My therapist’s reaction to a timeline really hurt

[scout86]

First, personally, the times I've most felt like quitting are the times it's the worst idea. That might not apply to this situation, but maybe it does.

As are as "sitting with" stuff (one of the popular terms I really hate) goes, sometimes just sitting with "I have no idea what's going on here!" is plenty. I can't imagine "sitting with shame". Well, I guess I can. I just can't imagine it as a good thing. Because the way I understand it, "shame" isn't the best feeling to go with in these situations and it makes more sense, to me, to come up with a better way to look at things.

I don’t understand why we can’t have the conversation

Are you sure you can't? What would happen if you copied that post into an email and sent it to her?

I'd kind of hate to see you give up on this. Mostly because I'm sure it somehow makes sense to her and I'm really curious about how that works. So far, I don't get it, but that doesn't mean it doesn't make sense to her.

 

[Tinyflame]

don’t understand why we can’t have the conversation..

She commented how much people in her profession haven’t handled it well and yet... it’s like the normal conversation about trauma is off limits with her too and it’s just such a cluster.

I've been thinking about this. How generally speaking most of us try to untangle the past, and to understand and limit how it affects the present (and thus future).

But how, at best progress is rarely linear. And the truth is, many problems are quite intractable.

But what is apart from all of this, in all realms, is the relationship itself. And when one person does not reach out, or both do not; and worse, after reaching out the other turns away, or both eventually do, well- that says much. And therein lies either the disconnect or choice. Whether it's a 'therapeutic alliance', family, spouse. friend or any other.

 

[Justmehere]

I have therapy later today.

I’ve been fighting depression and suicidal thoughts for about two months trying to work through this trauma... and this crap about the timeline hasn’t helped a lot. I have made multiple attempts to talk about it all in therapy. To the sense of hopelessness and despair, get a repeated response of “that’s great” and “you are feeling your feelings” and that this is the path through.

Okay. Fine.

I have tried multiple times telling my therapist that while I get it on this, hearing “oh how wonderful” to “I’m in pain” freaking hurts even more. Stop it. It’s not working. I feel my feelings. Point made.

It doesn’t resolve anything. It continues. The thought of therapy right now where I have to hear more of that.... I want to scream. Trying to address this pain about the timeline... I mean how about an iota of empathy for anything?

I’m trying to stick with my appointment today and tell her that it’s off limits to tell me “it’s great” in response to my stating I’m in pain. She does it again, I’m walking out. I don’t know about rescheduling or not. I just know I can’t continue to hear it today. If I sat thoigh it again, and didn’t walk out, I’m afraid I would really scream.

Finding a new therapist isn’t something I’m interested in or have the heart to do at this time.

I want one session where feeling pain isn’t celebrated. One. And if she can’t provide that....

I am almost tempted to buy balloons and bring them and hand them and say, let’s throw a party because yeah, I’m still so depressed I don’t want to breathe anymore. Should we light some candles too and celebrate how much I want to die?! I know she doesn’t mean it this way... but it’s not coming across in any good way, but celebrating that I suffer so bad I want to stop breathing. Maybe props would get my point across?!

I feel anger and so much shame. I don’t know if I can face her. I know I should. Just for today. My mind is sinking trying to think of doing this.

 

[Tinyflame]

@Justmehere hang in there, emotions come from thoughts, and while all emotions might have a place, your anger frustration and fear and despair as well, remember she has empathy for you, and you can come to an empathy or compassion for yourself.

As opposed to having to justify what you feel, or feel more of the same, maybe think of what you need emotionally, and if you can say that. Or rather how you are left feeling by her words and actions, just period. The value is more than defining it, but getting a sense if she gets it, or can, or will. You need to feel safe to tackle those thoughts and emotions, or to disclose. Feeling it isn't the problem, naming it not necessarily, knowing what 'thoughts' (on paper) to replace it with not the problem. Looking at it with compassion might be. Including compassion for yourself that she might not seem to 'get it'.

Good luck. :hug:

 

[Tinyflame]

@Justmehere ,I hope it went ok, there was something else I thought of (hope I can find the words to explain it correctly), and might explain why it isn't making sense (except to your T).

It is my understanding that the timeline refers less to over-all scope than it does to trying to get individual memories more flushed out, to create a more integrated memory of a happening: that is, the reason the brain keeps going over and over it with intrusive thoughts, FB's and nightmares etc, is because unlike a regular memory it's in bits and pieces, jumbled order, and even blank spots, and the like. It doesn't seem (to us) that it is in terms of the overall memory, but the narrative we've been relying on is in actuality. So eventually talking about it adds pieces, different perspectives perhaps, context, etc. Re-writes it in to a form that not only the brain can accept and thus not keep returning to but enables us to see it differently, and be able to distinguish triggers from the present moment more capably. To learn and accomplish that is a process.

So maybe your T is seeing more where it is leading, than you know right now?

 

[Justmehere]

I went. I thought about what you all said, especially @scout86 and @Junebug.

I blurted out that I need “less invalidation or I can’t do this.”

