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News Mental Health Diagnosis

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I have to disagree Monster. I think that people are diagnosed for mental illnesses when it is unnecessary. I can use my own recent dealings with my previous therapist as an example. I have to have some alone time in order to sort of re-charge. The next question was if I was sexually abused, I was not. Between that and my current struggles to deal with the stress in my life meant I had a chemical imbalance in my brain and had always been depressed since childhood. The only hope: anti-depressants. I completely disagree with his assessment of me.

It does happen. There are flaws in the way the mental health system currently works. It is not perfect in the way it is currently practiced. I am not saying all diagnoses are wrong, but some are. Some mental health professionals just want to throw out a diagnosis when it is unnecessary. Again, this is some, not all.
 
Its true that psychiatrists and therapists can misdiagnose, so can medical doctors. I don't think that any one of them are perfect in the way they are practiced. What I was saying was that in the film, it appeared to me as if normal behavior was being diagnosed as mental illness. I don't agree. I have seen children with ADHD that truely have a disorder. I'm not condoning blindly agreeing with any practitioner. In America, we want a pill to fix us. We are as much to blame as anyone else in the overmedication dept. No one is holding a gun to our head insisting we ask our doctor for a medication. I took myself off my meds, fired my P doc and continue with an antidepressant and a therapist, knowing that it will be a long time and take a lot of work to be the person I want to be.
 
I find it is a very interesting argument, this subject. There are serious inadequacies on both sides.

IMO, based on some home truths that have been raised within such videos, even inadvertantly due to a religious cause, psychiatry is being forced into a scientific corner to prove itself more than ever.

Psychiatry is a true combination of best guess and prior learning. The reason for that is because brain imaging is not readily available. If MEG was readily, and cheaply, available, then going to a psychiatrist would include a trip to the MEG for neuronal activity, thus diagnosis could be confirmed or denied upon MEG imaging for near most mental health issues today.

That cannot really be disputed, as MEG is empirically validated already and best guess is completely clear when assigned any time based symptomology, which mental health is full with. You cannot tell someone they have PTSD because they've suffered x, y & z symptoms for a month. At the two month period, without any intervention, that person may have no symptoms. Did they have PTSD? No, they didn't. They had a delayed onset of perfectly normal symptoms to experience when faced with an abnormally traumatic event.

In this light, I think there are equal facts on both sides of the fence. Scientology dismisses a lot of things... lets not make it about religion, however; does it make the argument overall incorrect? There are some very valid points.

Monster... diagnoses are actually debated, argued and voted upon. They no longer do it like stated in those videos, back in the old days of putting a select team in a room to debate it out. They are still done with submissions, opinions, thoughts, proofs, studies and so forth, all submitted to a board (team) in which that board agrees or disagrees as a majority (vote) on the validity of such information and the direction they ultimately want a diagnosis to head. How do you think the PTSD diagnosis took such radical changes from its first draft, second, third then its current final draft, in the DSM V? That was an ongoing debate, voted on by a team on what best to apply, what to disregard, and what to present. That process seen the draft change several times, ultimately the team compromised to what is currently presented and within trials. You can even read about each team on the DSM 5 website. Areas have specific teams to handle rewriting categorised diagnoses. That team argue it out, agree & disagree, then ultimately compromise (vote has taken place). The majority wins, the minority loses.
 
A little background, I used to be a Scientologist, the film turned out to be a stressor for me, lol. I've been following the debates on PTSD for the DSM-V, it is a long process.
 
While it may seem that "real" diseases can be diagnosed from some simple testing, the truth is far from it. Take something as simple as an ECG. The computer read-out says there has been an anterior wall MI (heart attack) and the computer bases that on the way the ECG looks at certain points. If this is a very thin person, the poor R-wave progression is due to lack of chest wall to transmit the signal normally. If it is a very obese person with lots of breast tissue, it may be from placing the leads away from the breast tissue. It can also be a normal variant present from birth. If it is a diabetic that has had poor glucose control for decades it may be a heart attack that was never "felt" by the patient.

If you order the labs associated with heart attack, they only show a heart attack if they are drawn at the right times. If you order a nuclear scan it can who you dead areas of the heart and areas that are at risk - but the nuclear scans are expensive, and you don't start with those. Cardiac cath is considered the gold standard, but about one in a thousand patients has a bad outcome from their cardiac cath. (My grandmother died from hers.) So you don't start with a cardiac cath for the vast majority of patients with chest pain - you do other things first.

