Not picking up on empathy in therapy

[Justmehere]

This is a pattern with multiple therapists. I used to get a sense of empathy. Not anymore. I like tell it as it is therapists and I’m sure they care or they wouldn’t be doing this profession. But I don’t sense empathy. Just a challenge. If that.

Turns out I need a therpaist to be empathetic and to be able to pick up on it. Any suggestions how to find that and connect to it?

 

[joeylittle]

Is there a person (or type of person) you find yourself attracted to, in terms of wanting support and empathy from them?

Another way to ask that is, think about the people you have known that you were most easily able to receive comfort from. Is there any kind of pattern?

 

[Justmehere]

people you have known that you were most easily able to receive comfort from. Is there any kind of pattern?

I worry this muscle to receive comfort is severely atrophied and stuck behind some big walls. I can think of those people that I would feel that way in the past but I can’t imagine feeling that now.

There was a moment a week ago with someone, a doctor, and they said something about really pulling for me. It was so genuine, it really meant a lot. It was helpful to know someone actually really cared like that. The doc wasn’t sure what to do and didn’t have easy answers but the moment of hey, really pulling for you was so helpful. Weirdly so. I think the idea that someone is in it with me, fighting the battle along the same side with me, matters a lot.

 

[Rumors]

I worry this muscle to receive comfort is severely atrophied and stuck behind some big walls. I can think of those people that I would feel that way in the past but I can’t imagine feeling that now.

There was a moment a week ago with someone, a doctor, and they said something about really pulling for me. It was so genuine, it really meant a lot. It was helpful to know someone actually really cared like that. The doc wasn’t sure what to do and didn’t have easy answers but the moment of hey, really pulling for you was so helpful. Weirdly so. I think the idea that someone is in it with me, fighting the battle along the same side with me, matters a lot.

Have you tried sharing this with your therapist? Perhaps they have the empathy portion but didn't feel as if you were ready to accept it just yet? Good luck. I have an empath for a therapist and she lets me know a lot that she is there for the longhaul. I don't know why sometimes but I am grateful.

 

[Friday]

Is there empathy to pick up?

Sometimes people tick all the boxes. Sometimes they just tick some.

If I’m remembering correctly? You had one helluva therapy hunt. To find ANYONE who had skills you need. Not just want, but need.

I agree with you, 100%, about the sheer f*cking magic involved when someone says exactly the right thing, at exactly the right time, much less as a baseline. It can also cast a shadow? On those relationships that soooooo do NOT tick all the right boxes. The trick, IME? Is in not trying to make those other relationships more than they are, or to imagine they do, because I want more... but to find new relationships that meet a different understanding of what I need/want. Nope. Not a “just add water” kind of task. But coming to know myself, and what I want out of life? Rarely is.

 

[Justmehere]

I don’t get much of a sense anyone is “on my side.” Or is there as “support.” Even when friends show kindness I tend to feel stressed out by it. The thing that changed it for me is when I am able to believe someone isn’t about to humiliate me or be a boundary busting adversary. I seem to have lost sense of that.

A few very confrontational/dismissive therapists and an asshat of a pastor haven’t helped. I am not sure there is empathy there to pick up.

A long time and very patient and kind friend commented how I expressed ample gratitude but didn’t really trust any kindness from them. They were not wrong. I explained I’m waiting for the price I’ll have to pay or the humiliation I’ll be put through from everyone and that no, it’s not fair to them and I don’t know what to do. He kept pointing out 98 percent of people are ok. It’s the 2 percent I’m stuck on. Yeah. But when the two percent who are in authority as helpers who just tear me apart?

But the moments I can actually believe someone is not about to humiliate or degrade me... it changes things. Expressions of kindness go from stressful to sometimes actually feeling good.

 

[joeylittle]

I can think of those people that I would feel that way in the past

That's OK - in a way, it's part of the point of the question.

We all have an instinct about people. I think what we tend to forget about is how the inputs for that instinct were formed. For folks dealing with trauma, we can become keenly aware of who we will have an instinctual bias against. And at this point, you're definitely aware that your past relationships with therapists have failed - so, anyone in the category "therapist" is already starting on rocky ground and will need to earn your trust. And that's OK, that's their job.

