PTSD and my body: Does anyone else experience PTSD as more of a physical than a mental thing?

[edward333]

Hi everybody. I've been working on PTSD recovery for 15+ years. My recovery really turned a corner a couple years ago after I discovered embodied approaches like trauma sensitive yoga. Still a long way to go but I'm glad to be making progress finally.

I am looking for others who experience their PTSD as more of a physical thing than a mental health thing. I have extreme startle response and dissociation, for example, but the real drama of my PTSD plays out in my pelvis, shoulders, and gut.

The introduction to Overcoming Trauma through Yoga (book by David Emerson and Elizabeth Hopper; intro by Bessel van der Kolk) says it perfectly IMO: "The most profound legacy of trauma may be this timeless feeling of being battered by unbearable physical sensations: crushing feelings in your chest, agonizing tension in your shoulders, and burning pain in your abdomen, accompanied by the conviction that you are utterly helpless to do anything about it. The body, instead of being an ally on one’s road to recovery, becomes the enemy."

When I read that passage I was blown away, because it described my physical symptoms so well and so prominently. Meanwhile over my 15 years of talking with doctors, therapists, etc., about my PTSD diagnosis, it has always seemed to me that no one understands my physical symptoms and instead we approach everything through more psychologically traditional PTSD symptoms (irritability, numbness, startle response, etc.) So after 15 years of feeling like I was quite atypical, I see in the above passage that perhaps crushed chest and frozen pelvis/shoulder are way more common in PTSD than I thought.

If you also identify with that quoted passage, I would love to hear from you. Thanks!

 

[Freida]

yepper! My doc and T have both said that my fibromyalgia is directly related to my ptsd - which hopefully means that as I conquer one the other will diminish. I also get random pain depending on what thing I'm working on - espeically during EMDR. And I've had back spasms for years with no reasonable explanation...well, until now!.

 

[shimmerz]

I had no idea that the reason I used to be able to play tennis for 3 hours or more in 90+ degree weather meant something. It did. I haven't been attached to my body all of my life.

I can't do yoga yet. I do Feldenkrais. I just found out about it a couple of months ago. It is literally rewiring my brain so that I am conscious of my body and its movements.

It is helping beyond words. I had NO idea that embodiment was so important. And who knew that I had a body but had no attachment to it! Never would have guessed.

 

[Justmehere]

Somatic experiencing therapy is helping me become friends with my body again, and work through some of the physical components.

When I’m most checked out, I’m klutzy but can endure tough sports wayyyy too easily!

 

[edward333]

yepper! My doc and T have both said that my fibromyalgia is directly related to my ptsd - which hopefully means that as I conquer one the other will diminish.

Hi @Freida , how is that going for you so far? I have found this to be somewhat of a one-way street. My body has not responded to talk therapy or EMDR ("top-down") even when they feel helpful emotionally. I am making progress with "bottom-up." With trauma sensitive yoga I am finding first that my body feels much more present and then as a result my state of mind becomes more at ease.

I had NO idea that embodiment was so important. And who knew that I had a body but had no attachment to it! Never would have guessed.

Thanks, @shimmerz . How did you finally come to your view of embodiment? It sounds like you were not looking at your condition that way for a long time.

Somatic experiencing therapy is helping me become friends with my body again, and work through some of the physical components.

Thanks @Justmehere . I am curious to hear more about somatic experiencing therapy. I have In an Unspoken Voice and Awakening the Tiger by Peter Levine. From those books I'm not very clear what is the therapy exactly. Could you please describe it? Thanks a lot

 

[Friday]

Both ends meeting the middle.

My response is overwhelmingly physical. I have to meet that, to be able to come at the mental/emotional.

I think that’s part of why exposure therapy has been so damn effective / actually freaking works. Getting my physiological symptoms in hand, and under control, let’s me start coming at the core stuff... which is what’s driving the physiological stuff.

So it’s dealing with the physical to get to the mental to get to the physical.

 

[Freida]

how is that going for you so far?

It's not so much that my body is responding to the emdr, as that as I process memories the areas that I held pain in have loosened up. It took a while before I started seeing results because I have to work through the entire memory to get the physical part that was attached to it to break loose. If that makes sense?

I do yoga and pilates (the very basic kind) at home and that helps with the pain also. I tried the trauma senstive yoga but dropped out of the class because it was horribly triggering. No idea why, but I had panic attacks that were so bad my service dog had to lay on me -- and that NEVER happens to me. Oh and I go into an equine therapy program .....while it isn't designed for body work it does make me very relaxed, which reduces the pain

 

[whiteraven]

This is so timely for me. I've been in an immense amount of pain the last 6 months or more and I am pretty sure it is related to all the emotional stuff going on. The last month or so I've also had breathing issues - I have a lot of trouble taking deep breaths.

When I started going back to my massage therapist, she said my back - midback - was so tight and bunched up she could see it without even touching me. I think I try to follow my doctors' instructions, etc...but nobody seems to connect my symptoms with stress. I know, for example, that the pain I have in my chest is related to the tightness all over. It is directly connected to my neck pain. I've had the EKG and echo and all the blood work and still my doctor wouldn't even talk to me about it the last time I had an episode. I called the next day and she sent me to the ER - even though I wasn't having any acute pain and I called her to talk to her about the anxiety and depression.

This kind of treatment - which I and I know others are repeatedly subjected to - makes it really hard to trust doctors.

