Ruminate Out Loud

[YellowBird]

Is ruminating out loud a typical symptom of PTSD? By ruminate I mean re-playing or re-speaking your side of a stressful conversation that took place previously, but you are re-stating it out loud when the other person isn't there to respond. It is like uncontrolled thinking out loud. I have not seen this particular symptom mentioned anywhere. Where can I find information about it and is there a more clinical descripton of this symptom? I do not mean halluncinating. Thanks.

 

[leightymae]

I don't know of the clinical side of it, or even where to research it, but I do this. Most of the time I do in internally (over and over) but if I'm alone, I will do it out loud. Sometimes I'll go off-script and start changing things I wish I could have changed, but mostly I just stick to what I actually said. I also do this with texting/e-mailing. I will re-read the conversations over and over until they are burned into my brain and then I speak them. I guess I never attributed it to PTSD specifically (given I was just diagnosed, though) but thought it was just a weird personality trait of mine.

Subbing to this thread though to see if anyone else has experience or insight.

 

[disconnect]

I've done this before. A lot of the time, it's saying certain things over and over inside my head and once it's been there a while, I start saying it outloud and getting quite distressed. It's usually during or after a flashback or whilst having panic attack. Do you find this happens whilst you have/before or after a flashback, or at other times?

 

[krillco]

As a clinician who works with children who are survivors of interpersonal trauma, I have on occasion seen children regress into a fantasy-like state where they mumble nonsense words or sing little nonsense songs, but this is when they are in an active stress episode.

IT would stand to reason that if the trauma were interpersonal, then the dialog would be a re-experiencing of the event. That is done out-loud may not be as specific to PTSD as a specific personality style of the individual.

 

[YellowBird]

Wouldn't most trauma be considered interpersonal trauma? Except for maybe a car accident while driving alone and hitting a tree where no other people are involved.

I used to think that flashbacks were like hallucinations. I've been told that near constant ruminations, for lack of a better word, are called emotional flashbacks. When even the slightest event, sound, person, or other reminder makes you think/re-play a past event over and over in your mind, that is a flashback, right? The worse the event memory, the worse the internal tremoring. Sometimes feels like a hotflash and start sweating in addition to the tremor, or feel extremely weak and tired suddenly.

For those that do ruminate out loud, can you control it and make yourself stop talking out loud? Or can you stop it when you become aware of it, but as soon as you get distracted and stop intentionally keeping silent, the words start coming out loud again? Does this come from being alone too much or only from PTSD or other mental illness?

 

[James B.]

I have done it too, a lot. You are not alone Yellowbird.

 

[James B.]

I believe mine is fueled by my anxiety disorder, and it can get worse if I am exposed too long to stressors without an outlet (excersise) . Audibly (spoken aloud) and internally.

Yellowbird, the non-interpersonal trauma krillco may have been referring to might be combat related, etc.

Agree with Krillco to an extent, think mine isn't re-living, but re-processing, almost like an OCD; (perhaps) another (manifestation of) an anxiety disorder (PTSD). My problem with this has gone way down as my anxiety disorder has become somewhat better managed.

Thanks for starting this thread YellowBird, and putting into words something that for me, has been somewhat abstract and ephemeral.

 

[YellowBird]

Thank you all. James B. is exercising the primary way you manage the PTSD? Do you find it difficult to deal with other people without getting too emotional or touchy about stuff that probably shouldn't bother you very much? Every little thing seems to bother me sometimes. What is the primary or best thing you do to manage the stress?

 

[James B.]

Hello again YellowBird - getting emotional and way too touchy about stuff that probably shouldn't bother me was a big problem for many years, as well as ruminating aloud, as discussed above.

Before I was diagnosed or anything, up until age 31, or 32, getting away from overstimulating environments, and getting tons of excersise was the only way I could really manage stress. Obvious problems came with jobs in places where the old coping strategy didn't, or couldn't be used.

Since I have arthrits, and have had major mobility impairment (sciatica) I have had to employ a new system for stress management/managing my anxiety disorder.

Front line for me? My medication (Seroquel) augmented by a strict diet (paleo diet) and getting into an environment (water) where I could get *some* excersise (swimming) several times a week. Walking or jogging would be great too, used to do it, but can't anymore. Going to the gym and buring that tension/anger off used to be great, can't do that stuff no more - arthrits.

