your mother's love) was a ploy to cover up a lie of monumental proportions. Gaslighting of the worst type.

I like @FridayJones postcard. If your mother has spent her entire life in denial there is nothing you are going to be able to say to get her to 'see the light' although apparently she is projecting onto you living in 'darkness'. It is hard to live in the light when the rest of your family is so dark. Through all of the pain of this I hope you are taking time to give yourself credit for continually walking towards the light regardless of the pain you are suffering.
 
I can not comment to your situation but it resonated so deeply.

I have never confronted my mothers denial as I have no expectation of it changing. To the outside world we have a perfect mother-daughter relationship. It's weird.

(For context, my abuse was outside the home and my parents knew, they just did nothing. I would like to know exact what they knew, or more accurately what they tell themselves about it).

Sorry, didn't mean to hyjack your thread. ... My vote is to ignore it and have any future letters go to someone you trust to only tell you if there is content you would want to know.
 
Your husband undoubtedly raped your son.
I loved your postcard! However, you cannot know that the son/brother was ever raped. The presumption which is often heard in society, that "abusers create more abusers" or that "victims grow up to become abusers" is a false myth. There are way more victims in our world than there are abusers. If the majority of victims become abusers, then their crimes would surely be much less concealed as it would be much more acceptable to themselves and each other. The idea of sending a postcard with factual statements which contradict the family's denial, and attack what is probably their most treasured feelings; pride and vanity (preservation of the family's reputation), is a shockingly hilarious idea which I'd love to see in a movie or read in a book. Some things like that, done in reality, backfire in a way that discredits the sender and makes things worse. Loved seeing it posted here though! :)

There are so many excellent responses on this thread! Each one speaks to me and my own situation. I'm so grateful to feel validated in my experiences, especially as I am not the one who began the thread. When my family responds to my stated perspectives with alarm "Where is this coming from?!?!" "How can you think that?!?!" etc... it makes me feel like I'm mistaken in how I perceive their comments to me and about me, and for that matter, to me about others. If my perspective is happening to others, it cannot be so easily dismissed as false. THEY may never choose to believe it, but their denial of it has less grip on my rationale while I know of others who are experiencing it.

Thanks for this thread, @Nyssa !
 
Thank you all for your insights and thoughtful answers. It really helps !

I'm sorry it resonates for so many of you. I mean : I'm sorry you have similar issues, I'm glad if reading and/or writing about it brings any help to you as well.

I won't respond to my mother. Not only is it the healthiest thing for me right now, it also happens to be the easiest.

@greenleaf

I do take care of myself.

About the explanations. Agree with you that they don't excuse anything. Actually, imho knowing what made a person destructive does not help.

@Muzikluvr

I can relate with what you described. That conditionnal love concept.

Part of me thinks that unless it is unconditionnal, love is not love, it just a lie. But I felt loved under the required conditions. I can't erase that past feeling, even now that I see things more clearly. It was conditionnal love my mother gave me. And it makes me wonder : what is uncondtionnal love? How far can it go? Isn't there a point, for us humans, where survival trumps love? Obviously that point will be different for each of us. But I'm thinking : maybe unconditionnal love is just love from someone who hasn't reach his own point of rupture. Maybe, this is all there is : conditionnal love, with more or less restrictive conditions.

@kagamine

When people are in denial like that, it really is sad, because you know they know on some level and they're just desperately trying to hold on to a happy lie, while sacrificing those they were supposed to protect.

So true. And well said !

I get that I'm not responsible for her actions. But I know it would bring me extra pain to deal with if she committed suicide after having read my words. I don't think I have that power, though. If she was going to kill herself at the sight of the truth, she would have done so by now.

@FridayJones,

Reading your postcard made me feel better, as it brought me validation. Thank you !


@shimmerz

I don't know Judith Herman. I will look it up.

