Other Autism... formal dx this week

[Deleted member 20978]

@Cashew Absolutely, of course. I was responding to the expressed belief that being on the spectrum meant not desiring authentic connection, not meaning to say this ruled out being on the spectrum. I'm sorry if I misspoke.

 

[sun seeker]

And yet...even when everything else goes perfectly and we talk openly about things that really matter (not just small talk)...I still feel no connection with that person. I still walk away feeling more alone than when we started.

I have a book suggestion for you. "Nobody Nowhere" by Donna Williams. It is the autobiography of a woman with autism, beginning with detailed descriptions of her childhood experience of abuse and being horribly misunderstood, and continuing into her struggles for independence in adulthood. I thought of this when reading your description of really, really wanting to connect, feeling alone when you can't, yet not knowing how to make it work. Her book tears to pieces the notion of autistic people not wanting connection. She just needed a different kind of connection. From her description of what she could connect to in her grandparents as a child, to her connection with a young man who was also autistic, as a young adult, her deep loneliness and struggle for meaningful connection is apparent. It's a sad book in a lot of ways, but I wonder if there are parts of it you might relate to, and perhaps that might help you find words for your experience.

 

[Ronin]

but I have no way of expressing them on the surface.

What about learning to express them with outlets that aren't people?
Does the same work say around pets?
Or things you find beautiful / moving?

kinda suspect people are faking enjoying each other, but they're somehow not aware they're faking it.

Hey, to a degree, all social interaction is faking. You're just like the rest of humanity, the feeling, not feeling, and all shades in between, sides of it :)

But it doesn't make me feel warm and fuzzy inside.

Useful is good warmth enough. & useful is employable in situations fuzzy can't ever cover. :P

And yet, any time I try to let down the facade, the whole thing starts falling apart and people think I'm uncomfortably strange and weird, and they pull away from the relationship.

Anything that plays around with letting down of social masks / letting people see you more / more yourselfness in those masks? Thinking of some kind of merges so that masks you wear for other people are closer to who you are to yourself & your comfort zones? (Even if it takes exchanging whole friends circle. They can't keep up, their problem, not yours.)

 

[shimmerz]

I am facing this issue as I attempt to re-integrate into society. I used to be such a social butterfly. Thing is, now I am not certain that I even want connections with others. I see it as a huge wall that I will need to climb before I can get myself back into life again. I really appreciate this thread.

The thing is, I have been fighting this PTSD thing for so long. Things that matter to other people I don't give 2 cents about. Things that matter to me people have no clue about. It is hard to forge out a connection when one's life is so very different than others. Where is the common ground? Idk anymore.

Does the same work say around pets?
Or things you find beautiful / moving?

I think these are really valid questions. I introduced myself socially not too long ago and used a sport as 'my thing'. I connected through the sport. And yes, it was exhausting. Is there something that you can connect to in order to connect to people?

"Nobody Nowhere" by Donna Williams.

Thank you. I will read this in the hopes it may shine a light on where to go from here.

@DogwoodTree , you mentioned being a writer. Is that perhaps a medium you could use for connection? Sorry if this is not helpful. I feel like I am working this through as well, so I really don't have any answers for you - just theories as to perhaps how I will be dealing with this.

 

[DogwoodTree]

if you found those peeps who you really felt connected to, authentically being yourself, you'd stop caring if you are ASD or what. The trick is finding those people

I wish I could find those people. Maybe back on Mars...

Seriously, though. I have several people in my life who care about me, who genuinely want me to be real with them (although I'm not so sure they realize what they're in for if I achieve that goal). And I've tried for so many years to figure out what that looks like. I just don't know how to do it. Seems like I should be able to take notes and just let down the facade and "be me," but it doesn't work that way.

people on the spectrum share some traits with people dealing with PTSD

Yes, this is true. Makes it doubly difficult to untangle which disorder causes what issues, and what each contributes to the issues.

Have you tried nearing areas, with population more suited toward your needs? Somewhere you'd have possible time commuting to?

