Automatic Lies

[grit]

I know I had to lie a lot as a kid for pure survival reasons.

Did this change with the family? If it has, then that is your motivation, they changed so you can too. If not, then perhaps you are still on survival mode and rightfully protecting yourself.
Either way, you may be spilling into your other life and not know it so best take it seriously and have a therapist to help you as Zoogal noted above.

 

[Kubash16]

Did this change with the family?

What does this mean?

spilling into your other life

This too, not sure what ya mean.

 

[Kubash16]

What worst do you think she is likely to do / what can she do that would harm you that bad?

I had to really think about this one and honestly the answer is nothing.

She won’t do anything except play never ending guilt trips that I fall for every time.

 

[grit]

What does this mean?



This too, not sure what ya mean.

Clarifications:
If you are lying and unable to lie when you are with your family, and as you stated before you learned to lie in order to survive in the same environment, maybe you need to lie in order to still survive in this family. In short if your family situations was unsafe and you lied and still unsafe, you may continue to lie. If your family situation has changed and there is no need to lie anymore and you are still lying automatically, then that could mean, there is something else and maybe your therapist, who knows you better, can help you. Why are you holding on to a behaviour you already become aware of? Unless of course maybe you need to survive still which is valid and good.

On my second comment about spilling, if you are unable to stop lying, do you think maybe you are also unable to stop lying to others outside of your family? if yes, then there is a significant reason for you to really face the underlying issues sooner than later so all your relationships do not suffer because you are still using lying as a protection that is not needed today.

In my personal experience, I learned how to tell the truth to myself when alone before I could be more truthful to others but it took significant events to show me I needed to be more assertive about my boundaries. Prior, I thought I was being polite and nice when I lied to make others easy around me but I realized I was then affecting my boundaries and safety and practiced with safe people how to say what I think without going overboard or under-reacting.

hope this clarifies.

 

[Kubash16]

Thank you for clarifying @grit, that does help.

I don’t have this problem outside of immediate family. Like I mentioned earlier it’s like my brain knows strangers are safe enough to be honest with.

Thank you all.

 

[Kubash16]

So a small update.

ExH still tries to call me and 9 times out of 10 I ignore it, cause I have nothing left to say. I’m very much past that shitshow we called a marriage. But my mom still sends him money and talks to him all the time. I answered his call tonight and told him the truth about the storage unit. He’s mad but he says he gets it and all’s good.

The crappy part? I’ve told the truth to the person it affects most and was able to spit it out right away and calmly. But I’m freaking terrified right now of him saying something to my mom and her getting angry with me over it.

Goodness I’m f*cked up. Not scared of telling my ex that all his things are gone but terrified of telling my mother that when it doesn’t even affect her.

 

[scout86]

She won’t do anything except play never ending guilt trips that I fall for every time.

Maybe there are better ways to deal with the guilt trip that you haven't tried yet?

 

[Kubash16]

Maybe there are better ways to deal with the guilt trip that you haven't tried yet?

Right now I pretty much react by shutting down (going silent/doing my own thing and letting her just go on and on and trying not to listen) or I go hide in my room (which comes with its own set of issues, why aren’t you with the family? Why do you not want to be around us anymore? I might as well not come home anymore because no one loves me, etc). Or I take off to the zoo, or wherever and just stay out all day. Usually this works better than others it’s just not always feasible.

 

[Friday]

The crappy part? I’ve told the truth to the person it affects most and was able to spit it out right away and calmly. But I’m freaking terrified right now of him saying something to my mom and her getting angry with me over it.

1. Try considering the idea of treating her like she has Dementia. Meaning she’s going to be like herself most of the time, but is also going to go off on crazy rants about BS that has nothing to do with her, shouting, guilt trips, total nonsense... that has nothing to do with you. It’s just the dementia. So one appreciates the good times, and just sort of tunes out the crazy; rather than taking it on the chin, and taking it personally. Doesn’t mean it won’t hurt sometimes, but it’s more of a sad-for-them hurt. Because they’re not seeing things how they really are, and getting mad over things that don’t rate anger, and missing out on what could be a lovely day... because they’re addled/confused/intractable (can’t see sense / utterly convinced of ABC XYZ). >>> Not so very far from the truth, is it? <<< It also transforms ‘hiding to avoid being in trouble’ to taking some time and space to enjoy yourself without the stress of caring for someone whose mind is going. Getting some distance so you can clear your head, return and feel secure in yourself & your decisions... regardless of how irrational she’s being.

It’s a subtle shift, but a profound one.

