Attachment In Therapy - Another Thread

[Hashi]

Sorry Pencil, don't mean to go off topic. The point is that "homeo" means "the same" and "allo" means "different, other".

Homeopathy is treatment with things that produce the same effects as the symptoms. Allopathy is treatment with things that produce opposite effects to the symptoms.

 

[Pencil]

I agree that these two approaches are dominant, and I agree with what you say about the problems with the homeopathic approach:

Thank you for this! This is like a major breakthrough for me.

I'll respond in full later - I need to do something first.

 

[Pencil]

yank something else in.

Yes! Could you think of an example to illustrate this?

 

[Lucycat]

The point is that "homeo" means "the same" and "allo" means "different, other".

Homeopathy is treatment with things that produce the same effects as the symptoms. Allopathy is treatment with things that produce opposite effects to the symptoms.

OK, so how does this work in practice - with regards to psychotherapy? This thread is about attachment difficulties so how would you explain any therapy that helps with attachment in terms of 'same' or 'different'. Psychotherapy is about an exploration of thoughts, feelings and behaviours and correcting negative and unhelpful thinking styles ( amongst other things). How do you get from that to the black or white same or different theories?

 

[Pencil]

I shouldn't really be on here as I'm over a deadline.

As Hashi said, both medicine and psychotherapy often use a combination of both.

Attachment issues based on deprivation (in my case) - resulting in zero physical contact, zero affection, zero involvement, severe physical abuse to the extent that I had to be kept out of school, a mother who watched dispassionately, and, at most, put ice in the bath for me to get into etc. I was raped at 12 and never told anyone as there was no-one to tell. At 19 I found out she had suspected it all along. And so on and on.

I find attachment a very difficult concept. I only found out a year ago that people are SUPPOSEd to attach. In response to the emphasis on codependence, I honestly thought people are NOT supposed to get attached. So I viewed all my normal, natural needs to attach as part of what was 'wrong' with me.

So how will it help me to think, talk, explore etc etc in traditional therapy? Why not simply allow me to attach? I can't do it with a person who is not a therapist as attachment creates tremendous, overwhelming fear. Frustrating me places me right back where I was, and it is unbearable, so I terminate.

So, a homeopathic would frustrate me, then let me freak out and 'explore' how it makes me feel. ( Psychoanlysis / psychodynamic.)
Allopathic: Consider the 'developmental deficit' and provide me with what I need - which is in fact nothing dramatic (whereas the reaction to the frustration is very dramatic)

I am coming across more and more approaches and writers who say that if there is not enough of foundation, therapy will not 'take hold' before what is missing has been provided.

Time to leave this therapist and find a new one. It seems like a no-brainer all of a sudden. Pity I seem to be 'attached' to her. Very.

Got to go.

 

[Lucycat]

Why not simply allow me to attach?

Sure - why not? If you have no problem with attachment then this is the perfect solution.

I can't do it with a person who is not a therapist as attachment creates tremendous, overwhelming fear.

Oh - so actually you do have a problem with attachment. It causes fear. Hence simply allowing you to attach is not appropriate,

So how will it help me to think, talk, explore etc etc in traditional therapy?

Because you can work with the 'problem' - fear as you have stated above. Identify ways of overcoming that fear. Look at why fear and not some other reaction. Identify solutions and explore various types of attachment and the differing levels of fear they might or might not cause.

I am coming across more and more approaches and writers who say that if there is not enough of foundation, therapy will not 'take hold' before what is missing has been provided.

What is it that you think is missing?

Time to leave this therapist and find a new one. It seems like a no-brainer all of a sudden.

Sounds to me like she is perfectly on the ball.

 

[Pencil]

Because you can work with the 'problem' - fear as you have stated above. Identify ways of overcoming that fear. Look at why fear and not some other reaction. Identify solutions and explore various types of attachment and the differing levels of fear they might or might not cause.

Why explore all of this on a rational level? Why not deal with this on an emotional level?

simply allowing you to attach is not appropriate,

So I should not attach? By subtly pushing me away every time I do feel safe? That is exactly what happened this week - again.

