Calling Troll On New Posters

[moonbeam]

From what I've seen raging behaviours which isn't that often, they get warned and pointed out that we are trying to help them. But its for everyone's benefit to block them if they can't respect the warning. Bans aren't permant. I believe they get reviewed after time. But if they can't respect the boundaries than they are going to be destructive to already existing members who are working to establish space and respect. We can all see they are hurting. But that doesn't excuse the way they treat people. Some abusers are hurting but we all know how destructive their behaviour can be to victims.

I think the Criterion A is important. If someone joins and doesn't state their trauma most people don't push. I didn't get pushed when I joined. The issue arises when people join and either ask if they have PTSD (which no-one here can answer) or say they have it from a non-criterion trauma. Then its respectfully pointed that it doesn't qualify for the diagnosis by itself. It doesn't minimise what they are feeling. It's a point of scientific fact. Non-criteria A trauma or stressors can be the catalyst that puts the stress cup off the edge for previous trauma. Delayed onset PTSD is also a thing. But PTSD is over diagnosed as it is. Just because someone has survived a criteria A trauma doesn't mean they will get PTSD. They could be just fine or suffer from a different mental health issue. Its also entirely possible to survive a criteria A stressor and have strong emotional issues for a bit (totally understandable post Trauma) and then recover. Either way we do always gently say go see someone qualified for this.

The thing is people sometimes join to be trolls. It is the internet. Sometimes they are also just people who aren't in a state of being helped/not ready and their hostile behaviour gets them warned then banned anf maybe someday they can try again. And sometimes people join saying things like they have PTSD from being cheated on. That's a big button pusher. Getting cheated on sucks. And yes it has huge emotional issues. Trust problems. Etc. And nobody says it doesn't suck. But it doesn't qualify for PTSD. So we give them a sympathetic hug, advise them to go speak to someone and move them along.

Just my 2 pence.

 

[shimmerz]

I was accused of being a troll when I came here.

 

[scout86]

YOU????

 

[shimmerz]

Yes. I had a bad habit of 'rescuing' people that I felt were being attacked. All things I have been able to work on here. Trolling I was not.... Issues? Yes. I was absolutely not raging.

 

[scout86]

Oh. Yeah, I guess I kind of remember that. I think I actually took that for what it was. (Once in awhile I get it right!)

I have been a loner most of my life. Even now, I don't actually see that as a "problem". But, there are a lot of things I'm not good at, because I've had very little practice. (Hence my T's "You really DON'T get this stuff do you?" comment, which I'm still laughing about.)

I look at this place as a pretty safe place to practice that stuff. It's kind of like the school yard. This time, instead of going over to play by myself by the trees at the edge of the yard, I'm choosing to hang out with the other students. There are a wide array of personalities, styles, issues, abilities, backgrounds, all that. Which actually means there's a wide array of resources too. So, while I wonder about people's motives, I tend to give them some space, waiting for them to show their true colors, (No pun intended @shimmerz !) Sometimes carefully chosen questions help with that.

All in all, I'm really glad I'm not the one who has to decide when to pull the plug!

 

[Kintsugi]

@scout86 Everyone who registers here agrees to our legal policy, so, yes, those are the rules you read, and anyone can brush up on those rules by looking through the links at the bottom right of every page here under the heading "Myptsd.com."

Some members are permanently banned straight off, such as the user who did not have PTSD and was an abuser. Permanent bans are also issued to people with an obvious spam agenda. Other times, would-be spammers are warned and edited, because they are sincere posters who just crossed a line.

Those on this thread who say they were accused of trolling... well, you're still here to post, so clearly "calling troll" on new members is something that only sometimes leads to a ban. Warnings are usually generous here.

It is correct in my experience that people who put the community at risk but might be valuable members are more readily removed than those who have demonstated genuine ability to respect requests to tone it down, cease and desist, or otherwise adapt to moderator warnings.

The administrators don't owe anything to anyone, IMO. This is a privately owned resource. It is theirs to protect and manage as they see fit.

I like this thread, but I find it interesting that the community seems to either want fewer bans or more bans at different times. While I have been on this site the past many years, I have alternately seen posited: "Who else will help them?" and "Why is this tolerated?"

 

[shimmerz]

so clearly "calling troll" on new members is something that only sometimes leads to a ban. Warnings are usually generous here.

I was actually counseled by a few members when the incident occurred and they offered to follow me. I have tried to do the same if new members seem to have a hard time adjusting. I wonder, @stenni, if this would be something that you could do to 'help' if your heart is being tugged.

