Woman In Combat Arms...

[JarHed]

Is there no such thing anymore as selfless service ?

Hey Shogun

Nice post man, you brought out some very good points. I feel like you and I think many perhaps even most in the military do. It's always unfortunate that the non-hackers and such seem to get all the press. Guess that's what makes the news.

It's true as well that the nature of war itself has changed since I was in and I'm sure it will continue to as well. The answer to the question you've posed can only be answered by the individual serving. I hope there always will be others like that.

Jar

 

[tho9900]

Non Hacker is not race/sex/sexual orientation specific.. and dammit I am sticking a sock in my mouth right now cuz I am kinda feeling peaceful because I know Nala is coming home with me tomorrow.. (my dog) ... not gonna keep commenting..

 

[Wagon]

When you start to get personal freedom mixed up with gender, race and creed things are bound to go pear shaped. Setting a formerly discriminated against group up as "special" and "equal" generally steps on the toes of another group. I think my only point being was:

The ladies tees in golf are at that position for a reason.

Midgets or wait...."Little People" are not in the NBA.

Most sports are segregated along gender lines. Can't think of a pro one that's not.

Good luck with your new sheep tho9900.

 

[combatgoldfish]

"man's best friend" :)

 

[Jimmy1]

The ladies tees in golf are at that position for a reason.

Who was that pro female golfer who took on the guys and played from the guys tee's???

 

[Wagon]

Annika Sørenstam. Swedish. 2003. Missed the cut. But then went on to beat a bunch of high ranked guys in a skins match finishing 2nd.

 

[Squirt]

As a woman i really dont think they should serve in the infantry, Apart from the scientific fact that we are build differently (yes some women might be able to bench/carry as much as a man but can they still do it when they've got 'on') its the psychological effect that comes from having a woman in danger, more men will put themselves at risk trying to save her even if she cant be saved. I was the only woman in my tp where i had no problems working but i did note when i was on the night shift and the kidnap threat went up inside the wire one of the guys would come and sit with me.

 

[tho9900]

ok Squirt thank you, you helped me look at it in a different way... Infantry I can see them not deploying with... I guess I was looking at the big picture about women in combat...

Growing up with 2 sisters and my mom while my dad was deployed with the Marines, I think I developed a different slant.. I wasn't afraid to go toe to toe with them when they got up in my face, and I let them fall if they needed to.. but ya.. pity the fool that looked at one of my sisters cross eyed, so ya... I am clear on my thoughts now..

I guess that's what I needed to hear...

 

[JarHed]

Hey Squirt

Great post, and food for thought as to perhaps how these things can impact the combat dynamic.

I was thinking about this issue last night and I remembered an experience that may be relevent. Or at least explain my opinion about these things. Years ago I was a Super on a residential home site. I was in charge of the operation and all that went into it. I also had to hire a lot of the help.

One of the groups that's very important to the smooth and continued functioning of a site are laborers. With out them materials don't get to the people working in the homes, the site doesn't get cleaned up and a miriad of other things. It's a tough job. Finding and keeping people is almost as hard. Most of the guys were either druggies or drunks that would work till they got a pay check then they were gone.

So as a way to screen some of them I started to use a test. It was based soley on ones physical abilities. That was the skill most needed by that group. Behind the trailer that I used as an office were some materials. One thing was a lolly column. It's a steel pipe about 4 inches in diameter and filled with concrete and about 7 feet long. It's used to support the beams in the cellar. It weighs about 100lbs. anyone applying for the laborers job had to do this; pick it up walk from the trailer up a small hill to the first stop sign, about 70 yards away, turn around and come back. Without dropping it, stopping, or letting it touch the ground. Hard, but necessary if you were going to be doing that job all day long.

Many people just refused and some guys just couldn't do it. Many thought it was unfair. I have to mention that when asked if I could do it, I would give a demontration that usually stopped them from saying anything about it being unfair.

I did have one young lady that applied for the job. She was a college student and wanted a job for the summer. I told her about the difficulties of the job and the test and she still agreed. She passed the test and I hired her. One of the best workers I ever had. I did have a few other women apply but when I told them about the test I was called 'sexist'. That's when I would call Sally and have her come to the trailer. They couldn't believe that she could do it. I never asked her to show them, she didn't have to prove it to them. Guess the point is, for me anyway, that fair is fair. If you can do the job than OK. Guess I'm just saying the same thing as before. Just an interesting story.

What the situation is in today's military in regard to men and women serving together I truly haven't got a clue. Makes me feel a bit out of it, not knowing. Thanks for everyone's input, there's always a lot to still learn and think about.

I guess I've always tried to be a fair person and believe in equal rights. Guess part of that is the hope that I'll get mine as well. It's not a simple or easy question to come up with a good answer for. Maybe only time will tell.

Jar

 

[tho9900]

ya Jar I was thinking about my sister when she and her husband owned a paint contracting business... 4 feet 10 (and a half she says, think she is trying to squeeze that in lol) 80 pounds but she could carry 2 5 gallon paint buckets up the stairs without even breaking a sweat.. guess it depends on the situation..

 

[Sarg]

When I was in basic, we went to the rifle range to qualify. When done we marched back to the barracks and commenced other duties. A couple of hours later, a couple of NCOs came and got one of our guys. A couple of hours later, our guy came back and packed him duffle, cleaned out his locker, didn't say a word and left with the NCOs.

The whole barracks was lit up with questions about what happened to this guy. Well, a bunch of us wound up doing 2nd Phase of Basic and we met up him later. Turns out this guy could drive tacks with a rifle, any rifle. He said they told him his job would be to attend all the National Matches in competition. That was it! No tech school, no Nam, just shooting matches.

Some people, genders, races and even sometimes belief, do better at certain jobs than others. Match the person to the job, not vice-versa. The front lines usually aren't the best place for women but there are certainly jobs that women can do better, faster and cheaper the we men.

My .02

Sarg

 

[Need an Oasis]

Opening a whole new can of worms possibly.

When I was in Basic, the cadre treated us women like a nuisance. Showing/teaching us anything, weapons-related mostly, we got the attitude: Yeah, well, we can show you, but you will never need it anyway, so don't worry about getting it right. Any in-depth questions we had, or trying to get more of an explanation on any given subject, was treated with a big, exasperated sigh and a demeanor of "ok, if I have to..." Then you are deployed, and in the shit, because cadre in basic and AIT never took you seriously to begin with and couldn't be bothered.