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WhisperingUnicorn
Gold Member
Oh my dear, that is BEAUTIFUL! and very in keeping with how we feel for one another. THANK you for that.... :inlove:
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Dissociating During Sex (please Keep Non-graphic)
- Post starter WhisperingUnicorn
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- #14
WhisperingUnicorn
Gold Member
.. not just "feel" but how we LABOR for one another. I will treasure that analogy, for sure. ;)
I don't have alters, but I dissociate as in going blank, dead, numb. I can't disengage because I lose all power to do so....I mean, completely shut off in my head and everywhere. I can't feel anything or react. So I avoid sex. Not the ideal situation. But my hope is that if I'm ever in a relationship with a guy I care about that we will move very slowly, in stages of closeness, which does seem to help a bit.
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WhisperingUnicorn
Gold Member
@Chava , thank you for sharing!
My man is "co-conscious" for the most part so we're not fully comfortable with the term "alters" .. The way he phrased a recent "switch" was that he was amazed that his "little" EP spoke, and when "he left", my man was left with what he felt was the "fingerprint" memory of a past, childhood experience and a flood of (mostly positive) emotion about the incident. So now he wants to learn to deliberately bring his others forward "at will" (for lack of a better phrase).
He and I were intimate at the time of the "switch" and the memory was attached to a rare moment of positive affirmation from someone in his past, and he was suddenly aware that he had misjudged her in some other areas, and his "little" EP was feeling "sorry" that he had reacted badly, later in life .. We both knew in the moment that it was the voice of his "little one" and almost as fast as he voiced the memory, he was gone again. It actually made for greater closeness in the moment .. so it *FEELS* like a HEALING thing .. that makes us want to chase this further, but I don't want to .. you know .. "make it worse before it gets better" kind of thing.
If I "go with my gut" ..?
*still analyzing*
~S2B
My man is "co-conscious" for the most part so we're not fully comfortable with the term "alters" .. The way he phrased a recent "switch" was that he was amazed that his "little" EP spoke, and when "he left", my man was left with what he felt was the "fingerprint" memory of a past, childhood experience and a flood of (mostly positive) emotion about the incident. So now he wants to learn to deliberately bring his others forward "at will" (for lack of a better phrase).
He and I were intimate at the time of the "switch" and the memory was attached to a rare moment of positive affirmation from someone in his past, and he was suddenly aware that he had misjudged her in some other areas, and his "little" EP was feeling "sorry" that he had reacted badly, later in life .. We both knew in the moment that it was the voice of his "little one" and almost as fast as he voiced the memory, he was gone again. It actually made for greater closeness in the moment .. so it *FEELS* like a HEALING thing .. that makes us want to chase this further, but I don't want to .. you know .. "make it worse before it gets better" kind of thing.
If I "go with my gut" ..?
*still analyzing*
~S2B
Aargh. Yeah, I switch.. hard. This is a difficult subject. One of my alts was born of sexual abuse, and he pretty much takes control every time. And it is more of a co-consciousness thing. I know he's there, I know he wants to be fed, etc. Truthfully I don't know how much of what he wants is what I want, if that makes sense. He's extremely dominant in bed, and pretty much only concerned with himself. He (I) was horribly damaged at the time that my sexuality was developing, to the point that it was basically murdered, at least in an emotional sense. And a demon rose in it's place. He seems to wish to just take vengeance on women, and sex is his weapon. It's caused a great deal of problems. That horrible woman degraded and humiliated him in every way possible, and so that's what he reacts with. He seeks to degrade and humiliate. I am able to rein him in to some degree, because otherwise he would just shake a woman to pieces.
But really, getting down to the bottom of it, he's utterly terrified that he's going to be castrated (symbolically) again. He (I) became an abuser to try and shield himself from further abuse.. a kind of "I'll beat you to it" mentality. I -think- that if he met a woman who was exceedingly gentle and giving with him, he might be okay. I had a girl like that once, and it was alright. He didn't come out. But she was in love with another guy, so she didn't stay.