My therapist validated that. She actually said she sometimes isn’t the best at validation, and said she knows it’s like basic therapy skills (her words), and yet sometimes she sucks at it. I’m not the only one who has said it to her. She said she can go some places some other therapists can’t (which is why I see her) but sometimes she totally drops the ball on that. She asked me to tell her when it happens and I told her I have been!

We spent a lot of time talking about why invalidation bugs me so much. She was pretty upfront she isn’t the best at the opposite, validation. She talked about what she is good at - and she is super good at it.

We also talked about the sucidal thoughts and depression, and she didn’t say it was great. She said that the work I’m doing with shame is movement in the right direction and that she knows that knowing this fact doesn’t help one bit. Then we talked through how she plans to help me untangle shame, anger, depression, etc.

She wanted to talk about how hurt I feel about her reaction to the timeline and etc, but I couldn’t quite talk about the timeline itself. I could talk about how I felt though.

It reminds me of my mother. A bear could be actively mauling me and my mother would reply, “why are you even crying? Everything is fine.”

My mind is in such a dark place, I’m not sure how to process it or what to do with it.

 

[scout86]

I reminds me of my mother.

You know how sometimes, when someone is in the middle of something, things look completely different to them, on the inside, than they look from elsewhere? From here, it looks like that might be happening to you.

I don't remember all the details you've shared about your mother. (Mostly likely haven't read them all, even if I COULD remember them.) But, my take away is she wasn't in line for mother of the year at any point. I know it freaks me out if I ever remind myself of my mother....... But, from here? You aren't saying everything is fine. You're acknowledging issues as best you're able and doing what you can to address them. Nothing at all like the way you just described your mother.

I'm not saying you're wrong, just that it doesn't look like that from here.

Something that seems to be a fact is that this stuff is REALLY hard to talk about and really hard to sort out. Especially for the person in the middle of it. The person in your position at the moment. Sometimes there's things that make talking about it seem like a bad idea. Even if those things aren't clearly formed in your brain. And, sometimes maybe you don't have the vocabulary. (My T has suggested that might be because you didn't have the vocabulary at the time. So the thoughts and memories exist as poorly organized feelings, not words. That makes them hard to express, but no less powerful.)

That session sounds like a step in the right direction, to me. Which is the way this goes, right? One step at a time? Baby steps even? You set the bar pretty high for yourself, you know. I don't think people are usually good at noticing that. It's another one of those things where I find it helps to hear it from someone else. I hope you don't mind hearing it from me!

 

[Tinyflame]

Yes @Justmehere , good you could do that, and she sounds receptive.

As I understand it filling in around the (past) narratives will make it easier to know now it's not a bear and mauling , and reduce some of the hypervigilance/ fear etc. over time.

 

[hithere]

I
I don’t much care if it’s complicated or not. I think it’s hitting me how badly I wanted someone there, in it, with me. I don’t care if my case if it’s rocket science level complicated. Can’t someone be with me in it? Why am I missing the connection?

@Justmehere I'm just now reading through this thread and stopped here on this quote of yours--"can't someone be with me in it" -- I can't tell you how much this is my situation... over and over and over. I am concluding that this is not possible for me. I just wanted to somehow validate your experience and I know first hand how painful it is and how confusing and frustrating... I don't understand why someone can't "listen" and can't "be there" but must interupt or want to "lighten the mood".... it's just so painful

 

[Tinyflame]

I'm wondering @hithere if that's because we're not really 'there'? Like @Justmehere said, it reminded her of her mother. (We bring forward to the present what is past)? The emotions suit the past better than the present (moment).

I feel that all the time, the endless 'background' movie trailer, playing in the background in my mind and heart. :(

 

[Justmehere]

@hithere - I get ya.

The hard thing is that one of my therapist’s fortes is transference. This is a complicated one.

This all started when she was trying to figure out why I shut her out. I tried to take down my walls by sharing this timeline only to find she was kinda weirded out and struggles to validate anyhow. She even commented on how many people - trained pros - couldn’t even try to sit with me in it. They all skipped over it even when they knew.

She did hear me on the pain of that. She said it hit her hard too.

So. Yeah. Ok. Now what?

I do like that she has a plan, and that she’s willing to own what’s not her forte, and willing to try.

But damn. There is something so painful about that distance when it comes from the other person that they can’t be there in it. I mean. I get it. Not everyone can do it. Still hurts. Makes me kinda more pissed that I have to do it.

And wow, the shame it stirs up...

 

[Tinyflame]

She even commented on how many people - trained pros - couldn’t even try to sit with me in it. They all skipped over it even when they knew.

I don't get this. I'm no shrink or T, and even for me, very little shocks me or for long. I don't understand why they can't, and I'm sorry. :(

I think though it's something different from transference. Maybe a subtle difference, but just because it reminds of the past, does not in itself to me means it's re-enacting it. Or if it is, it would be in trying to understand within the present context the same issue that was unresolved in past ones. Different players, but same questions.

I think communication means very little if not voiced. You have said you don't know how to make it any clearer, but she has not seemed to make her views any clearer, herself. I think that is a fundamental flaw in her reasoning, to expect you will feel secure. At least she should say, let's both keep going and see where it leads.

I don't believe you should feel shame because she, or anyone else, can't sit with it. Surviving it doesn't make it easier than hearing it.