Sounds to me like she is perfectly on the ball.

Why?

 

[Pencil]

In the case of diabetes?

• does a doctor tell the patient that the pancreas really is supposed to produce its own insulin?
  
• does a doctor prescribe painkillers and other meds for the symptoms?
• does a doctor prescribe insulin?

 

[Pencil]

What is it that you think

What I know is missing is not something I want to discuss here.

 

[Lucycat]

In the case of diabetes?

• does a doctor tell the patient that the pancreas really is supposed to produce its own insulin?
  
• does a doctor prescribe painkillers and other meds for the symptoms?
• does a doctor prescribe insulin?

• in the case of type 2 diabetes the doctor might suggest dietary and other lifestyle changes in order that the body becomes less resistant to the insulin produced, or so that the insulin is adequate.
• The symptoms might be - excessive thirst, excessive urination, headache, irritability, coma even. with the exception of the headache for which one might prescribe paracetamol, the others would probably not be individually addressed - but the underlying cause ie the too high or too low blood sugar level would be treated. ( with supportive treatment such as intravenous fluids for resuscitation purposes if required )
• A doctor might or might not prescribe insulin. Would do for type 1 diabetes certainly, but there would also be the balance with carbohydrate intake and exercise. You cannot take the insulin and forget the rest.

I am not sure where this is going in terms of attachment.

 

[Lucycat]

Why explore all of this on a rational level? Why not deal with this on an emotional level?

For me personally I have not been able to understand the emotional until I have rationalised it. I need to understand before I will permit myself to feel.

So how will it help me to think, talk, explore etc etc in traditional therapy? Why not simply allow me to attach? I can't do it with a person who is not a therapist as attachment creates tremendous, overwhelming fear. Frustrating me places me right back where I was, and it is unbearable, so I terminate.

So I should not attach? By subtly pushing me away every time I do feel safe? That is exactly what happened this week - again.

I am not saying you should or should not attach. I am pointing out that you have described attachment as a cause of overwhelming fear. As such is it safe to just wade in there and be overwhelmed? Would it not be better to explore this reaction, and then gently attach in ways that you want to, and feel safe and secure at the same time? I believe it is about learning what it will take for you to feel safe in this situation. It is also about learning about rejection and where this fits in - so that you do not again feel as you did last week, if rejection is indeed what you felt - I realise that is my interpretation and not what you have stated.

Why?

Because she is still there in the background challenging your thinking! She has you tied up in knots, working hard trying to sort this all out for yourself. That is indeed a clever person, rather than give you bland answers she has enabled you to explore your issues. I suspect she enjoys your emails and questions. I think most therapists like clients who are interactive and want to participate in their own recovery rather than sit there and 'be done to'.

 

[Pencil]

For me personally I have not been able to understand the emotional until I have rationalised it. I need to understand before I will permit myself to feel.

I understand it.

I am not saying you should or should not attach. I am pointing out that you have described attachment as a cause of overwhelming fear. As such is it safe to just wade in there and be overwhelmed? Would it not be better to explore this reaction, and then gently attach in ways that you want to, and feel safe and secure at the same time?

And there's the rub. The child attaches indiscriminately, whereas the adult does not attach at all. There is no middle ground. If I were able to attach gently and slowly, I would not be here, talking about it.

She has you tied up in knots, working hard trying to sort this all out for yourself.

Frustration. Which is making me think that it is better to chew off a limb. This is the same as having a postgraduate degree in Latin, while not being able to converse in it. I am perfectly happy on my own - for me being isolated was never an issue. Now it is, but I'm still isolated, except for a few lines in a weekly email. I'm not learning about the content or substance or ... rules or whatever about being attached to someone. She has no idea of what really goes on in my mind.

We never actually discuss anything. She ends most emails with the reassurance that she is still there and won't go away. But she is not really there if I don't see her, and, she responds to most statements with 'hopefully we will be able to discuss this in therapy'.

@Lucycat: I have a question. For how long have you been married?