I'm within a half hour of a fairly good sized urban area...that's where the one aspie group is. The next closest group I've found is about 2 hours away when they meet in a location nearer to me, but they shift around and some meetings could be as far as 4 hours away. And it looks like the meetings are mostly just centered on orientation-type presentations, not really trying to get to know each other.

What about learning to express them with outlets that aren't people?
Does the same work say around pets?
Or things you find beautiful / moving?

Pets are difficult due to sensory sensitivities...the texture of their skin, the smells, the noise. I can tolerate them well enough for other people's sake (my DH is a dog person and we've had dogs before), but I found I didn't really connect with the dogs in a way that I felt comforted by them.

I do enjoy hiking, especially in the woods. The trees are calming for me, and the rocks and water features. But that's more about inner solitude than it is about connecting. How can I connect with my husband? Even if I never have a real BFF or whatever...how do I connect with the one person who matters most to me? He's trying. I'm trying. We're both committed. How do we bridge this emotional chasm between us? I really think I've got to know myself better first. I can't be "with" him if I don't first know who I am.

I have a book suggestion for you. "Nobody Nowhere" by Donna Williams.

Sounds very interesting. I'll look into it, thank you.

The thing is, I have been fighting this PTSD thing for so long. Things that matter to other people I don't give 2 cents about. Things that matter to me people have no clue about. It is hard to forge out a connection when one's life is so very different than others. Where is the common ground? Idk anymore.

Yes, this is a big part of it for me, too. I used to think this was the only part, but now it seems there are other layers going on as well. But even so...where is the common ground? And yet, even if I found someone who is extremely similar to me, how would I manage to like them if I don't like myself?

And then my brain goes, "Oh! Shame! There's a word we can put onto this experience, and research it, and follow rabbit trails, and figure more of this out!" And I go hunting, and I read blogs and articles and watch YouTube videos...but it's like they're talking about it from a significantly different perspective to how I experience it. It doesn't resonate. And I can't find answers. So it's another dead end.

Is there something that you can connect to in order to connect to people?

I've joined a local community orchestra. I like the task orientation, and the necessity of being fully present in the moment in order to keep up and perform well. But again, this is more like inner solitude near other people, rather than connecting with other people. I don't feel an emotional attachment to anyone in particular. I don't feel like anyone there knows me. No one there knows what I do for a living, or where I grew up, or what kinds of books I like to read, or what my favorite color is. And those are just surface details.

I don't know what a real friendship with any of those people (or anyone else) would actually look like. Those three people I mentioned who do know more intimate details about my past and my struggles...even when I spend time with them, and talk about things that matter...even then, I feel alone with them. It's not a logistics problem. I used to think it was, but it's not. It's a problem with me.

you mentioned being a writer. Is that perhaps a medium you could use for connection?

I do some journaling, sometimes. When I've shared parts of my journal with certain people, there's usually one of two reactions. Either the person is blown away by the depth of thought and insight, and they gush about how awesome it is (which is an immediate turnoff for me...there's no way what I write is that significant), or they practically ignore what I've written and only give a polite, cursory acknowledgement with no real interaction. Even those few times there's been a different response...where something I wrote got someone thinking, and they came back with additional thoughts to add that also got me thinking, and we both walk away from the conversation having been challenged and provoked to deeper self knowledge...those times are awesome for what it does inside to my inner world, but I don't feel a connection with the other person. It's more like, being locked away in a cell and someone threw me a bone.

There are very rare occasions where it seems that I "show up" emotionally and the other person "shows up" as well. It's very rare, so much so that I don't quite know what to do with it when it happens, and it doesn't usually last very long. Most of the time, I just can't hold two "presences" in my mindspace at the same time. I'm either locked away inside my inner world, or I'm codependently and intensely attuned to the other person's emotional state in order to try to manage that situation.

I've been working on things like: being aware of my inner state/thoughts/feelings while still being communicative, and holding space for the other person to experience their own feelings without my jumping in and trying to change anything they're feeling, and showing up to a conversation even if it's not a topic I would've chosen or have any real thoughts about. I think these things are helping me to be a better adjusted person, to be easier to be around, to be more present to my kids. But it's not yet resulted in a sense of connection inside for me.