Rant on diagnosing others

[DharmaGirl]

I was on another PTSD site, and amazingly, almost every one of the posters had a narcissist in their life. What gives? Are there that many people diagnosed with narcissistic personality disorder that it's the new PTSD? I realize that the only people diagnosing these other people are uneducated google searchers, and I don't mean that as name calling. An abusive ex-friend of mine would diagnose people with narcissistic personality disorder at an alarming rate. When I asked her she said all you have to do is look it up on google, and the list is right there. You don't need to go to college to be able to diagnose.

I once asked on a facebook page, how people knew that all of their abusers were narcissists, since that is a terrible way to label someone, and abuser works just as well, and over 100 people called me a narcissist for saying that. Huh? I responded by saying the only one who can make a diagnosis is a psychiatrist or psychologist, with the education and training and exposure to the person to make a clear diagnosis. I then became a victim blamer. I was really freaked at the time because I was serious about labeling someone with a personality disorder. In the psych classes and rotations I had in nursing school, I was told that those diagnoses of personality disorders were often not made, since it was a label that would stick forever. Then, someone on the site claiming to be a mental health professional said that all those people were narcissists. Ok, if you were a mental health professional, you wouldn't do that.

The point to all this is that I've seen the word used here instead of abuser, and I really don't think any lay person has the right to diagnose someone else with a personality disorder. It drives me nuts! (That's why the rant) It's as bad as the people who claim to have PTSD from a breakup, or the new thing has become having C-PTSD from a hard childhood. A lot of people on another website seem to believe that you can get that without a trauma, or without having PTSD. I know there is a lot I don't know about many things, but I don't claim to know it. Yikes!

 

[Freida]

I get this...and I think its somewhere between the new trendy thing and better diagnosis

I even saw an article saying you cant succeed in business unless you are a narcissist! But as I understand it a narcissist doesn't know they are a narcissist....and even when they are diagnosed they dont care. I think that is why they are such wrecking balls.

I wonder if people use that label because it's how they can explain how brutal people are? they can say there is a reason behind it because the person is a ...insert word here...?

 

[somerandomguy]

I have to wonder how many abusers ARE narcissists, though. Getting my abuser to admit she was ever wrong was like trying to push a skyscraper down with your bare hands. And when she did admit it, she didn't care and wasn't sorry at all. She was never sorry for anything.

In the end it makes no difference whether she was or not. I'll never have anything to do with her ever again, so I don't actually care.

 

[DharmaGirl]

Yes, but it's like saying you have PTSD when you don't, to explain your pain. Or when you say your physical pain level is a 14 out of 10. The last one will label you as a drug seeker, the other will make you a liar. I understand what they are trying to present, but they are being abusive by labeling someone with a personality disorder to explain their illness. It's like me calling everyone who abused me a pedophile, even when I was abused as an adult. It takes a really horrid personality disorder and uses it instead of abuser. You can suffer horrible abuse from someone who isn't a "narc", see, it even has a nickname. When you are hit by a truck, you don't say you were hit by a plane because it justifies your pain. It's blurring the lines between what is and what someone wants it to be.

I don't agree that you have to be a narcissist to succeed in business. You may have some of, repeat some of the qualities of a narcissist, but not be one. I guess I will have to stop caring or always be annoyed at the people doing this, since it seem ok to diagnose others with a mental illness of one's choice.

@somerandomguy, not admitting you are wrong is not something only a narcissist does. That's the point. Just because someone has nightmares does not give them PTSD. I just read over the DSM 5 on personality disorders and could find parts of my behaviors in all of them. Not all of my behaviors are in any one, but if you do the same, you will probably see yourself in some too. That's normal.

 

[Sideways]

What irritates me about it is the stigma it creates around NPD.

Not all people diagnosed with NPD are abusive. I’ve met one of those. All I can say is I hope he steers clear of social media and forums like these. It disappoints me in a way - you’d think that people with a diagnosed mental health condition would be keen to not perpetuate stigma about other disorders.

 

[Friday]

Hallelujah.

From observation I think it’s mostly ignorance (that word doesn’t mean what you think it means) &/or low self esteem; not having the balls to declare someone selfish, self centered, vain, arrogant, etc. but hiding behind the skirts of someone else -in authority!- having found that person to be what you think of them ...and are too afraid to say.

I feel infinitely sorry for people actually dealing with these disorders, and how difficult an already hard situation is made by being steeped in misinformation and timidity.

 

[Ronin]

I was about to say: Likely because psychopath is kind of hard to spell, but then I realized oy vey, narcissist is the same spelling wise and those people do not have that much issue with it :facepalm:

But, yep, totally with you (and most previous posters.)
Being selfish does not narcissistic traits make, and not even narcissist traits make for a narcissist.
Besides, not even actual correct diagnosis tells all that much about why a particular prick is a prick their way, instead of another way. That is just them. Boringly not unique, but specific.

 

[Friday]

Likely because psychopath is kind of hard to spell,

:hilarious: OMFG. So true.

 

[Powder]

It's helpful to identify patterns of behavior that I have previously had too high a tolerance for and no longer desire to put up with in adults. I don't need to diagnose the person, but if the behavior fits a "type" then maybe having a label can ease communication with my closest friends to discuss things with. But there's always a line between observation as an interest in understanding and actual diagnosis.

I was upset by someone who assumed that their casual assumptions are as good as and better then a real DX. This is just shoddy thinking and communication. Period. It's really not helpful. In fact, it's harmful if it has led them to avoid dealing with the real problem. It keeps them stuck in their own little bubble.

Real growth seems to be a challenge, even when the correct professional help is actually sought out. How can guessing serve?

 

[EveHarrington]

Uhm, I hope you do realize that NPD’s don’t have exclusive rights to the term narcissist, narcissism, and any variation of this word outside of the term “narcissistic personality disorder”......right?

So unless someone says “so and so has NPD”, ie spelling out the full disorder, they aren’t necessarily diagnosing, rather making the observation that someone is overly preoccupied with themselves.

 

[somerandomguy]

Eve is quite right - there were narcissists long before it was considered to be a disorder (including Narcissus, the original narcissist). I think you're judging others very harshly if you think they're constantly diagnosing people instead of describing them.

 

[Friday]

there were narcissists long before it was considered to be a disorder

Uhm, I hope you do realize that NPD’s don’t have exclusive rights to the term narcissist, narcissism, and any variation of this word outside of the term “narcissistic personality disorder”......right?

Narcissist = NPD
NarcissisTIC = having some -but not all- traits associated with narcissism

A person can be narcissistic without coming anywhere near close the definition of being a narcissist.

I realize it can get confusing, largely because like psycho/psychopath people use the words interchangeably as derogative slang, but unless you’re okay with “That line at the theatre totally gave me PTSD!” knowing the medical definitions of diagnostic terms is worthwhile.

- If you’re saying someone IS a narcissist, you’re saying they have NPD.
- If you’re saying someone is narcissistic, you’re saying they’re an undisclosed number & type of narcissistic traits.
(Ditto psycho/psychopath under the old axis, or psychopath/ASPD under the new lines)

Unless you reeeeally wanna argue using the definitions from 200-2,000 years ago; in which case I have Soldiers Heart, but you’re just Hysterical.