Since then, it's largely been him dominating women during pornographic, borderline violent sex. Some girls are into that though, so it's okay, I guess.
You asked. :cry:
But really, getting down to the bottom of it, he's utterly terrified that he's going to be castrated (symbolically) again. He (I) became an abuser to try and shield himself from further abuse.. a kind of "I'll beat you to it" mentality. I -think- that if he met a woman who was exceedingly gentle and giving with him, he might be okay. I had a girl like that once, and it was alright. He didn't come out. But she was in love with another guy, so she didn't stay.
Since then, it's largely been him dominating women during pornographic, borderline violent sex. Some girls are into that though, so it's okay, I guess.
You asked. :cry:
I've got to apologize. I hope my last reply doesn't hurt anyone's feelings or cause negative waves. I was just trying to answer honestly. If it offends I'll be happy to delete it.
On a side note though, it did cause me to have a breakthrough of tremendous weight and significance, a very positive one at that. So yeah, thank you SO MUCH for this thread. :)
On a side note though, it did cause me to have a breakthrough of tremendous weight and significance, a very positive one at that. So yeah, thank you SO MUCH for this thread. :)
Ice_Fire
VIP Member
@Go Hungry I think your honesty in sharing that is a very brave thing to do. You're aware of this being a problem, I hope that you are trying to resolve it before someone gets hurt?
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@Ice_Fire Yes, well. Unfortunately it's too late for that. I did hurt someone, 17 years ago, very badly. I didn't know any of this stuff at that time, it's only through reflection that I've figured it out. It's a complex story, and is rather too graphic for this thread. It's in my trauma diary if you're interested.
But.. he's shelved at the moment. I'm single (can't imagine why :p) and so he's contained. There have been some moments he's come out, but in those cases, it was with girls who are into that sort of thing, so there was no harm as a result. He's not like.. violent violent.. He is aware that it is a form of rough play, and safewords are used. It's just how he copes.
So there you go. Again, I'm really sorry if I killed the thread. It wasn't my intention. :(
But.. he's shelved at the moment. I'm single (can't imagine why :p) and so he's contained. There have been some moments he's come out, but in those cases, it was with girls who are into that sort of thing, so there was no harm as a result. He's not like.. violent violent.. He is aware that it is a form of rough play, and safewords are used. It's just how he copes.
So there you go. Again, I'm really sorry if I killed the thread. It wasn't my intention. :(
I'm posting here because you mentioned it in another thread. I would like to respond with something brilliant or at least thoughtful. But sex is the most complicated and triggering thing of any. I've been married for 20 years, together 24. Have two kids. Sex has always been complicated but I never really understood why until all the s*&T hit the fan.
Yes "switching" or whatever it is is a huge problem. We are both trying to understand it. Very complicated to communicate about it because it depends on what part is there and when. We can "talk" about intimacy in non-bed/non-sexual moments. All seems very clear and good. But in the moment it is a mess. I'm a mess and don't know what I want, and he is a mess because he doesn't know what I want. It is very, very hard for both of us.
I wish I had some clear answers. It has definitely helped both of us to have a lot of conversations about sex when we're outside the moment. Just recently, in the moment, I was actually able to say "I'm getting messed up." That's all I could say, and even that was a struggle. But it was enough, and my husband appreciated it.
If I had the ideal situation...I suppose I would want my partner to ask me not once, but repeatedly, if this is okay. And to go with his instinct too...not just what I say.
It is an icky complicated situation. The fact that you're concerned and aware is GREAT. It doesn't make it any easier for either you or your partner.
If I eventually figure out an answer from the sufferer point of view, I'll certainly share it.
Yes "switching" or whatever it is is a huge problem. We are both trying to understand it. Very complicated to communicate about it because it depends on what part is there and when. We can "talk" about intimacy in non-bed/non-sexual moments. All seems very clear and good. But in the moment it is a mess. I'm a mess and don't know what I want, and he is a mess because he doesn't know what I want. It is very, very hard for both of us.
