When Your Abuser-parent Is Near The Throws Of Death

[Deleted member 541]

@Recovery4Me On Nov 2, 20 yrs ago, my mother passed away. Before she died, I went to the hospital where she was and when I walked in the room, it had been the first time I had spoken or seen her in about 3 yrs. She had been one of my abusers when I was a child. The reason I hadn't spoken to her nor seen her was because she had suffered a brain aneurysm and had become childlike and nastier than she was before it happened.

I had gone to the hospital to ask for her forgiveness and to tell her that I had forgiven her. She told me she didn't want to discuss it, and just about dismissed me. I left. She died 3 weeks later. I didn't go to the wake or the funeral. It's been 20 yrs and I still haven't felt much of anything. When I go to the gravesite where she, my step dad and my grandparents are all buried, I never pray for her, or talk to her. Mostly just to my grandfather. Weird, I know!!!, I talk to the ground....

It's so hard to know what you are supposed to feel, if anything. Then there is the guilt for not feeling, or the berating of ones self for feeling something.

All I can suggest..... do what is right for you, and not for anyone else, or because it's expected of you. Just do what's right for you....

 

[scout86]

You know what? You could do much worse than Star Trek when choosing a model for a family. (That was always one of my favorite shows!)

“Is forgiving someone in your heart to the best of your ability enough to allow them to pass without tether- be it in self-Guilt, self-Shame, or mental trauma bonding on this plane?”

I've been thinking about what you actually asked here. And I have to consider what my T says, "We all have our own road map of reality. They can be different. They are not all equally accurate. None of them are reality. They are all only road maps."

So, the answer to your question seems like it exists on at least two different levels. (Maybe more?) There is "reality", which might be ultimately unknowable in this world. You're talking about THEM being tethered? In my best guess at reality, I think there's a chance that 'God" might refuse to forgive someone if I refuse to forgive them. I'd like to think God is smarter than to leave that up to mere mortals, but there's a couple passages in scripture that suggest it, so I take it pretty seriously. The way I handle that, in my own head is, "God, I know you want the chance to forgive them. That's ok with me. If they ask for forgiveness and make things right with you, I'm good with that, even if I never know it happened." Meanwhile, I feel ok with hanging on to what ever feelings I feel. I kicked the decision upstairs and I'm truly good with that. If my version of reality is close to accurate, then that form of forgiveness seems like it should work.

Now, on a different level, I can see where a person might need to 'know' they are forgiven in order to feel free to move from this world to what ever comes next. My dad, towards the end of his life, worried a lot about whether or not he'd been a good enough parent. I told him I knew he loved me and that I knew he'd done the best he knew how to do and that, as far as I was concerned, that was ok. I meant it. Could he have done some things better? Well, that's complicated. There were things that could have been done better, but I'm not sure he was capable of doing them. If he had been, he would have. I think he saw that as a form of forgiveness, although I don't think there was anything he needed to be forgiven for. It was important to me that he know we were ok and it seemed important to him. My mom was completely different. She was a narc and didn't think there was anything she needed to be forgiven for. Period. There was no point in talking about any issues because, the way she saw it, the only issues in the room were mine. You can't really grant absolution to someone who believes they're perfect, can you? Given the opportunity, I would have done what I could, but there wasn't an opportunity. If I had to bet, I'd bet there wouldn't have been an opportunity if she'd been awake either. How that works in the afterlife is an interesting question, but falls under the heading of 'not my problem' and I hope to be sure that kind of attitude never IS my problem.

But then there's the idea of you being tethered to them, or the past, or regrets, or what ever. That's different too. There, I don't know that I see a clear right or wrong, it's what ever works. Part of me keeps suggesting I should have felt grief when my mom died. All I really felt was relief. I guess I'm sorry that's the way it was, but that's the way it was. It's too complicated to beat myself up for not feeling something I don't feel because the person I don't feel it for didn't know how to bond with her child.

What do YOU think about your own situation?

 

[lostforgottensoul]

@Recovery4Me, everyone reacts to grief differently and grieves differently and there is grief in this for me. There is much grief for that little girl that still resides in me (not DID) and the loss of so much.