My mother and I did have that unspoken pact : I would say "I don't know why I'm crying" and she would comfort me. Sometimes, I knew exactly why I was crying and didn't tell her. But most of the time, I was overwhelmed by all the unspoken pain and crimes perpetrated by my father. Since they had always been unspoken, there was no way I could say anything about this. So in a way, it did feel like I didn't know why I was crying. There was no words to talk about it, even when I grew older. Even now, actually. It doesn't come in words, I have to translate it into words.
 
I loved your postcard! However, you cannot know that the son/brother was ever raped. The presumption which is often heard in society, that "abusers create more abusers" or that "victims grow up to become abusers" is a false myth. There are way more victims in our world than there are abusers.@Nyssa !

((Warning: I'm on my 'talk a lot' meds. And this is one of those things I find fascinating, even not on them. So if I'm blathering on, know it's me!))

Yep... My understanding is also that most victims do not become abusers. However, the reverse logic doesn't hold true, as most abusers were victims.

I knew judicially it's really difficult, because where to draw the line between victim&abuser is hard. Like one can very easily say that an 8yo whose been raped every day since they were a toddler is a victim. They're just a little kid. And a 20/30/40yo raping toddlers is clearly an abuser. But what about the 8yo? Just a little kid who has been raped their whole life, right? Even if they're raping toddlers? Courts usually sort of pick "somewhere in the teen years" and draw an arbitrary line. But kids as young as 8'have been arrested for it. Even 3&4yos, especially in the foster care system (well, We have better data on the foster care system, I'm sure it happens outside, but the reporting is worse) have object raped kids younger or more docile than they are.

I know it's a really small percentage of victims who become perpetrators. (Making up numbers here). If only 1 in a 100 does, and each abuser abuses another 50, 100, 500? You've still only added a couple of abusers. But have hundreds and hundreds of victims.

But the stats the other way around are astronomical (in countries where rape is not an accepted form of behavior). Abusers are almost universally victims themselves. It doesn't excuse it past a certain age (and Inwish we had tertiary laws, so if an 4yo rapes another kid, the adult who raped them, or the adult who raped the 8yo who raped the 4yo gets all charges laid on them. Talk about fruit from the poison tree). But it does explain it. I suspect it would be universal, except that a lot of victims lose their memories... And in prison presenting yourself as weak is dangerous. So people forget and people lie. But even with those qualifiers, it's still a statistically significant correlation. But correlations have to follow logic. And the reverse logic doesn't follow (it's a fallacy/ you have to prove in both directions).

Gov. Howard Dean of Vermont (former medical doctor) did a really amazing thing, years ago. It's not a sexy program, because it looked at the root problem (aka would take a generation to show results, and cost and arm and a leg in the meantime... But then the results were so amazing they're in psych textbooks all over the world), but he wanted to lower prison populations. So he assigned every single birth a social worker. Because the majority of the prison population came from abusivr homes, and he reverse engineered how to stop that would be to get help to people from day 1. Because everyone was assigned a social worker, and had access to programs, it removed the stigma. It was also very common sense. At birth. A few weeks later (once reality & sleep dep set in) a home visit. Right when people usually need it the most, and are barely able to leave the house. And then follow ups intermittently. The idea being not to take kids away, but to educate parents, get them needed things (food, counseling, PPD meds if needed, other healthcare, work if needed, childcare if needed, etc.). All parents. From ghettos to country clubs. You need help? You don't even have to look for it or queue. It's right here. Did it eradicate crime? Nope. But what it did do was virtually eradicate crime due child abuse and neglect. By looking at stats like these [DLMURL]http://www.childhelp.org/pages/statistics[/DLMURL] (which are really conservative stats, I've read some that have abuse/neglect in the 80% and higher range in prisons) , and going after the source.

I only say its safe to say the man who raped one child raped the other as well... Because the other child started raping children.
 
One of the hurtful things when I reached out to my GP for a T referral due to my Csa was that she just assumed I was reaching out because I was sexually abusing my kids. That really hurt. I was actually reaching out because I was so over protective and knew as they grew older I would need to "let go" a bit (and of course other parenting help).
 
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