Troll, I think is a broad term. It was difficult to actually figure out what I had done wrong, (because it was a behaviour of mine that I had not yet identified). I still get all out of whack if I feel like someone is being attacked but am in better control now. I am glad the site helped me out with it - and I am going to say it was the members that stepped in to guide me. Obviously people working this site don't have the time to be more specific or to mind read. That is where I think we could lend a hand to those that we feel are just having 'growing pains' when they join.

 

[Friday]

The Short(er) Version

I bring up CritA stuff for really 3 reasons:

- Education... Aka...Science, yo.
"I have PTSD from _________."
And the blank is not Criterion A trauma. It's factually incorrect. Head. Meet brick wall.

- Caring about others a little too much, maybe.
In my experience both practical application & best practice vary wildly between disorders. If a person doesn't actually have PTSD? Then the stuff we kick around here? Can not only be unhelpful but actively harmful.

- It pisses me off.
Both in how much misinformation is out there, as well as this is one of the few places I have to go where I can be myself. I use a lot of filters in this forum, but I'm also not having to actively block off parts of my life. People here are talking about war, and kidnapping, and rape, and CSA, and just really f*cking hard things... Not using those experiences as metaphors to justify why they feel bad.

"Similar to what I said in another post... I don't know if person XYZ has crawled over body parts, while covered in blood from killing their rapist, after they were tortured, in the basement of a burning school, during a hurricane, in a war zone, after being kidnapped from parents who were murdered in front of them."

When I'm asking if someone has CritA in their history? I usually assume some version of the above. I don't actually want to be pissed off. Not that I wish them terrible things in their lives. More that I'm hoping it's some from column A (education needed) & some from column B (you are here, are you in the right class?). I don't want this disorder. I don't think anyone here does. It f*cking sucks. Trying to find out what's wrong with you? I think most of us have walked that path. Trying to claim a disorder that clearly in no way fits, because it's sexy/ well publicized/ whatever? Drives me a bit nuts.

Spoiler: Original Post

I'm a CritA person! :D

One of the things that I love around here is that PTSD isn't required to be here or participate. In addition to all of us trying to figure this thing out there are also supporters, students/researchers, journalists, etc.... Who are all made welcome as long as they identify themselves properly.

Are there people who who identify as PTSD who don't have it? I'm sure. That's not really my lookout. I'm not the gate keeper (or key master ;) ), this isn't my forum, and quite frankly I really don't care.

Where I do care, and why I bring up the CriterionA stuff (if no one else has) is when people are saying "I have PTSD from _________." And the blank is not Criterion A trauma.

- It's factually incorrect.

That's the biggest one, right there. There are heaps of posts and articles about the site on what trauma qualifies, & why, & at least from a PTSD-perspective why it's important.

- Practical Application & Best Practice changes depending on what disorder or condition you're dealing with.

The second piece of why I care is that this isn't a meeting of GROSS (Get Rid Of Slimy girlS ;)). It's not a clubhouse for anyone and everyone who has ever had anything bad happen to them. The focus is very narrow, and it's on PTSD. While many disorders and conditions share symptoms with PTSD, how those symptoms are best managed? Changes, often dramatically, depending on what disorder or condition is at play. That's one reason why, when I bring up ADHD coping skills that I've turned and applied to PTSD stuff? I say so, very specifically. Some of those things will translate, and some won't. Because it's a different disorder.

What's best for us, people who are dealing with PTSD? Doesn't translate to every other disorder, either. Telling someone with a delusional disorder that what happened was very real? Not smart. Nor helpful. Straight up harmful.

- Lastly? It pisses me off.

Similar to what I said in another post... I don't know if person XYZ has crawled over body parts, while covered in blood from killing their rapist, after they were tortured, in the basement of a burning school, during a hurricane, in a war zone, after being kidnapped from parents who were murdered in front of them.

I always start out asking if a person has CritA trauma assuming so. Well, some version of that. But I don't act on (by giving PTSD advice) until I get some version of "Yep!"

I'm not a fan of contempt prior to investigation. Unless you catch me on a very bad day, ...and I wasn't having one yesterday... there is honestly no judgement when I'm asking if a person has CritA trauma in their history. More often than not? Yep. There's CritA trauma in their history. Okay then... Check out these links/articles that explain better than I could why it's not being cheated on that gave you PTSD, & welcome.