I wish I had some clear answers. It has definitely helped both of us to have a lot of conversations about sex when we're outside the moment. Just recently, in the moment, I was actually able to say "I'm getting messed up." That's all I could say, and even that was a struggle. But it was enough, and my husband appreciated it.
This is what is so very difficult. Some parts want it. Some parts think they "should" engage even though they don't want to. Some parts freeze and become so powerless that they cannot communicate.
If I had the ideal situation...I suppose I would want my partner to ask me not once, but repeatedly, if this is okay. And to go with his instinct too...not just what I say.
It is an icky complicated situation. The fact that you're concerned and aware is GREAT. It doesn't make it any easier for either you or your partner.
If I eventually figure out an answer from the sufferer point of view, I'll certainly share it.
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- #22
WhisperingUnicorn
Gold Member
Thank you for your posts (@Hope4Now , @Ice_Fire , @Go Hungry ) .. This is a "heavy" topic because it involves intimacy, vulnerability, victimization (and the trying to avoid that), and arguably the most natural/physical aspect of our lives that allows us to "touch" another person's soul. So thank you for your frankness! And no, this doesn't deviate the thread topic, I consider it ALL relevant, and helpful, in varying ways!
I like the "ask repeatedly" if this or that is "okay" with my man .. because we are forever "checking in" with each other throughout our time together, from everything from social dynamics, times we're out in public together, to the most private moments. We both have to have lots of patience with each OTHER .. and it feels almost "too good to be true" that we are able to not only navigate the complexities of BOTH of our pasts (though I am not PTSD, I had my own issues, mostly insecurities and bad examples), but also to come up with a strategy that works for both of us .. AND for the kids we very much hope to have together, building a family of our own ....
We are both "rational" by temperament, and my man is a KING planner. He is all about writing things down, making a plan, working the plan, etc. This is part coping mechanism, and part serious talent, and part personal joy. It is very "natural" for us to apply this method to our intimacy, too .. and even in the space of the past couple weeks, I have seen SIGNIFICANT growth in him, synthesizing of his thought processes, reassurances and encouragement that he is going to be an amazing Dad if we are successful in having the kids we so desire, etc.
Input, here, has been a huge help for me .. like putting on the right pair of glasses and everything comes into focus. So thank you, again!
I am open to any and all relevant continuing conversation on this is people have more thoughts/experiences/advice to share. ;)
My man's ANP can be like this .. but mercifully, he's also fiercely protective of me .. so he is forever checking in with me to make sure things aren't getting too rough .. that I'm enjoying him and/or what we're doing, etc. I haven't yet seen this get out of control, and I don't fear that it will .. He tends to voice "demands" or "expectations" of me in intimate moments and require a response .. It's a little as if her perceives that I'm so vulnerable in a given moment that anything I say he'd be safe to "hold me to it" but he (his ANP) thinks I wouldn't agree in more "sober" moments .. (things like, if our kid comes to us and asks thus and such, I will respond thus and so - he is VERY alert to making sure I won't shame or stigmatize our kids) .. but in truth, none of his "expectations" in this regard deviate from our mutual goals. It's been more a communication dynamic that we are working on, because he doesn't need to feel "power" over me to obtain agreement. This seems to require me to be more reassuring, yet also demonstrating that I am my own person, I have my own mind, AND I agree with him, so he doesn't need to "force" agreement .. He needs to be reassured I'm not just playing a game, or pretending agreement as some kind of manipulation or like I'm "trapping" him .... Since I'm NOT manipulating or trapping him, this isn't offensive to me .. I just need to be patient with him, here ....
(TO BE CONTINUED)
I like the "ask repeatedly" if this or that is "okay" with my man .. because we are forever "checking in" with each other throughout our time together, from everything from social dynamics, times we're out in public together, to the most private moments. We both have to have lots of patience with each OTHER .. and it feels almost "too good to be true" that we are able to not only navigate the complexities of BOTH of our pasts (though I am not PTSD, I had my own issues, mostly insecurities and bad examples), but also to come up with a strategy that works for both of us .. AND for the kids we very much hope to have together, building a family of our own ....