My mom bonded with me when I was very young (a baby, a toddler, a small child up to at least 5) and because of that, there is SO many mixed emotions for me. SO many emotions that are at their most extreme and intensity as when they peek out and are felt under the surface i shut down or go completely numb; as like I feel nothing about her death when that couldnt be further from the truth.

In many ways, especially emotionally, ive regressed to a child. I feel 6 or 7, maybe younger, when I can still drive and work and pay bills etc. My emotions are young. My actions in many ways are young. My thoughts are young.

Its a large mountian im climbing while being waste high in shit like quick sand. But what Ive learned is to not fight. When you fight in quick sand you sink faster. Im letting what comes come. Im letting it sit there. Im investigating it. Trying to learn about it. Figure out what it is. Just letting it be there.

And its helped, a bit that i dove into DBT the best I could when she was dying. And i did the best i could to not let my family emotionally tear me to pieces.

But the best advice I can give is to do what you feel is right, in your gut, for you. Dont bend to pressure. Stand strong on that decision, which ever it is. And then let what comes come. Let it be there, dont fight it. Its a process and my life spun for a bit and thats ok too. We are here if you need us. Its a process that takes as long as it takes. :hug:

 

[Recovery4Me]

I talk to the ground....

I speak to the ground too as when I have visited my once loving, now deceased Grandmother and my beloved daughter. But then again, I hold conversations looking at the night sky, within walks of nature or while clutching my Bible at times. As you may or may not know- many peoples within China go to visit their ancestors on a special day while regularly holding conversations to those whom passed within their place of rest. So I do not find you 'weird' at all, but extremely beautiful within your open heart dialogs to that of your resting family members.
(((hugs)) if you accept

I had gone to the hospital to ask for her forgiveness and to tell her that I had forgiven her.

Very courageous, humble and of a noble act. My hat is off to you.

What do YOU think about your own situation?

I need to stand still, take in what others here are offering, then pray on it for self acceptance and/or further guidance. Thank you lil' buddha :p for so much to chew on. xX

Dont bend to pressure. Stand strong on that decision, which ever it is.

(((hugs))) I am listening to your story and you are most definitely heard.


~Thank you everyone for your gift of narratives and wisdom.

 

[shimmerz]

Myself personally, after all I have experienced in these years, I have come to a conclusion. The body is just a vessel. I can attach to those that I feel are wanting or needing me, and who I feel wish me no harm, spiritually.

I can love from afar. I chose not to hate from afar. I don't believe that I must forgive, but instead do more of an indifferent gig with those that I have experienced as soul crushers. I wish nobody harm but I don't necessarily send good wishes to everyone. There is a freedom I have come to when it comes to those that have harmed me and cannot see the damage that they have wreaked.

As far as I am concerned, this whole 'right thing to do' is a social construct. The universe is a force beyond our mortal comprehension. Contact her through that means if you decide that is good for you. Anything else, I suggest, may be an internal need to placate those who fall for the constructs.

Whether you go to the hospital or not is neither here nor there, imho. It is all about what makes you comfortable in either sending one off in peace, or leaving one to their own devices and wishes them well with no harm no foul intentions involved.

Peace to you my friend.

Shimmerz

 

[Deleted member 12723]

@Recovery4Me I will let you know how I dealt with the forgiveness or not but it took me so many years. It is written that if you go to your abuser and let them know what wrong they have done and they sincerely aplologize and change to show you that it is meant then forgiveness is so easy.

But there can be no forgiveness for an abuser who thinks that they did nothing wrong. One time my dad said that if he had it to do over again, he would not change a thing and that pretty much got me off of his hook

Whatever you choose with be the right thing for you I truly believe.:hug:

 

[Freedomfighter]

When your abuser-parent is near the throws of death- there are so many ways to handle this situatio...

Do not for one second let anyone push you into the guilt of conceding your life to a monster. I said good bye to my abusive father way before he passes. I do not in any way want to be connected to this monster, especially now since I am being shown how each and every one of his acts was a devious way of getting the attention of his victim, me and my poor mom who just passed. I knew this had to happen this way, and believe me when I visited the last time there was no remorse on his side. So why would a victim forgive an abuser that shows absolutely no remorse? Makes sense when you totally stay away from an abuser. I have seen many types of different abusers, strangers included that attempted to force themselves into my life.