2. Even if you weren’t in the habit of lying to her to keep her happy / avoid the stress of her meltdowns? She asked you a question when you were half asleep. After waking, you spoke to your ex to answer HIS question, correctly. As it doesn’t concern her, she was simply passing along a message, there’s no reason to fill her in. <<< My mom does exactly this kind of thing (gets furious about not being told BEFORE the people involved are told, as well as 12 other things, equally nonsensical -like not being told before I made the decision to let it lapse, not being asked for help when she’d have said no, not being come to for “comfort” / read being blamed, belittled, chastised, scorned- and oh so much et cetera. Even the fact that I made a decision about my own life will piss her off. Not being told of the decision is really just frosting on the cake. I love her dearly, and she’s a wonderful person in most ways, but she has no boundaries. Even if she agrees with the decision I made, which is rare, she’ll get mad I made it in the first place, and absolutely furious about not being told of it.), ....and nope! :p Logic and rationality will not appease her one iota. It’s not about appeasing her. It’s about reminding myself. I made a rational decision, and I stand by it.

 

[Mach123]

What a great thread I lol at the title. I knew right away what that meant.

All the armchair analysis is silly though it's just people, and where they are on the scale (pick one.). High low, up down, left right. Or on the bell shaped curve.

I remember in the church someone told me once "I'm not surprised at the behavior, I'm surprised it's not worse." Well, it's getting worse. The church people were the absolute worst lol.

Of course everyone "works" you if you let them. My therapist used a new word for it this week which i disassociate or can't remember because I call it dominance. Fighting with words is passive aggressive, or leads to it.

So, whatever it takes to get them off your back is my advice. "All's fair in love and war," "Dead men don't bite," take no prisoners. Give no quarter, doesn't sound like anyone is going to give you any. Then they'll respect you. I know how easy it is to say, but hard to do.

People become emotional vampires, you can't have mercy with vampires, family or not. They just turn it against you.

When my wife brought my mother back into my life without my permission and she started the BS with me, (mom dear old mom) I got her outside in the driveway where no one could hear me and I spelled it out in language she understood. (I wouldn't ever speak like that in front of my wife and kids lol)

I told her if I heard another word I'd make sure she never saw any of us again which was a threat of course, in the foulest language I could think of. Meaning I'd "expell her from the group or family."

Death sentence in other words. She behaved fairly well after that. We had the pleasure of her company for the next 7 or 8 years I think, then she passed away.

The thing that's hard for me is doing it and still being around them, which is possible. It's just i really have to have my emotions/symptoms in check?

I sympathise. Family, can't live with or without them. Actually you can live without them if you wait long enough they tend to die off. Sorry you have to put up with it.

Here is a quote from the maharaj lol. His writings are in "I am that" which is free online. I opened to this chapter 72, after reading you. : )

"It has nothing to do with effort, just turn away, look between the thoughts, rather than at the thoughts. When you happen to walk in a crowd, you do not fight every man you meet — you just find your way between."

 

[Kubash16]

1. Try considering the idea of treating her like she has Dementia. Meaning she’s going to be like herself most of the time, but is also going to go off on crazy rants about BS that has nothing to do with her, shouting, guilt trips, total nonsense... that has nothing to do with you. It’s just the dementia. So one appreciates the good times, and just sort of tunes out the crazy; rather than taking it on the chin, and taking it personally. Doesn’t mean it won’t hurt sometimes, but it’s more of a sad-for-them hurt. Because they’re not seeing things how they really are, and getting mad over things that don’t rate anger, and missing out on what could be a lovely day... because they’re addled/confused/intractable (can’t see sense / utterly convinced of ABC XYZ). >>> Not so very far from the truth, is it? <<< It also transforms ‘hiding to avoid being in trouble’ to taking some time and space to enjoy yourself without the stress of caring for someone whose mind is going. Getting some distance so you can clear your head, return and feel secure in yourself & your decisions... regardless of how irrational she’s being.

It’s a subtle shift, but a profound one.

2. Even if you weren’t in the habit of lying to her to keep her happy / avoid the stress of her meltdowns? She asked you a question when you were half asleep. After waking, you spoke to your ex to answer HIS question, correctly. As it doesn’t concern her, she was simply passing along a message, there’s no reason to fill her in. <<< My mom does exactly this kind of thing (gets furious about not being told BEFORE the people involved are told, as well as 12 other things, equally nonsensical -like not being told before I made the decision to let it lapse, not being asked for help when she’d have said no, not being come to for “comfort” / read being blamed, belittled, chastised, scorned- and oh so much et cetera. Even the fact that I made a decision about my own life will piss her off. Not being told of the decision is really just frosting on the cake. I love her dearly, and she’s a wonderful person in most ways, but she has no boundaries. Even if she agrees with the decision I made, which is rare, she’ll get mad I made it in the first place, and absolutely furious about not being told of it.), ....and nope! :p Logic and rationality will not appease her one iota. It’s not about appeasing her. It’s about reminding myself. I made a rational decision, and I stand by it.

Definitely going to try this today especially.

She’s a dementia patient.

She’s a dementia patient.

She’s a dementia patient.

 

[Changing4Best]

I have an occasional speech imparment and when it acts up, I also tend to exaggerate a lot. I guess it is some kind of nervous reaction? I suppose I should mention it to my T.