We are both "rational" by temperament, and my man is a KING planner. He is all about writing things down, making a plan, working the plan, etc. This is part coping mechanism, and part serious talent, and part personal joy. It is very "natural" for us to apply this method to our intimacy, too .. and even in the space of the past couple weeks, I have seen SIGNIFICANT growth in him, synthesizing of his thought processes, reassurances and encouragement that he is going to be an amazing Dad if we are successful in having the kids we so desire, etc.
Input, here, has been a huge help for me .. like putting on the right pair of glasses and everything comes into focus. So thank you, again!
I am open to any and all relevant continuing conversation on this is people have more thoughts/experiences/advice to share. ;)
My man's ANP can be like this .. but mercifully, he's also fiercely protective of me .. so he is forever checking in with me to make sure things aren't getting too rough .. that I'm enjoying him and/or what we're doing, etc. I haven't yet seen this get out of control, and I don't fear that it will .. He tends to voice "demands" or "expectations" of me in intimate moments and require a response .. It's a little as if her perceives that I'm so vulnerable in a given moment that anything I say he'd be safe to "hold me to it" but he (his ANP) thinks I wouldn't agree in more "sober" moments .. (things like, if our kid comes to us and asks thus and such, I will respond thus and so - he is VERY alert to making sure I won't shame or stigmatize our kids) .. but in truth, none of his "expectations" in this regard deviate from our mutual goals. It's been more a communication dynamic that we are working on, because he doesn't need to feel "power" over me to obtain agreement. This seems to require me to be more reassuring, yet also demonstrating that I am my own person, I have my own mind, AND I agree with him, so he doesn't need to "force" agreement .. He needs to be reassured I'm not just playing a game, or pretending agreement as some kind of manipulation or like I'm "trapping" him .... Since I'm NOT manipulating or trapping him, this isn't offensive to me .. I just need to be patient with him, here ....
(TO BE CONTINUED)
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- #23
WhisperingUnicorn
Gold Member
.. This really touched my heart. My man has similar regrets from his own past .. I don't know @Go Hungry 's full story yet, but I do know THIS: It is never too late. We cannot undo what's been done, but there is SERIOUS hope for forgiveness, redemption, restoration, and building something NEW with what time is in front of us. My man and I are "older" for considering being first time parents - I'm almost 40 and he's almost 50. But we have a window of time here where that could still be possible (at least biologically). Even if that weren't true, we ARE working very diligently to do things "right" this time around. For BOTH of us. And to "do right" BY each other. :hug: :inlove:
There is always HOPE, it is NEVER "too late" to resolve so no future someones get hurt :inlove:
(TO BE CONTINUED)
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- #24
WhisperingUnicorn
Gold Member
Oh my dear, thank you for sharing! I read a book several years ago call "Relationships: A Mess Worth Making." I don't even remember a lot from the book itself, I should probably re-read. But the TITLE alone is just beautiful. We are a BEAUTIFUL mess. ;) :inlove: :hug:
The fact that you have been together 24 years gives me SO much hope! (I'm big on that theme of HOPE, can you tell? ;) ) I am not looking for perfection, or for a fairy tale. I want a REAL, vibrant, organic, always moving towards healing and wholeness kind of relationship.
There are times where it's 3 steps forward, 4 steps back, but the overall trajectory should always be chasing after that ideal. My man uses the phrase "chasing oneness" knowing full well there are times when we will hit bumps in the road, but the goal is ALWAYS worth striving for.
Thank you for sharing your comments - like I also mentioned above, especially the comments about asking repeatedly if this or that is okay in the moment, talking openly when we're not "in the moment," and also the encouragement for your spouse/Supporter to "go with his instinct" cuz honestly, a LOT of what we do feels like just that .. I can only "go with my gut" on some of this, but I think if my man knows that I LOVE him, that I'm only interested in PROTECTING him, even if in a given moment I might be overcome by my own selfishness (and vice versa) .. well, we can still DANCE even if we oops and step on each other's toes from time to time. :inlove:
~S2B
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