 

[grit]

I honestly believe (strongly) that the only way to heal the body is through language. If you have trauma enough to cause body pain this severe, you need to stop staying it is just the body not the mind and get it to the mind via language and out by your mouth and your ears!

there is no short cut. The first thing you need to accept is having body trauma is just as bad as having mental trauma and those that end up having more mental trauma because they released their body pain, are a bit closer to the healing than the guy sitting in the corner saying nah! I do not have mental I have body trauma.

I have been there and done that.

PS. if you ever get braces as an adult, the first area that gets straightened is the front teeth what takes forever is the back and the profile. Trauma is similar, the minute you take actions, a lot of body symptoms are released and relieved but I am not gonna lie to , it does get much harder when it goes to the mind and then the real work starts.

Good luck. and thank goodness you notice this now.

 

[edward333]

Thanks @Freida and @whiteraven .

It took a while before I started seeing results because I have to work through the entire memory to get the physical part that was attached to it to break loose.

Yes, Freida, I think I understand. My experience with EMDR was positive in many respects, but my main complaint going in was physical, and after 6 years of weekly sessions my physical symptoms weren't really any better. On a related note, I've heard van der Kolk say that EMDR has been proven effective for PTSD related to a specific traumatic event, but it hasn't shown results for developmental PTSD, which is my situation.

I think I try to follow my doctors' instructions, etc...but nobody seems to connect my symptoms with stress. This kind of treatment - which I and I know others are repeatedly subjected to - makes it really hard to trust doctors.

Whiteraven that sounds really frustrating! I can identify. My PCP is a caring guy, and he supports my various PTSD treatments, but he is seemingly unable to accept my medical symptoms through the lens of PTSD. He prefers instead to be "baffled" and to recommend a variety of costly tests that invariably come back negative. I have relied on him less and less for advice and more and more as an authorized signatory who helps me get some insurance coverage for the PTSD treatments that I ask for.

That said, I have new-found trust in doctors. I ended up in the hospital this year for a week and I would have died of kidney failure without doctors. I think the root cause of my kidney failure is/was PTSD-related. ( I stopped peeing.) I made a big point of including PTSD in my medical history every time I met a new doctor in the hospital (a lot of doctors). I give them a ton of credit for hearing my story and making space in my treatment for PTSD to be part of my process, even if they were not directly able to do anything PTSD-related themselves. It mattered that they held the PTSD part of my story very respectfully. I did not expect that sort of respect going in.

 

[Freida]

but it hasn't shown results for developmental PTSD, which is my situation.

Ahhhh -- yes that does make a huge difference

 

[Friday]

EMDR has been proven effective for PTSD related to a specific traumatic event, but it hasn't shown results for developmental PTSD, which is my situation.

There are new complex-trauma protocols out that have been proven super effective for a lot of people.

That said?

I wonder very much on how lessons learned/cemented IN ongoing trauma but tied to good outcomes, rather than bad, could even be addressed in EMDR. Maybe they can? I’m just simply not sure how, & suspect this is one of those reasons why -to the best of my knowledge-single modalities aren’t often used in trauma, but rather multi-modalities.

As an example... I lose my ever lovin’ mind when I don’t know where all my “stuff” is, can’t find something, or (worst of all) someone has moved my stuff around. :mad:

I know exactly where this comes from. Years and years of needing absolutely everything in my pack/ on my body/ in my vehicle, in easy reach, not only for the sake of my life but the lives of those around me. It really doesn’t matter what’s IN my mental inventory. From full auto rifles to a pocket knife, 2 aspirin to a complete surgical kit, a house full of living to the pack on my shoulders. I know what’s in it, what condition it’s it, and where it is. Or I freak the f*ck out. Panic attacks, flashbacks, decompemsating like a motherf*cker.

I’ve got a wide swath of wiggle room (to my way of thinking), that accounts for life happening.

Spoiler: Example

I have kids. My home? Is rarely hotel-perfect. That’s part of the joy of kids, and I really do revel in everything except for stepping on a lego barefoot. Making messes is fun. Do I know where everything is at every second? Pfft. Nor do I care. It’s in the house, generally speaking, and all but 3 messes will be cleaned up by bedtime (I think it’s important to allow chosen projects to be left out to be worked on / played with later, and to learn to prioritize ... A & B are in a state of mid-play, and that’s fine, C is going to be a lot of work & not really manageable by bedtime, so, sure, C can stay out and be done tommorrow). That’s enough for me, to center my well-being. It’s “in the house...somewhere”. AND it has a home. Inventories are of things that are meant to be used. Using them doesn’t mess with my sense of Wah.

So I’m okay with my wiggle room. What I’m not okay with is the bolt of lightning that shoots through me when I suddenly don’t know where something is, or upon finding someone messing with/ moving my stuff... &/or ....the ensuing dysreg that happens.

The spike alone is bad enough. The completely useless overgrown childish tantrum? Buffeted by flashbacks extolling the terrible consequences (that don’t exist anymore), panic attacks, and... f*ck that noise. There is no reason on gods green earth to be losing my shit over stuff and nonsense. Nor to be shoving a thundercloud of pissed the f*ck off, suckin it up, down my throat 12 times a day -now in the BEST of moods- over what amounts essentially to bullshit. So what I don’t know where my shit is? No reason to.... :mad: Aargh.

How does one EMDR something that was drilled into you thousands of times, over years and years, in countless situations and circumstance?

I don’t think you can.

But maybe I’m wrong.

Because it makes sense that if you can work on emotional monitoring & regulation / grounding / etc. limiting the effect & consequence of the panic attacks, anxiety attacks, flashbacks ...from one side... reducing the amount of ammunition my brain has to throw at me by parsing what it’s choosing to throw at me? IE the content of the flashbacks, etc. Seems like it would be infinitely more effective than doing only one or the other?