But it might be helpful for you to think about the archetypes that will have a slightly easier time of earning your trust. I don't think it's the only answer to the puzzle of finding this person, but it's a piece of it.

 

[grit]

This is really a powerful statement:

But the moments I can actually believe someone is not about to humiliate or degrade me... it changes things. Expressions of kindness go from stressful to sometimes actually feeling good.

Thank you.

 

[Kintsugi]

If you have a current therapist, could you ask them about this point blank?

You’ve really been through the wringer interpersonally. I’ve seen you face adversity in so many contexts that just really felt to me like the shit icing on your traumatized cake. Truly, my heart has gone out to you over and over as people have screwed you over in remarkably uncalled for and unexpected ways.

I’m not trying to be an ass who’s like, Damn you’ve just gotten so screwed! And I’m sorry if I come off that way. I’m driving at something else: I promise.

My response to empathy from a mental health professional is to internally hiss, and I wish I could leap into the top corner of their office like a scared Spider-Man. I’ve been told that in actuality, I press myself into whatever I’m sitting on as if it might mercifully swallow me.

My point is, though, a halfway decent T can smell that aversion on me, see it on my face, in the rigidity of my body, hear it in the cadence and pitch of my voice. So usually they avoid overwhelming me with anything I could read as overt empathy or compassion. My P actually f*cked with me about this recently, because he knows I’m absolutely phobic of feeling cared for, and he’s a total jerk (no, really, he is, but I like his blue pad so).

SO... maybe you’re giving off vibes like I do? And maybe your relationship with your T would be served well by a frank conversation of your needs?

 

[Justmehere]

@Simply Simon - something you wrote clicked something for me. This whole thread actually.

I am in a pattern and I want OUT OF THIS PATTERN.

This empathy part. I can do it, to a point, and then I just can not. It's TOO MUCH. Too close. Every therapist I have ever seen long enough to run into this, and I always seem to run into this, says it surprises them.

It's confusing everyone offline because it's not happening with friends, co-workers, etc. People in my life offline seem baffled I would run into this issue. So many types of relationships work ok enough in my life. Helpers in an authoritarian role (doctors, therapsts...) different thing. It's not a classic authority thing. I do fine with bosses and the like.

I'm really pleased, if that is even the right word, I work well with my medical team for some time. I have worked so hard to be able to do it. When I can't handle things, we have a working understanding that is on me to let them know and they will in return let me take a moment, regroup and carry on (unless I'm dying but that's not relevant.) I don't even have to take breaks anymore most of the time.

But in therapy? What is the kind of therapist that can be kind and straight forward but not chase me or keep pushing me when I repeatedly say I need space or some other boundary?

 

[Ronin]

Sounds to me you might need more detailed boundary & communication conversation with the therapist?

About where is the fine line between something that can be pushed toward / against... and something that can't and needs them backing off, immediately.

In ways you don't feel abandoned by them backing, or run over by that hit reverse.

And a conversation not only where these lines are... but how to tell.

And what is best done / not done when you can't tell. Either to them or internally.

 

[Justmehere]

Thing is, we keep having those conversations at session 1. And I bring it up after that. And then... it doesn't stick.

Every therapist expresses surprise when it falls apart. They say are surprised. Baffled. I keep thinking... how could you NOT know? I keep SAYING IT, walking out of sessions to hold the boundary... etc.

Therapists frankly seem enamored at first with all my "insight" and ability to communicate - they praise it - that I think they overlook the "THIS IS A REAL THING." It's like a learning disabled kid who is super bright too. (Which I also have personal experience with on a cognitive level.) Those kids have the hardest time getting real help for the disability. They are told try harder much longer than the kid who is globally disabled. Essentially, I think that's part of what is happening. I have some strengths therapists like, and yet those don't overcome the real battle they overlook as yes being THAT bad and that real. Then when they get it, they tell me it surprises them.