Used to people who spew poison because they can not measure up, ta dah, turalu

 

[Recovery4Me]

@shimmerz Goodness do I love your heart, mind and spirit. We are one within your post. I knew there was a reason that we journey together in so many areas.:hug: Blessings and peace to you with sincere thanks for your offer.

Whatever you choose with be the right thing for you I truly believe

You have often given me courage and such pearls of wisdom. Thank you dear friend for so many things you have offered me along these years.

@Freedomfighter I am so sorry for your pain. Have you found some peace as of yet? (((hugs))) if you accept and respect for your extension of post. Thank you for your offer.

 

[The Albatross]

R4Me, you really are spot on when you said in your opening post, "there are so many ways to handle this situation, but none of my choices sit well within." But of course you know that when presented with a stressor, it does take assessment and self examination and yes - acceptance when there is no clear way to be at peace with difficult decisions. Death - of an abuser or otherwise almost never "sits well" with anyone. It is a process, but of course you know that as well.

When presented with choices, my own default is most always the way that will at best give me peace after the passing, or if that is unattainable the way that my own character, integrity and peace can be sustained. If the first two filters fail then it becomes a matter of the lightest burden that I may voluntarily bear after self assessment and in light of the dying person's needs. Be careful the burden of decisions you consider to bear and weigh and examine them against the truth of your values, character and integrity. “Duty is heavy as a mountain, death is light as a feather.” ~ Robert Jordan ... OR.... “Your burden is not to clear your conscience but to learn how to bear the burdens on your conscience.” ~ T.S. Eliot

The death of a past abuser emotionally conjures up all manner of complications however if you can use management for that, it becomes simply or more simply how to deal with and what to do about this present situation/this impending death.

 

[Poofycat]

There are so many "shoulds" that are expected when a close family member dies, and the feelings of the people left behind are rarely taken into account. Imposed by both family and society at large.

You should mourn your parent.
You should forgive your parent no matter what.
You should visit them on their deathbed.
You should feel grief.
You should present your grief in appropriate way.

You know what? f*ck that. It's not fair. We do all this work to heal ourselves and practice self care in our everyday lives, but we are ostracized when we that self care goes against what others think we "should" do. I have a feeling you already know what is best for you @Recovery4Me. It's struggling with the "shoulds" from your family, and maybe your own compassion that wants to be able to give your mother closure, but can't because she has done nothing to earn it, that is muddying things up.

 

[Recovery4Me]

@Poofycat Yes, in one manner, there is truth for me, within what you offer. I am actually struggling with shoulds (which is a form of cognitive distortions).

However the second part is my deep concern for the spiritual tethering of unfinished karma or saddened limbo souls. As well at one time, I had studied to be a Chaplain within an architectural master piece of an seminary. However, as laws changed and the name of "Jesus" could not be used within some public settings involving the person's passing... I did not complete the calling.

My inner rub, is do I bring her to "knock and ask" for forgiveness and lead her to a form of cleansing, healing or is my own need of protection greater than her need of hearing the 'word' and forgiveness. I did this for my father. Therefore, I am confused and saddened that my mental state does not match my heart's spirit.

So you see ... for me, it is an ethical dilemma... and one that I may face with my Higher Power or God at the end of my time on this Earth. I am leaning on prayer and trust of my faith for an answer. I am not 'freezing or fawning' but staying very still inside to listen during contemplative prayer.

@The Albatross ... do you understand some of my crux? Thank you for your time btw ...you words always hold food for thought. (((hugs)))

 

[Poofycat]

@Recovery4Me I certainly didn't mean that dealing with the "shoulds" is the only issue you're struggling with, and I'm sorry if you interpreted my post in that way.

Your spiritual conflict is interesting to me. I'm not religious at all, so I read that conflict a bit as another "should" imposed by the outside. But of course, if you have a deep belief then that's not true. I also have a question about this bit:

do I bring her to "knock and ask" for forgiveness and lead her to a form of cleansing, healing or is my own need of protection greater than her need of hearing the 'word' and forgiveness.

Is it your responsibility to lead her to a form of cleansing and healing? If she actually needed forgiveness don't you think she would have done something to earn it? What do you think her reaction would be if you went to see her and attempted to forgive her?

Please don't feel you need to answer my questions. And I apologize if I'm misinterpreting the spiritual/religious stuff.