The problem as I see it, is that because most of psychiatric work is diagnosis of inclusion/exclusion without any incremental testing that definitively rules in/rules out a patient. And everything thinks that they can "diagnose" - because it isn't an exact science. I've seen patients come to the hospital with diagnoses of things that I suspect are just flat wrong - some by MDs, others by LCSWs or PhDs or counselors.

Patients present themselves in certain ways, divulge some information without telling other bits, equally important. They may come to the psychiatric interview wanting parenting, needing parenting, but wind up with a bottle of pills because parenting takes a long time and involves both parties. Or the therapist wants to parent and what the patient needs is medication.

I don't think the process is properly worked out - or even know how it should begin.
 
Human beings are extra-ordinarily complex systems. They are, to make things worse, extremely resiliant systems - that is, they very often don't *completely* break down when something goes awry. In fact, malfunctions that do cause rapid and total breakdown are frequently the ones we have the easiest time addressing - because their etiology and *fix* is fairly straightforward. If you are massively bleeding - the fix is to stop the bleeding ASAP - figuring out WHY the bleeding happened (cut by a sheet of metal!) is sometimes easy and sometimes not so easy (non-specific intestinal bleeding at irregular intervals.) Although in this case once you've got the spot the blood is coming from it is often possible to do something about it. the circulatory system (which intricate, vast and fascinating) is also wildly less complex and a couple of orders of magnitude better understood than the neurological system (which is not to say that there aren't any number of mysteries associated with what exactly all that circulation is circulating!)

Troubleshooting gets tough when the systems you are troubleshooting get complex.

There is an awful lot of pretty basic stuff we just don't know about brains and neurology and ourselves as thinking/feeling beings. (For example: Are all those neurons in your gut important? What do they do exactly? What are all the neurotransmitters? Really. Basic Stuff.) I say this as the ex-wife of a CalTech Neuroscientist and friend of many cutting edge cog sci and Neuro-science researchers.

We don't have a very good handle on what "normal" is in mental/emotional life. We can recognize when things are wildly out of wack - but whether that is the fault of the system (the person's function) or the environment (the society, institution or family or whatever) is hard to figure. Anthropologists often have a very funky take on mental illness - but it is worth considering what they bring to the table, as a perspective and as a corrective to knee jerk scientism. Tanya Luhrmann, for example, is an anthropologist who wrote a super interesting book on the training of psychiatrists. (Spoiler, it won't build your confidence in them particularly...)

So, what are diagnoses and the DSM in particular supposed to DO, and BE? And what are the institutional forces at work dictating that they become? I think it is easy in the whole process and politics and economy of the thing to lose track of the point of the exercise, which is healing people who are suffering. Which, unfortunately for all, makes it hard to keep one's eyes on the science as well.

As a philosopher, who don't shy away from tough questions, I have to say this is tricky tricky stuff to try to get sorted.

I would submit that "diagnoses" as scientific generalizations are very often perverted by their use in regulating access to treatment and insurance coverage. It is just hard to keep these things separate.
 
To the OP
DSM 5 has not yet been released....(due to be released in 2013) The video is speculative and rather presumptuous.

Many of the inclusions are supported by science and field studies. Psychiatric evaluation process requires observational methods of analysis, which are historically a very useful mode of scientific enquiry. The information often presented to psychiatrists includes biological studies which have ruled out general biological causes, there is also consideration of those in proximity to the patient (if present and accessible) as to their observations of behaviours. Psychiatrists are very well educated, and if they have sufficient experience, they have a greater number of clinical observations to draw knowledge from. A complete picture is expected and a ruling out of possibilities is the practice. They are also trained in appropriate use of the DSM and other diagnostic tools, the book provides guidance, but the practice is about exploration and ruling out than it is about slapping someone with a book.

There are some mental disorders that can more observable than others, such as the repetition of acute OCD, the changes in personalities in personality disorders, and the belief systems of delusional, and self harm. Then there are others such as depression and dissociation that require a carefully trained eye. It can become automatic that when a patent walks into a room you start ruling out diagnosis based on obvious behavioural observations.

I see quite a bit of editing in the OP video, where they capture 'voice grabs' of psychiatrists prescribing and do not show what the undercover interviewer had said prior to this point. I may be not listening actively enough, but I did hear one psychiatrist comment that the interviewer said he was depressed and was taking him on face value. I would be much more concerned if the interviewer was diagnosed with a more obviously incorrect diagnosis at the behavioural observational stage, then speculating that it could be depression based on what the interviewer might have said.