For me, "stress reduction" it is a multi-faceted thing that has meant modifying my lifestyle, quitting caffine (coffee) totally and *never* eating junk food Plus managing the adrenaline that comes with muscle tension, muscle use, and anger. For adrenaline management, I use soaking in a hot tub (103 to 105 degrees) and then soaking in cold water, repeating that cycle. It pumps the excess adrenaline out of the system. Taking a cold shower (especially in hot weather) is excellent for cutting down adrenaline/tension too. Try it, you may be pleased with the difference.

Above hot tub stuff is awesome for general tension overload, and arthritis and body pain in general. No question.

Diet = key (for me) Exersise = key (for me).

Thanks again YellowBird for starting this thread, it really helped me. Best wishes and much strength to you on your path to a better, happier life. :-)

Sincerely,
James B.

 

[YellowBird]

Thank you very much for your help James! That is the path I am on, minus the meds. I found I became dependent on them and over time I would slip into a withdrawal-like state if I was late taking the next dose. Seroquel also really messed up my hormones in every aspect, not just weight gain and fatigue. I'm glad it is working for you. I am a little impatient about the length of time it is taking to recover.

 

[James B.]

YellowBird, am glad you mentioned what you did about medication.

All I can say is, am keeping fingers crossed my meds will *continue to work* because my system has had a hard time dealing with any medication at all, ever.

Right now, the 50mg Seroquel XR that I take at night *may be* having a dimishing return, and I am going to see a new doc about strategy on this since, simply increasing and increaing the dose seems like asking for trouble with side effects, or possible rebound effects etc. Its a dicey game, but the stuff has helped. So, basically, darn it, there ya have it.

Really what I wanted to add is this:

My whole deal right now is to, within my physical limitations, make myself in everyway I can, stronger so I can better do the 'heavy lifting' of healing my trauma. Its very hard work, it taxes and stresses my system, no question.

The good thing is, what helps make me more resistant to stress from my anxiety disorder (CPTSD) also seems to be helping me deal with the hard work of my trauma healing too. And addresses the other things like ruminating out loud, etc.

I was excersise dependent for decades. And injuries from over use are a real thing, effecting everyone. Being spontaneous, trying to listen to the body, mixing up an excersise/training program and, most of all, finding physical stuff that is fun to do, can really help over the long haul.

At 52, please just let me say, the cold hard discipline stuff of highly regimented excersise is fine, but it really gets boring and it can really get old. And the longer I have pushed this type of thing, the worse it seemes the backlash or rebound was.

Being creative, doing research, and poking around for ideas from many different physical disciplines has really helped. Am doing yoga type stuff, in the water, for instance, and always looking for ideas, still learning - still a beginner.

Here's an axiom, and it might be applied to Exposure/desensitizing therapy (training) as well. For me this is directly what the exposure therapy of healing my trauma is about, and my diet/physical excersise stuff too. For me, food is a tool, part of my training too, and so:

The goal of training is to make yourself as indestructable as possible. Period.

If what a person's doing results in injury, like the arthrits I got from trying to manage my anxiety disorder with complusive fitness for, oh, 30 years - then its not really working. This goes for overusing *any* part of the body, including the brain, IMHO.

Made many many mistakes over a lifetime. And I sure hope others don't have to go through what I did.

Thanks for letting me share this YellowBird, again, best wishes to you on your path to a much better and much happier life. I really and truely mean it. :-)

Take care,
James B.

 

[James B.]

Wanted to report yesterday I experimented with eating a pack of dates. I consumed some on an emptiy stomach post excersise in the AM.

I became elevated to an uncomfortable level, and my ADHD fully kicked in. Everything else was the same, no additional stressors to speak of.

Finished the pack of dates (sickly sweet gooey like) last night. This AM mood was poor, agitated, and had a fair bit of Ruminating Out Loud (bugs the crap out of me).

Ate eggs for breakfast, took 1/2 (25mg) Seroquel, and went for a walk. Drank water, took cold shower - Ruminating out loud (ROL) symptom and agitation gone.

Wouldn't have needed the Seroquel, I think, but am disabled with injuries to left leg, can't walk far.

FYI