But when a person is insistent that being embarrassed by a teacher (or cheated on by a partner, or a bad trip, or the ever so classic stubbing their toe!) is "like" being raped? No. Being raped is like being raped. Or is "like" being tortured, or "like" being held at gunpoint, or any other real CritA trauma? No. Torture is torture, being held at gunpoint is being held at gunpoint, ad naseam....& It pisses me the hell off.

My own trauma stuff isn't so bad. People have had a helluva lot worse. But it's still Criterion A trauma... It's not a made up story to explain how something is "like" what actually happened to me, and other people on here. My life actually happened. My life is not a metaphor.

None of our lives are metaphors. These are actual, real, traumas & stressors that happened in our lives... That may make us freaks everywhere else we go... But here? This is where we are dealing with the very real after effects, and physical changes that happen to the structure of our brains, and what may seem extreme in every other avenue of life? Is normal here. You must be at least this tall to ride this ride. Don't care how tall you are after that. This is an actual, real disorder. Stemming from actual, real things. Metaphors? Try the room down the hall.

 

[Lucycat]

One of the things that I love around here is that PTSD isn't required to be here or participate.

I do think some people forget that. Before the MySexAbuse forum merged with this one the sexual abuse section was not even about PTSD and we still have many users here from those days. They have a history of sexual trauma for sure but don't want or need to get a diagnosis of PTSD. They need/get therapy for their specific trauma.

However I do understand when people claim to have PTSD it is clearly frustrating if they don't. But I do think we should step back and allow new members to find their feet before they share their most disgusting (to them) secrets with an anonymous group of individuals on a forum. Similarly I don't think they necessarily understand the diagnosis yet - they may have come here to learn the basics. Of course other new members are very experienced and have done research first and clearly want to share all their knowledge.

It takes all sorts.

 

[Born to Run]

As a non-native English speaker, I am trying to figure out the exact meaning of trolling. To troll : "make a deliberately offensive or provocative online posting with the aim of upsetting someone or eliciting an angry response from them." -Google Translate-. Trolls in Europe are Norwegian dwarfs or giants that are rather ugly looking :troll:
I may miss the point of the person that was banned yesterday, as being a troll. I thought it was a non-deliberate not offensive posting, but by a very disturbed person, who did not belong here in the end. What was the trolling part then?

 

[Kintsugi]

@Born to Run What part of an abuser without PTSD coming to a forum for sufferers of PTSD where we candidly discuss our vulnerabilities to abuse is not offensive and provocative?

There was a recent ban I didn't fully understand wherein the banned user was identified as a troll. I did not feel I'd seen obvious trolling. I asked my fellow staff, and I was told it was partially a thing of experience from moderating a mental health forum. As a member, as a mod, as anything, I listened to this, accepted it, and moved on with my business: trying to contribute to and protect this wonderful community, which has always treated me fairly.

For years, I was simply a consumer here. I didn't donate. Obviously, I didn't donate my time as a mod or otherwise. I wasn't in a place to do so. I tried to offer support where I could, I gave (sometimes too much ;)) input where I felt compelled to chime in, and I gratefully raked in the feedback offered to me when I asked for help (the good, the bad, and the sometimes necessarily and sometimes unnecessarily ugly).

I didn't have to give up anything to do that. I didn't have to pay a member fee for those years. I didn't have to volunteer my time. I didn't even always stick to the rules. I crossed lines. I made mistakes. I got warnings. But none of these factors affected my ability to use this resource for free, nor did I ever feel slighted or treated unjustly by the community at large or the moderators/administrators.

I am so grateful there is a place that asked so, so very little and has given me so, unspeakably so, much.

This is not to say that this isn't a valuable discussion. It is. Policies are informed by the community, and feedback is so healthy and wonderful.

I think my diatribe is simply to say that for me, personally, questioning the decision to remove some members is something I accept, because my experience here tells me that this forum is fair and successful thanks to its leadership, which has always been so generous to me, even though it got nothing in return except gaining just one more member and the accompanying perspective. A drop in the bucket. A whisper in the choir.

So for me, as a member, I don't always have to know every thread of thought that went into the fabric of a single decision.

 

[jaccat]

I personally think the moderation of this forum is done very well, and it must be a delicate balance for obvious reasons.

I tend to avoid any postings that look 'off' in some way, because I know I'm not going to react to them well. I think it's great that some members do try to help and give advice, but those posts that turn into train wrecks- are we not also partially responsible for encouraging the OP? They may be genuine people and unable to respond appropiately, but if we keep pushing them the situation isn't suddenly going to improve.

I'm not talking about yesterday's post, which I did not see. Just thinking about others I have seen in the past.

Like I said, I can't go near those posts anyway.