ED Muscle pain & Eating - restricted calorie intake

[blackemerald1]

seroquel potentially just isn’t as effective for me now as it was.

^This is what happened to me with my use of Seroquel. I was on similar doses that you described.

Along with side effects, some of which you have described within your first post, and liver function not normal etc. Seroquel didn't keep working effectively. Not like when I began it. I continued to plateau as I climbed higher and higher trying to keep well.

there’s a real itch to taper off my seroquel completely atm, just to retest how I am now without it in my system.

^I also understand this. Please make sure you psych is not going anywhere and you have a place for admission if things start to go wrong. Seroquel was extremely difficult for me to withdraw from. I wish you the best if or when you do start this process. It does take a while.

 

[lostforgottensoul]

Yes - generally, extended release formulations will 'peak' twice in a cycle. It's not that easy to notice, if you're on a lower dose of something.

I don't notice it. I'm on 200mg Seriquel XR. I take it at 6pm and never notice a thing. It's like taking tylonol where I have no idea I even took anything. Except my anxiety and emotions has died down a ton. I do get a tad bit sleepy mid day at times. Is that maybe that peak?

@Sideways, are you on Seriquel XR (ER) or IR? I couldn't gather from up reading. IR is insane and I couldn't take it. It had me drooling on myseld inside of 30 mins. But, it took forever for me to get used to the XR (ER). I have a thread in here somewhere of JL cheering me on as I was fast to want to stop it.

We tirated as slow as possible. Going up 50mg at a time. So, first a 50mg, then 100mg then three 50mg = 150mg then the 200mg. Three months apart I believe since I only see my PDoc every 3 months but would have to check the thread. We did go to 250mg but had her move it back down to 200mg as I was sleepy and 250mg just seemed like too much and I was right. 200mg seems to be perfect.

Been on Serquiel XR 200 mg for about 2 yrs now. Ish. And today I have no idea that I just took anything. All I notice is much lower anxiety and much less hightened emotions but not much else. It does get you a massive sugar craving and that has finally died down but that took a good year to die down.

Sorry you are having a rough go at it!

 

[The Albatross]

At some point one has to examine the how or why we/you/I develop a capacity for grabbing the empty calorie. I suggest you take a hard look at it.

 

[blackemerald1]

one has to examine the how or why we/you/I develop a capacity for grabbing the empty calorie.

Hey @The Albatross - taking a hard look at diet when it comes to Seroquel does absolutely nothing. It messes with things metabolic and frankly you can eat next to nothing and still gain weight. It's fairly well recognised for doing that now.

What do you mean... I just don't understand what do you mean?

 

[Justmehere]

Food, weight, diet, trouble with meds - any one of these issues can be tough for a lot of people to face. I think you are handling this with a lot of solid insight and courage @Sideways.

Weight gain from meds is really tough. There is one med that does me in, even when it doesn’t affect most at that level I took it. Works well for me when most meds cause bad allergic reactions, but not being able to eat enough to fuel my body through my day got really hard really fast.

I know the GP is too much, what about visiting with a dietitian again? They are unlikely to hospitalize quickly and may have some great advice about how to not run into nutritional imbalances. There was a time I was so anxious I stopped eating much. I wasn’t trying to lose weight... but by accident I became anorexic. Dietitian helped me figure out low to no prep meals and shakes I could down.

Meal prep kits are actually kinda fun for me when I’m depressed I don’t want to eat or cook. That might be a great way to go to replace some of the shakes.

For muscle aches, amino acid or trace mineral supplements might be worth trying. That can get expensive, so I wouldn’t try it unless the blood levels fail to point to another clear problem.

As far as the lack of clarity as to if this is an eating disorder or not... One can be anorexic and obese. ED can be caused by a lot of things, legit concerns about weight gain from meds being one of them. One can get anorexic because of meds too, or as side effects of treatment for medical and mental health conditions like chemo... They all have different solutions and steps to take to remedy. There isn’t a one size fits all ED. I think because of the family history, you have a lot of pushback around calling this an eating disorder. If the label will help you look at everything comprehensively and is a tool to get healthier, then use it. If it shuts you down from solutions because of comparing yourself to your sister, then don’t worry about the label. There’s no reason to be ashamed of the battle with good and weight. Hits a lot of us dealing with PTSD and mental health differently.

I hope the body aches get better soon.

 

[Sideways]

Thank you guys for the support. It’s really easy to use advice to get angry at myself. I’m definitely not going to start guessing what possible nutrients might be low without a blood test. The bananas have gone okay, and if my migraine lets up today I’m going to slip into the grocery store briefly and get some baked beans and see if I can add them.

@lostforgottensoul - I remember that thread. I followed along, because my personal seroquel journey has been a long one. I’m thinking that I’m reaching where @blackemerald1 got to, which is after almost 10 years of on/off, up/down, instant/extended - I think maybe seroquel just isn’t the answer anymore.

It won’t be a quick process to titrate off it - the XR’s smallest dose is 50mg, and it can’t be cut up. So I’m just going to have to be patient, boost the eating when I can.