We can also consider that the insurance questions of the psychiatrists may have been in response to payment for consultation and not just medication. If you have insurance, you don't need a diagnosis for justifying payment because it can be justified by an exploration of the problem - at least for a set number of investigations depending on policy you pay for or your work pays for.
Then there is whether the interviewer asked what the treatment was for depression and the psychiatrist answered the question, and if a prescription was handed over was at all, let alone the dosage provided. Some may offer such a small dose of medication that it is the inequivalent of a mild sleeping tablet to see the extent or severity of the problem. Ultimately, patients need to be as honest and truthful with psychiatrists, as much as psychiatrists need to be careful about prescribing.

If there is a skin picking reference in the DSM it may be a component of a broader illness like Body Dimorphic Disorder (BDD) within the self-harm spectrum. It is very difficult for anyone to use the DSM correctly without access to the DSM, proximity to the patient and enough time to make observations and obtain clarity of communication and feedback.

Many things considered ''culturally''acceptable have been revised with knowledge, like homosexuality, and like religious belief systems which could easily fit a delusional disorder if they are not culturally acceptable.

The fact that this process happens shows that there is some ''humanism'' in contributions and revisions of the DSM and a recognition of 'normal' and culturally acceptable behaviours, and a willingness to revise as more information comes to light, whether that be through field studies, or an acceptance of a ''cultural'' or ''societal view'' of behaviours or belief systems.

Those in the video that claim the DSM is a trading floor, may have made their own assumptions and have their own agendas. For example, one psychiatrist may not have been successful in achieving the changes he/she desired at the conference or did not feel listened to and reacted in a hostile way against the process because of personal bias, ambiguity, assumptions and hurt egos.

The other thing to consider as one person pointed out before was what is the agenda of the videos creator. We can talk a lot about compensation and insurance in a negative way as well as the pharmaceutics capitalism efforts. However, we can't ignore the compensation and capitalism of the Scientology who created the video. The growth strategy of belief followings is about donations and you get donations by putting bums on seats. I personally have observed multiple faiths who are targeting depression as a larger problem than it is, as they believe faith communities are only answer to curing depression. Or is it possible that those who feel a little sad, are unaware of the severity of a depression diagnosis, which faith groups can market to, to increase bums on seats and donations.

All the above is possible. The diagnosis is dependant on truthfulness an honesty of both parties. Assumptions are dangerous, yet we all make these assumptions nonetheless based on our own bias and perceptions.
 
Bio-medicine (antibiotics, surgery for physical trauma, that sort of thing) is based on an extremely detailed understanding of how the body is supposed to work. After a year of studying how the body works when it's fine, students start learning about how it can go wrong. In mental health, we don't have anywhere near the same level of understanding of what normal healthy functioning is. How do you restore healthy functioning when you don't know what it is? It's guesswork.

I'm convinced that we do know how PTSD works. The problem is that without models of healthy functioning, you're playing Russian roulette. PTSD is a failure of our healing mechanisms. I think that the relapses and cycles are the healing mechanisms trying again. I think the processes of PTSD need to be helped along, not shut down (which is why deliberately remembering things is a treatment for flashbacks). Ive been playing Russian roulette in this way for ten years now. I want to believe that I've won, but I won't believe it until some rigor has been applied.
 
Okay, this whole topic causes anxiety in me. Any time someone debates something as one way or another I get tense. I happen to believe that the truth is always somewhere down the middle. You will always find people on one side of the fence or another and always being able to find some "proof" of what they believe. That being said, I am always skeptical of everything. Proof or not. But that is just me.

Now, my last in patient, I did have a sociologist who showed me brain scans of someone who was depressed compared to someone that isn't depressed. In some way I found that comforting, especially after growing up with the message that it is all in my head, get over it. He had something tangible that I could get my head around.

Some patients were very big on finding out what they were "diagnosed" with. I less so. For one thing I don't like labels. But, for another and this is the major thing, I don't care what the diagnosis is, just help fix me or send me in the right direction. The diagnosis name means nothing to me. How are we going to deal with the issues at hand. So I never asked. For one thing I knew I was depressed and suicidal. Giving a name to it wasn't going to help me.

I'm cautious about what meds I am given and what help. I am definitely skeptical. I think this helps me retain some control.

I sincerely hope that I haven't offended anyone.
 
Therapy bankrupt, I was on meds for 7 years, without therapy. Had some minor bouts of depression during then but nothing that I couldn't handle and I really didn't think I needed therapy because I felt talked out.

This year I crashed horribly, very near suicide. They told me that my med stopped working and it was known to do that in some patients. It was a horribly dark time. I am somewhat stable, but we are still working on the new meds and I am back in therapy.

Sometimes starting over is all we can do.
 
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