@Justmehere - I was under the impression that now that eating disorders have been reorganised in the DSM 5 it’s a lot easier to be diagnosed even without weight loss. I’m trying to just reassure myself that it’s good to be aware of the potential for an ED issue developing (especially if not eating much becomes a long term norm), but if that does become part of my pathology? Right now I don’t think I’d want to be told - I don’t think my headspace could take that on right now.

@The Albatross - my understanding of ‘empty calories’ is calories that aren’t carrying any nutritional value. Atm, everything I put in my mouth is pretty chock full of nutrition, so I’m not sure what you’re getting at. Certainly eating for the sake of it? Doesn’t make it into the top 10 of my most urgent priorities right now...??? Some people enjoy that. I currently don’t, and I’m okay with that.

Getting nutrition on the other hand? Is a priority. Which I think is a good thing.

 

[Justmehere]

I’m trying to just reassure myself that it’s good to be aware of the potential for an ED issue developing (especially if not eating much becomes a long term norm)...

I think you have the right mindset about it. :)

 

[The Albatross]

taking a hard look at diet when it comes to Seroquel does absolutely nothing. It messes with things metabolic and frankly you can eat next to nothing and still gain weight. It's fairly well recognised for doing that now.

I mean that irrespective of med side effects or disordered eating limitations... that the remedy is WHOLE food nutrition. Sideways herself said earlier on that the liquid supplementation was okayed WITH vegetables. She did and has not done so. The physical complaints re: muscle pains are likely a result of that. Longer term effects of that habit/behavior can include further medical complications. Straight up. Sideways has already concluded (above) that her opening post complaint isn't in her top 10. So, I can't see much more to discuss.

 

[lostforgottensoul]

Sideways has already concluded (above) that her opening post complaint isn't in her top 10. So, I can't see much more to discus

Actually she stated that eating for the sake of eating doesn't make it to her top 10.

Certainly eating for the sake of it? Doesn’t make it into the top 10 of my most urgent priorities right now...??? Some people enjoy that. I currently don’t, a

And then her opening post said:

I don’t have an eating disorder, I just don’t particularly like eating or get hungry, and I hate grocery stores. So not eating food works for me lifestyle wise

Which, to me, says the exact same thing. So not sure where she has countered her opening post.

Not meaning to argue. Just literally confused.

My advice @Sideways, from someone that has been there is to start small and work your way up. So, a cup of veggies and maybe a scoop of peanut butter. Good source of protien. So, just start adding very small tid bits of food here or there with the shake. And, if you are like me that forgot to eat and remembered at 3 in the morning that you forgot to eat all day, I set an alarm and ate when the alarm went off. I picked different things that I already did everyday at differenting times and ate at those times or right before. I still struggle with days off of work but I have done pretty good at making it habit to eat at certian times in the day. It don't need the alarm anymore.

I stopped worrying about eating whole foods or even really healthy. I just wanted to eat period. Trying to figure out how to afford healthy foods and whole foods, how to figure out how to fit it in the day, and how to prepare it, and how to take it with when Chopper and I were out all day. It just became way stressful and made the not eating much way worse. So, I focused on just eating. And started small and worked my way up. Obviously eating healthy foods is better but if that causes stress, it's just gonna make the issue worse.

Now that I am eating on a regular basis and have made eating into a habit, now I am learning how to make that healthier. And how to afford healthier options. But, I had to make eating habit first, if that makes sense.

Hopefully that helps!

 

[Sideways]

So, a cup of veggies and maybe a scoop of peanut butter.

Idk, but I think this whole adding peanut butter to everything must be one of those weird things that Americans do!

The baked beans was too hard. Which is a bummer because that’s the equivalent fibre of 2 serves of veges. But that’s not reason to give up. Just maybe try something easier. Friday reminded me of V8 juice earlier in the thread, and I can do that. I’m sure I can do that. And that would meet the 2 serves of veges requirements that the shakes recommend.

My pdoc (and so the blood test) are still a ways away, but I think as long as I keep the balance between pushing for positive changes, and not pushing too hard, I’ll be okay till then. Because the situation is clearly more complex than ‘eat more’.

Fortunately I was institutionalised long enough that I learned to eat and take meds by the clock! So I still do my meals at hospital times: 7am, midday, and 5pm, just out of pure habit!

 

[Sideways]

I don’t know if it’s too soon to tell, or if it’s just coincidence, but about a week of having a banana every day and my muscle pain is massively reduced.

Reduced to the point that it wouldn’t be something I’d bother talking to a doctor about.

I know that there was some science article I read once about why bananas are a super-food, so I’m biased and this is potentially all just placebo? But definitely the last 2 days it’s been heaps better.

Yay!

 

[lostforgottensoul]

I don’t know if it’s too soon to tell, or if it’s just coincidence, but about a week of having a banana every day and my muscle pain is massively reduced.

Potassium has been known to help muscle cramping like charlie horses. I believe you have to be low in potassium to gain any benefit from it. But either way, yay!